As most of you know, a Mary Sue is essentially a power fantasy (a grossly written one at that) which is probably what makes them so tempting to amateur authors. That said, I'm willing to go out on a limb here and say that probably most of us here have written a Mary Sue at least once in our lives. I know I have. Interestingly enough, she managed to outgrow her Sue origins. Hell, she even managed to escape the confines of the fanfic world.
Has this ever happened to any of you? Have you guys ever had a good OC that originated as a Mary Sue waaaaay back in the day?
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Mary Sue turned Good OC? by
on 2014-02-01 04:11:00 UTC
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Hm by
on 2014-02-02 20:12:00 UTC
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Well, I dunno if this counts, but I'm currently beta-reading a fic that started out with some very Sue-y characters, but they've since become more logical and well-written, I think.
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YES. by
on 2014-02-02 04:51:00 UTC
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Her name was Jacqueline Lantern and she was a Rise of the Guardians Sue. She was Spirit of Halloween. She was an angsty!Sue until I looked back and realized how much fun writing psychopaths is.
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Actually... by
on 2014-02-02 00:41:00 UTC
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I was working on a story like that. It's not for my Agents, which I will eventually submit...
It's about a Sue who gains self-awareness about what she is doing and the whole hierarchy of Suvians...
I could really use a beta, is anyone willing to help me out? -
Actually, Yes... sort of by
on 2014-02-01 21:48:00 UTC
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Of course, the things that were wrong with my Mary Sue were all the added things (like cool stuff TM) that were taking away from having an actual plot and characterization, so once I dumped the merchandise and worked with her a few more years, I got a character who turned up under different names in five different unfinished stories. She's the mother of one of my main characters in this year's mystery novel, actually. (And although he's nearly unrecognizable now compared to when I was twelve, her elf prince boyfriend stuck with her all this time and is her husband & the MC's father.)
I've had those two since I was twelve or so, and I'm turning twenty two on the seventeenth, so it's safe to say that they've changed a lot. I also learned quite a bit in the intervening years.
(For bonus points, Sierra started as an Abhorsen-but-not because I didn't know fan-fiction existed at the time. At some point she returned to her origins and became a benevolent necromanceress who gives lost souls a voice so they can pass on. She also did some time as Gandalf the Grey's apprentice, under the name Yara Greencloak, and has been transplanted to at least three original worlds. :D) -
Well, my story is a little more complex... by
on 2014-02-01 16:54:00 UTC
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A few years ago, when I was just starting out with writing, I made a horrid little God-Modder Stu. After a while, I forgot about him. A while after that, I realized exactly what I'd been writing, and in horror, annihilated the story from every database I could find it on.
Then, after I discovered the PPC, the idea of that Stu resurfaced, and I was tempted to bring him back just to kill him. But instead I decided to give his character a complete overhaul, and turned him into Agent Legacy, who has permission, but hasn't been written yet.
So. Er… Yeah, I suppose that counts. :) -
I am not entirely sure it's all power fantasy. by
on 2014-02-01 15:44:00 UTC
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Because most Sues tend to be surprisingly powerless. Unless it helps them get their "hott man".
Or, you know, maybe it's because I work in the BBC Sherlock verse pretty often. Sues there have a very common 'power' termed superdeduction, which, as we all know, is honed through observation and is most definitely not genetic.
Anyway. Most of my Agents are reformed Sues in a meta sense. Lori Starrett even had her own fic that almost got published disguised as a goodfic that was getting debunked by more blatant Sues, but only Trojie and Pads were aware of it since they looked it over and caught me before I published. And then from there it's a simple matter of just completely rewriting her backstory so that she doesn't originate from Middle-earth like previously, but from Earth with a keen interest in Tolkien, etc.
And Agent Eledhwen used to be way more Suvian as well. She was more or less a one-sided drama queen (or as I termed it, 'emo') and a cardboard foil to an Agent Lily who was, putting it nicely, hyperactive. A bit of that remains to this day in the form of Eledhwen's clone Lilith from the Mary Sue Factories, who got killed in IAHF1. -
Depends on the writer and their age by
on 2014-02-01 21:55:00 UTC
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I'm an odd duck because I started writing at seven, so most of my sues (everything I wrote prior to the age of sixteen, let's say,) were pretty much straight "I'mma save the world and everyone will be happy and like me!" power trips, with a little deus-angst-machina applied to the ones I wrote from eleven to fourteen.
I pretty much never shipped them with anyone, so they didn't tend to have lots of moments of powerlessness unless they were dramatically sacrificing themselves to save the world or some such. Of course, their friends or whoever had been on a side quest would turn up at the last second with a powerful healing potion and then the king would throw them a parade, after which they'd tip their inkeeper and ride off before dawn.
... Yeesh, I was a dramatic kid. -
*points at Agent!Sergio Turbo* by
on 2014-02-01 11:41:00 UTC
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He was a Gary Stu. Now his reaction to one is "kill him".
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PLUG! It's a Nume interlude! And it's interactive! by
on 2014-02-01 06:22:00 UTC
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So hey, it's officially February on Board time, and it will officially be February on my time by the time I get done writing this post, so I can finally publish this! Oh, and I redid my website, too! I've been slaving over it for the better part of a month, so please let me know what you think, especially if you spot anything that looks off or doesn't work.
Without further ado, I give you "Nume: Ten Years Thence," in which Area 51 is real. Or, more to the point, in which it is Nume's tenth anniversary as an agent and he's getting a party whether he likes it or not. And this is where the interactive bit comes in: if you want, and if your characters were around in 2013 (when this actually takes place), have them show up!
What I mean by that is, in your reply post, write a few lines in-character about them being there, maybe saying a few words to Nume (or Ilraen or Jenni if they prefer), maybe even giving a gift of some sort. I understand watches are traditional, but I'm kind of expecting... let's call it creativity from PPCers. *eg* They could be there because they got Jenni's mass e-mail (see story), or they could happen to be in the Cafeteria when the party happens, or they could hear the commotion from outside and come see what it's about. Up to you!
I'll write an in-character response if I think it would be entertaining, and feel free to reply to each other and RP. Please do not write my characters; it bugs me. Permission is not strictly needed, but I dunno how many people who don't yet have Permission are thinking of agents who would've been around last year, so... *shrug* {= /
If this goes over well, I'll put everything up as a bonus section to the story once all is said and done. (I reserve the right to edit for sense-making and leave out anything I don't like.) I'm going to be away for several days starting Wednesday afternoon, though, so if you want to interact, please reply sooner rather than later. Thanks! {= D
~Neshomeh -
And still more agents arrived. by
on 2014-02-04 20:12:00 UTC
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Most were humans of various departments, ages, sexes and genders, others were all number of alien creatures, and one was a vending machine. It, surprisingly, only used the word "meatbag" once when congratulating Nume.
One particular standout was a dark-skinned Sicilian man who looked to be somewhere near his early thirties, in a plush, comfortable-looking but formal suit, certainly not usual attire for a PPC agent at all, let alone one trying to relax. Basilico Andretti was grudgingly willing to admit that that might have been due to a lack of practise; if Nasira - and just where had she gone? - hadn't dragged him over here, the mass-email that came to his office's console might have gone read but ignored. It wouldn't have been out of dislike for anybody involved in this situation; it's hard to dislike people when you frankly have barely any idea who they are beyond what's in their files. No, it was more that few people really understood just how much paperwork went into keeping the DIA's Patrol Division running and effectively policing such a cheerfully anarchic community.
But here he was all the same, the weight of his gifts under one arm, his free hand covering one ear thanks to the sudden commotion from somebody's player piano. It sounded like it needed to be tuned up... with a sledgehammer. Eventually he made his way through the throng and to Nume's table, politely waiting until he wasn't engaged with anyone else before moving ahead.
"A decade's service is no small thing, Agent Supernumerary," he said, slowing down so the name wouldn't send his tongue tripping and rolling down a hill. "Please accept my congratulations, and these gifts."
After speaking, he gently placed his offerings on the table, a leather-bound hardcover book with no visible title atop a rosewood writing box with fluid brass inlay that ran over the wood in floral patterns. Gifts received, he gave Jenni and Ilraen a small nod as well.
"Nurse Robinson and Agent Ilraen-Aroline-Fothergill, I presume? I hope you're both well today." -
Late, as usual. by
on 2014-02-04 19:04:00 UTC
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Where there is Convenient Cake, there will also be Convenient Moochers. Agent Diocletian might have forcibly divorced herself from her Sue days--mainly by avoiding singing, shapewear, using the word 'pathetic' or allowing herself to be described as anything much beyond "oh, that one"--but she hadn't quite been able to conquer her need for sugar. The minute the cake appeared, she noticed it.
Then she noticed what was being celebrated, and it killed her mood somewhat. "Ai Elbereth," she muttered to Agent Suicide, who was sitting beside her eating a cheesy goat burrito. "Ten years. And he's from the Real World, too. I've never even seen the Real World."
"It's not all it's cracked up to be," Suicide said with his mouth full. "Colder and grayer. And there's no Universal Laws there, unless you count gravity."
"No wonder he's so twitchy, then." This from Diocletian, who looked like--"Hey! What did I say?"--nothing in particular, and certainly nothing beautiful or notable. Although there was a hint of chipmunk in her features. "Better. Anyway, he doesn't look too happy about it. That looks like good cake, but . . . maybe we should leave him alone."
"Nah. Got to give him his present, don't we?"
She shot a glance at Suicide. "You knew this was happening?"
"Jenni told me."
"Of course."
"And she sent a mass e-mail. What, you don't check your messages?"
"Not recently. Anyway, I thought you hated e-mail. How would you know about the message she sent?"
"I do hate e-mail, but I still check it. I kinda like watching Nigerian princes beg for my help." He finished his burrito and stood, pulling a little fabric-wrapped bundle out of his pocket. "C'mon, let's go say hi."
"Wait a second." Dio put a hand on his arm, less friendly and more restraining. "What did you get him?"
Suicide never blinked. "Ethnic spices."
"Ethnic spices."
"Yep."
"It's hemp, isn't it."
"May have a certain hemp-like quality, yeah."
With a sigh, she stood and followed Suicide over to where Nume was sitting. Scythians of his time had considered smoking hemp a religious duty--a way of communing with the dead, especially at royal funerals. She wasn't sure how Nume would react to that kind of present, though, considering that he a) wasn't Scythian, b) didn't like Suicide and c) seemed to be in some kind of personal hell. With cake.
"Happy anniversary," Su said cheerfully as he put down the packet on the table. "May your enemies fall before you, their fields be sown with salt and their women lament for your mercy." -
"Aw, jeez, you invited him?" by
on 2014-02-04 23:02:00 UTC
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Was the very mature complaint Nume made to Jenni when he saw Suicide on his way over.
Jenni gave him a flat look. "Like I'm going to throw a party with all of Headquarters but snub the man I'm sleeping with."
"Don't remind me!"
"Get over it! Just be polite and don't start anything, and it'll be over before you know it."
Nume gave a long-suffering sigh, but composed himself and managed not to snap anything sarcastic at the whole "lamenting women" thing. Instead, he grunted something that might have been a thank-you and unwrapped the cloth around the small bundle. Then he blinked, lifted it to his nose, and gave Suicide an interrogative—but surprisingly not hostile—look.
<What is it?> Ilraen asked.
"Not for you, if it's what I think it is," said Nume.
"Knowing Su? Definitely," Jenni chimed in. "Be careful. I don't think we have any reliable studies about interactions with Bleepstuff." She wasn't disapproving—more curious to see where this was going to go.
"Right. Let's just...." He wrapped the slightly dubious herb back in its cloth and slid it into his pocket. "Out of reach from small hands."
Jenni looked around at the dearth of children in the Cafeteria and raised her eyebrows.
<But what is it?> Ilraen asked, a slight hint of annoyance creeping into his mindvoice.
"I'll tell you when you're older," said Nume.
This did not help.
(( This took longer than I wanted. My cat decided to have a puking spell while I was writing it. Sorry. >.
~Neshomeh -
Suicide seemed unfazed . . . by
on 2014-02-05 06:48:00 UTC
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. . . by Nume's initial reaction. To be fair, the last significant length of time spent in each others' company had involved violence, vague sexual harassment, head injuries and the second-highest level of collective trauma in his own experience, so there was understandably some tension there. He seemed pleased that Nume hadn't rejected the 'ethnic spices' out of hand, and Diocletian let herself relax a little.
"Congratulations," she told Nume. "I didn't hear about this until thirty seconds ago, so I'm afraid I didn't get you anything . . . though the good news there is that I also didn't get you anything oversized or, uh, possibly contraband."
"It's not contraband if they don't know about it," Suicide said calmly. "Have a little faith, will you?" -
More agents show up... by
on 2014-02-04 04:27:00 UTC
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"Okay, so, um... Cindy, can you tell us exactly what it is we're doing here?"
Cindy shot a glance at Anneli as the two of them walked in. "Well, since it's Supernumerary's tenth anniversary, I just thought... well, you know."
Anneli grunted again, and then wiped her forehead. "So that's why you had us shove a player piano all the way here from... from... that weirdo's house in Paris?"
"Hey, it was the most authentic thing I could think of for the occasion," said Cindy. "Ever since Xanthus told me about it, I figured it'd make a good gift somehow."
"I totally don't think this is gonna work, but whatever," she said. "Besides, I think we both know you just wanna see your boyfriend again."
Cindy blushed furiously as Anneli said this. "Ilraen is not my boyfriend!" she replied snappily.
"Yeah, you keep telling yourself that," Anneli replied, clearly unconvinced. She then looked past the player piano, and suddenly composed herself. "Oh hey, I think it's him!"
Cindy immediately jumped up, glancing at where the andalite was in the room before bowing in front of Nume. "Um... hi," she said. "You probably don't know me, but I've met your partner Ilraen a couple of times. And... well, here I am, presenting you with a gift of a player piano."
Anneli sighed. "Like, we had to travel to early 20th Century France for this one," she said. She then glanced down at Cindy. "Don't ask her how she even heard of that Ballet Mécanique or whatever."
Cindy then nodded, starting the contraption on the player piano.
Three seconds later, complete chaos began to ring out from the strings of the player piano.
(( BTW, if you want a sense of Cindy's gift... well, just listen to the first minute of this video, and imagine it without any of the percussion: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_4fqNL1aAM Yeah, George Antheil can be a bit crazy like that. )) -
(( Dang, this really mucks up the timeline... )) by
on 2014-02-04 20:20:00 UTC
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(( Since this takes place before the Canon Library thing and Halloween. It hadn't occurred to me this would happen if your guys showed up. Oops. >.
As the player piano rolled up to the table, two of the three people holding court at it felt their jaws drop. The third didn't actually have a jaw as such, so he could only boggle.
"What," said Nume. Then he repeated it, just in case it hadn't been clear the first time. "What."
<Hello, Cindy!> Ilraen said, ignoring him. <What a marvelous gift! And you went to such trouble to get it, too.>
Jenni swooned slightly at the disturbance currently happening to her timeline, but recovered without a fuss. She glanced between the two sets of agents and casually slid out of the foreground. "So not getting in the middle of this one...."
At the discordant cacophony that rang out from the player piano, all three cringed slightly. (On the other side of the room, though, Agent Derik, harper of Pern and Phantom of the Opera clone, looked up from his plate of cake and grinned. "What a fantastic noise! I must see what makes this sound." He got up and left. His partner, Gall, shrugged and stole the rest of his cake.)
"You really shouldn't have," Nume was saying, looking over his glasses at the DMS agents. "No, really. You shouldn't have. It's a piano. I don't know what kind of luxury resort you lot live in, but I do not have room in my response center for a piano!"
<Nume!> Ilraen said sharply. <You could at least appreciate the time and effort they put into honoring your achievement.>
"No, I couldn't! I didn't ask for this! What am I even hearing, anyway?" He grimaced at the thing. "Is it broken?"
<I—uh....> He didn't have an answer for that. He wasn't the most musically educated, and it didn't make sense to his ear, either.
At that point, Agent Derik arrived and, without waiting for an invitation, began inspecting the player piano. "I see! A piano!" he said, more or less to himself. "I've only read about these! And this one, it plays itself? What mechanism... or what magic?" When you worked in the PPC, you had to accept that magic existed.
Nume and Ilraen just stared. They knew who he was, since Jenni had recruited him during one of their missions, but that was about the extent of their relationship.
(( And stopping there, because this post is long already. ^_^; That piece is awesome—I listened to it twice to sort out the piano part from the rest. It must just make no sense by itself, but I figure a guy based on Andrew Lloyd Webber's Phantom would be just the guy to appreciate it. ))
~Neshomeh -
((Oh dear...)) by
on 2014-02-04 22:42:00 UTC
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((Well, if you want, you can edit out all the boyfriend lines. Though... Ah... Dammit. Shoot. Eh... We can sort that out later, I guess.))
"Yes indeed," Cindy said. "Xanthus thought it would be fun if we got you a player piano with a particular piano roll. Which is what your hearing..." She rubbed her chin.
Anneli looked on. "You know, maybe we should've gotten all those percussion things too," she said. "I mean, I totally don't know how well a siren would work in an RC, but I swear this song made more sense than this."
Cindy shrugged, noticing that Agent Derik had begin inspecting the player piano. "Oh well," said Cindy, looking at the piano. "Happy anniversary, Nume!"
((If Derik is already enthralled by the mere presence of a player piano, I do wonder what kind of stuff he'd get into if one were to introduce him to Conlon Nancarrow's player piano studies. Those are crazy, and they'd probably be right up his alley.
Oh, and fun tidbit about the Ballet Mécanique: it actually caused a scandal when it first premiered. Pieces that cause scandals during the premiere are fun, and unfortunately it almost never happens anymore.)) -
((You might not need to mess with the timeline at all.)) by
on 2014-02-06 02:04:00 UTC
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Some events can be just reattributed to different dates. PPC time is fluid at its default, since Agents can be "constantly busy with work" yet only produce a new mission every six months or more, for metafictional reasons. Plus, we've seen people attribute missions and events to times that they didn't really occur in out-of-universe, like when Lily Winterwood wrote a pre-Blackout mission in May, and Sergio Turbo's Blank Sprite is occurring in 2012 but is being written in 2014. Compared to that, this is small potatoes.
Maybe the Canon Library events happened in late January 2013, and the celebration here in February is just coming off of the tails of that. Let me check the wiki for a second... oh, good, Ilraen has a posted timeline. That makes this easy. Now I just need to compress it.
Proposed alteration to keep things consistent and possibly ensure maximum Cindy-Ilraen awkwardness:
June 2012: Ilraen and Cinderella first meet.
July to November 2012: Trollfic duty for RC 2183.
January 2013: Cinderella meets Ilraen again. Cinderella is transferred to Hunger Games Division.
February 2013: Anniversary celebration.
March 2013 to Metafictional "now": Hunger Games Division duty for RC 2183. Plenty of time to set several missions in and have a few more encounters with Ilraen.
October 2013: Blood Raining Night duty for RC 999.
Metafictional "now":Ilraen and Cinderella make outNeshomeh posts the Anniversary celebration on the Board.
It seems like a logical enough progression, so long as there aren't any other changes in the retroactive meantime. What do you think? -
((It doesn't even need to be that convoluted.)) by
on 2014-02-06 02:13:00 UTC
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Stuff happening in-universe that isn't seen/doesn't happen at that exact time out of universe isn't some new or super weird thing, nor is setting a story before the time you're writing it. Herr could just retcon the relationship a bit and voila, you're really overthinking this. :P
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((But accurate timelines are fun, though...)) by
on 2014-02-06 05:48:00 UTC
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Plus, this is a bit of an actual issue. At the end of the story where Cindy meets Ilraen a second time, and is teased by her partners for being Ilraen's "girlfriend", the trio is transferred to a new Department temporarily. If we leave the anniversary party and timelines as they are, they would be transferred there, be immediately transferred back to perform their trollfic duties that they'd been punished with right before Cindy first met Ilraen, then go to the anniversary party, after which they would presumably be transferred back to do their DMS work that they never got around to doing because they'd been killing trollfics. It's possible, since all three meetings are in sequence, as are the missions, but quite unlikely, since there wouldn't be any reason for a transfer if the Agents transferred were sent right back where they were before they got any missions done.
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((Nesh will probably sort out continuity errors during editi by
on 2014-02-07 21:11:00 UTC
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-ng. The rest of the stuff you brought up, though, is on the level of claiming that the agents never eat or go to the bathroom because we leave it assumed those things are taken care of when there's the opportunity instead of detailing it every time. :P))
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Part of the crowd . . . by
on 2014-02-02 05:14:00 UTC
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"Wow. Okay. So this can be a learning experience. 'Never send Doc to get any kind of present ever.' Lesson learned."
"I don't even know the man, Vania. You asked me to go get a present for some guy named 'Supernumerary'. I thought a high-end graphing calculator sounded like it would be appreciated."
Vania huffed and put her forehead into one hand. "Generic presents for people you don't know would generally be candy, Bleepstuff, maybe a card. Not a calculator."
Doc looked away. "Sorry I don't know your social people customs."
"Well, we're almost to Nume. And since you're the one who picked out the present, you can be the one to embarrass yourself." Vania shoved Doc forward towards Supernumerary.
Doc's eyes widened, and he clutched the present to his chest. "Um. Hi. Hi! Well, we . . . I . . . we got you a . . . something." He stiffly thrust the bow-bedecked calculator out to Nume. -
"Hi?" by
on 2014-02-04 17:50:00 UTC
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Nume took the calculator with a raised eyebrow. What was he, an accountant?
Fortunately, Ilraen spoke up first. <That is a fine-looking piece of equipment.> He leaned down for a closer look.
Nume handed the thing over before his personal space got any more compromised. "Yeah, uh... that sure is a calculator," he added. It probably wouldn't be for long, though. He suspected his partner was already taking it apart in his head.
Seeing the situation rapidly deteriorating, Jenni came to Doc's rescue. "Thank you so much for coming!" she said, spreading her hands in a welcoming gesture. "Have you had any cake yet? It's just over here, please have some...."
"Geek," Nume muttered accusingly to his partner.
<Nerd,> Ilraen happily shot back.
"Hrm." -
Doc began to back away, his expression stony. by
on 2014-02-04 21:04:00 UTC
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"Ah. Yes. Cake. Will do cake."
Vania grabbed Doc by the shoulders and began to steer him away from the other agents. "Come on, Doc. Maybe you'll be less awkward over in this part of the room."
(Forgot about how Ilraen reacts to tech. Also, I meant to say before, congrats on having such a long-running PPC career!) -
Some more guests arrive... by
on 2014-02-02 02:01:00 UTC
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A young Asian-looking woman with a pixie cut and lightning bolt tattoos on her midriff cut her way through the crowd on her way up to Nume. Somewhere between the door to the Cafeteria and the center table she'd acquired a rather festive party hat.
"Sup, old timer?" she said with a nod. "Name's Gremlin. We haven't met, but apparently you know my partner Xericka from somewhere. Or she knows you, anyway. She wanted me to give you this."
She handed over a rather sizable bottle of what appeared to be Bleeprum. There was a simple black ribbon tied in a bow around the bottle's neck.
"Happy anniversary, dude." Gremlin gave Jenni a nod. "Lookin' fine as always, Robinson. See you when you next swing by the Nursery." She then ducked back into the rambling masses with a final cry of "Somebody point me in the direction of something to drink!"
~~~~~
James Pittman gave a awed whistle as he took in the Cafeteria crowd from the relative safety of the door. "This Supernumerary fella must be something to get a reception like this," he said.
"Ten years of solid service," Laura Dukes replied. "I'd say that qualifies as being something."
"And how do you know him again?"
"Reputation only. What, you haven't heard anything about him?"
James gave his partner an appraising look. "I'm still new round here, darlin', in case you forgot," he said. "Haven't yet gotten to know enough folks well enough to start swappin' gossip."
"Well, here's your chance. Go! Mingle! I'm gonna go grab a slice of cake before they all vanish." Laura paused. "And if you see any aliens, don't stare. Or shoot them."
"I'm not that new, Lar. I know the general sort of weirdness that goes on 'round here."
"Just making sure," Laura said before pushing her way towards the cake.
((OOC: How does Xericka know Nume? Well, they technically did have very brief cameos in this story. Who's to say they didn't meet then? Either that, or at a bar somewhere. And Gremlin knows Jenni the same way Xericka did in the Halloween RP: they met at the Nursery.)) -
Nume picked up the bottle and examined it. by
on 2014-02-04 17:31:00 UTC
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"Now, this I can use. It's about time someone gave me alcohol. Or pseudo-alcohol; can't have the real thing anymore." He gave Gremlin a nod of approval. "Actually, we have met," he added. "2011, Mary Sue invasion of the Hetalia fanfiction university. I'm not surprised you don't remember. I heard you Bad Slashers had it up to your eyeballs. That fandom." He shuddered. "Anyway, thank Xericka for me."
As Gremlin went on her way, Jenni grinned back. "You, too, babe. Take 'er easy!"
(( ... I dunno, Gremlin seems like the kind of person who gets called "babe" by casual acquaintances. *shrug*
And yes, Nume and Ilraen have actually met all your guys except Pittman. They were all involved in the IAHF Sue invasion, which I found out when I went over it while replying to Lily. They spent most of their time in different places, but there was a big war council sort of thing at one point, plus the awards ceremony where they were all made Knights Grand Cross of the Order of the Mochi.
I had no idea about that Halloween story. O.o Still, I can see Nume getting roped in to keep an eye on Ilraen or something, and Xericka would be the best choice of conversation partner for him. ))
~Neshomeh -
Gremlin's eyes widened in recognition. by
on 2014-02-06 00:58:00 UTC
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"That's right, yeah! We did meet! Sorry I forgot, but... Hetalia..." She shuddered, just a little. "Yeah, that was a thing and a half. I'll give Xericka your regards. She wanted to come herself, but Aiden's sick right now. You know how it is."
((I completely forgot about the IAHF storyline. *faceplam of self-exasperation* Take note: that's why you should never try to write these things when you're tired. You look for possible connections and find remote ones while missing the big obvious things.
I can see Gremlin getting called 'babe' by certain close friends. Especially Jenni.)) -
((The unofficial Department of Inaccuracies strikes again)) by
on 2014-02-01 22:11:00 UTC
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((No, they can’t. But if Androia and Hieronymus had been around, they would have noticed that Supernumerary was “starting at a fixed point in the middle distance”, and they could have tried to tell him that it might be more comfortable to be “staring” at this point.))
((Congratulations to Nume, and my apologies for being such a spoilsport.))
HG -
Fixed! Thank you for catching that. {= ) (nm) by
on 2014-02-02 15:58:00 UTC
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((More like Department of Pointless Nitpickery. :P) (nm) by
on 2014-02-01 22:45:00 UTC
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My nitpicking is never pointless! by
on 2014-02-02 13:22:00 UTC
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If there is nothing else behind it, then the point is that I was dragged into the PPC only recently and are still trying to figure out what to do when I am not commanded by the puppet master of my former live, so you may call it 'experimental behaviour'. But of course I cannot speak for Hieronymus. This man can be annoying sometimes.
Wait – who is Hieronymus? Did I meet him already? Apparently I should not be here myself. I may need to blame the Time Lords for this mess.
Excuse me now. I have to retreat to the Emerald Dream and wait until my master calls me back to duty.
Androia
((Sorry, I couldn’t resist to role-playing her; I need the practice. And may I hand this closing parenthesis back to you? You seem to have dropped it. :evilgrin: )))
HG -
That is a long time by
on 2014-02-01 22:03:00 UTC
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Ilraen continues to be rather adorable. And Nume's lies about his job are making me think about Men In Black.
Plothole cake sounds awesome, but probably tastes a little stale.
Everyone will always make up the words to songs that they don't know. Including the people who claim to know said songs but can't remember what word goes where... -
Thanks! by
on 2014-02-03 19:09:00 UTC
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Nah, they can't communicate with their families at all in Men in Black. This was inspired by an episode of The X-Files. Which admittedly does have Men in Black, if you count the Cigarette Smoking Man and the rest of that lot.
Convenient Cake tastes like whatever the eater likes best, so unless you like stale cake, I doubt it. It wouldn't be as convenient that way. {= ) (I haven't decided what it is for Nume yet, but I'm thinking maybe double chocolate.)
I always think of the Hogwarts school song when there's group singing at the PPC. Jenni is definitely taking her cues from Dumbledore, since she was a student there in one incarnation.
~Neshomeh -
Party time by
on 2014-02-01 20:15:00 UTC
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Arthur Briggs held the Cafeteria door open for his intern. It wasn't for reasons of good manners (though he tried to maintain them), it was because Lynn Gillies was carrying a much larger present than he was.
"Congratulations, Agent Supernumerary!" Briggs held out a carved wooden box. "Reaching ten years here is quite an accomplishment. I don't think you've met my current intern, Lynn Gillies. Gillies, this is Agent Supernumerary from DIC."
Gillies smiled, and placed a neatly-folded mass of fabric on the table. "It's good to meet you." She glanced down at the fabric. "I wasn't sure what the appropriate present for these events would be, I hope you like this. It's a tapestry I snagged out of a badfic, the designs are supposed to be Arabic."
OOC: If Nume opens the box, Briggs got him a phaser pistol. -
The three had to scramble... by
on 2014-02-03 19:02:00 UTC
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... to clear enough space for the tapestry. Jenni and Ilraen wound up moving all the gifts to an adjacent table while Nume guided the little Excelsior back into its shoebox. It did its best to dodge the "obstacles," and he eventually corralled it in a triangle formed by the box, its lid, and his chest.
Finally, after setting it on the other table and adjusting his glasses, he nodded to the DMS agent. "Briggs. I try to ignore the recruits, so no, we haven't met." He gave the smiling young woman a skeptical once-over, then turned to examine the tapestry. "Still, the RC can always use livening up, within reason. I'll have to verify if this actually says anything sensible."
Next he turned to the box and opened it cautiously, just in case anything was going to fly out of this one, too. He stared for a moment at the phaser, wondering if people targeting his nostalgia like this was going to be a trend. "Is this the real deal?" he said aloud.
(( Also, is it the TOS-era gun-shaped version, or a TNG/VOY/DS9 "dustbuster" type? Apparently they're both called Type 2, according to Memory Alpha. ))
~Neshomeh -
IC this time by
on 2014-02-06 22:30:00 UTC
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(OOC: Since it looks like I can now hold an internet connection for longer than five minutes .... And as mentioned in the other post, it's TOS-era.)
"It's real," Briggs said with a smile. "I haven't recertified in Trekverse since the reboot, and I thought this should go to someone who would appreciate it." -
TOS-era, and real by
on 2014-02-04 17:26:00 UTC
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(I figure an experienced DMS agent would have gotten his hands on one at some point ;) .)
-
The crowd shifted around Nume... by
on 2014-02-01 19:55:00 UTC
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...revealing a short Chinese woman sporting a black bob cut and an enormous grin. She worked her way towards the DIC Agent and placed a shoebox in front of him.
"Agent Supernumerary, is it? A pleasure to meet you!" she chirped. "I'm Penny Chang, from Intelligence. I just wanted to say that it's really fantastic that you've managed to tough out ten years here! Now, I think that you'll appreciate this gift, it's handmade..."
Penny flipped the top of the shoebox with a thumb. A painted balsa wood model of an Excelsior-class starship silently rose from the container and started to hover around the table slightly above head height.
"A few friends of mine came together to make this. We know you really like Star Trek, so we thought you'd get a kick out of a model ship. It can avoid obstacles and curious minis on its own, so no need to keep it tied up or anything. If ever the floaty charm starts to fade on this, you can just take it down to RC 845 and ask for the resident wizard. He'll gladly re-work his spell on it for you."
She took a single step back from the table. "Well, I'll be seeing you, then. Don't work yourself too hard, 'cause we Spies love reading your mission reports. If you go mad or missing or something, we won't be getting any new ones! Cheers!" she said with a smile.
The crowd shifted again and the woman vanished from sight. -
After what he'd seen so far... by
on 2014-02-03 03:33:00 UTC
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The little starship was such a good surprise that, just for a moment, a gleam of pure fanboyish excitement was able to shine through.
"Excelsior-class," he murmured as he followed the ship with his eyes. "Any particular ship, or...?" He rose halfway to his feet, reaching up to try and get a better look, before catching himself. He straightened up the rest of the way abruptly and pinned Penny with a steely look. "Well, you're certainly living up to your department's nickname, Penny Chang. I'll be watching for your name on my console from now on, so don't screw up."
Behind his back, Jenni gave the younger woman a wink and two thumbs up.
(( By the way—I feel a little guilty about blaming Intel for giving my guys bad information on "Blood Raining Night," since I know how it feels to me when people give FicPsych a hard time. In this case, I can easily imagine the spy on the job getting to the worst chapter and having their brain just go "NOPE," scribbling some stuff in the report, and giving up, and I don't hold it against whoever it might have been. I'd actually be interested in filling in that blank with a name, if you have any thoughts on who might've handled that assignment. I'm an advocate for Not-So-Nameless Background Characters. ... There should totally be a group for that, but with a better name. ))
~Neshomeh -
((Nah, it's all good.)) by
on 2014-02-03 08:30:00 UTC
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((After reading the mission and having a quick look at the YouTube animated version, I can see why a DoI operative would NOPE so hard they'd scribble
kill it with fireanything on the report and shove it to the Assignment crew. None of my agents currently handle the continua involved, so you're free to pick a name.
Heh. I'm with you on the "Not-So-Nameless" group of characters in the background. That's what I want the DoI-- and the DIA-- to become, but I've gotta start writing more stuff, eh?
Oh, and if Nume takes a closer look at the model's registry, he'll find that it reads NX-2000, also known as the Excelsior.)) -
((Hoi, I'm writing DIA stuff. :P)) by
on 2014-02-04 21:19:00 UTC
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((Not saying you can't obviously, just reminding you you're not alone there. :P))
-
(( Thanks! )) by
on 2014-02-03 19:53:00 UTC
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I'm glad you agree. ^_^ (If you ask me, BRN is notorious enough to qualify as Legendary, but it's not up to me.) I'll probably just leave the mission as-is rather than make up a random name for the DoI, though.
Ooh, shiny. Penny is very clever. {= )
~Neshomeh -
A wild bevy of Agents appear! by
on 2014-02-01 16:21:00 UTC
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February 2013. Along the timeline of things that occurred in HQ in 2013, this was indeed one of those calms before the storm.
"How lovely," Agent Christianne Shieh remarked as the console lit up with a message. "Agent Supernumerary's tenth anniversary of being in the PPC."
"A remarkable achievement," agreed Agent Eledhwen Elerossiel.
"Especially given the high turnover rate." Christianne turned from the console. "There's a celebration in the Cafeteria. Want to go?"
"Will there be chocolate?"
Christianne groaned.
~~
The Disentangler and the Agent landed their TARDIS just inside the Cafeteria. Their TARDIS had taken on the look of a distasteful floral display.
"What a nice party. They have tea and everything," said the Agent cheerily as he looked around. The Disentangler rolled her eyes.
"Pretty high turnout. Surprising, given the venue," she said, grinning and waving at some of the other partygoers. "There's Jeeves and Rooney from DOI. What the hell are they carrying?"
"Looks like presents."
"Looks like a pile of socks to me."
"Why would Nume need more socks?"
The Disentangler rolled her eyes again. "I dunno, sock puppets?"
"Is he the sockpuppet sorta guy? Because he's a lot like... which one of me was it, again? No, wait, it was one of you. I swear, every other one of your regenerations is sarcastic."
The Disentangler rolled her eyes. "Hush," she said, waving at Nerys and Lisa who were standing by the food (which looked a bit meatloafy and way too glittery to be edible).
~~
"Happy anniversary!" declared Rooney as he and Jeeves presented their present to Nume.
"It is, I believe, an achievement to have come this far," agreed Jeeves, even if the only times the two DOI agents had ever seen Nume were usually from afar and rarely on Cluedo nights in the Cafeteria.
Rooney nodded. "The socks are all patterned for different days of the week. And there are lots of bright green patterns. To go with your glasses."
"We're just going to go have some Convenient Cake," added Jeeves, tugging his friend by the arm towards the table of slightly more edible-looking refreshments.
~~
"I put an experiment on hold for this," Scientist Lori Starrett groused as her husband Bill presented a set of ever-changing coloured pens to Nume.
"Yeah, well, try reaching your tenth anniversary in this madhouse. I think it's worth a stab at celebration," her husband muttered.
Lori rolled her eyes before smiling at Nume. "Happy anniversary," she said in a much nicer tone.
~~
"Pretty good party, isn't it?" wondered Christianne as she and Eledhwen entered the Cafeteria. "Ooh, there's Lori. She looks well."
"Is she not supposed to be?" wondered Eledhwen.
"Pregnancy rumours," Christianne replied quickly before hefting s colourfully-wrapped bag of Bleep-candies (Gummyblees, Bleepolate, the works). Eledhwen has suggested a pocket watch, but Christianne had shot the idea down. After all, in some cultures (like hers), it was rude to send people clocks. It was a subtle way of telling them their time was running out.
Eledhwen frowned. "I was not aware there were rumours," she said as they stepped over to where Nume was, after Lori and Bill wandered off into the crowd.
"Yeah, well." Christianne shrugged. "You hear things at the pub during game nights. Moreso at the poker table, though.
"Speaking of which, you have yet to show me how to count --"
"Not mentioning that here," snapped Christianne before grinning over at Nume and tossing him the candies. "Happy anniversary!"
(Note: That turned out longer than expected.) -
After the singing ended, by
on 2014-02-01 16:56:00 UTC
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Jenni got down from her chair and scooted it under the table, making as much room as possible. As the first pair of guests approached, she reached down and gave Nume's shoulder a shake. "Come on, at least look like you're alive!"
Nume grunted something unintelligible, but raised his head and shoved his glasses back onto his face. He blinked a few times at the pair of DoI agents. He'd seen them around, but had no idea who they were. Then he squinted at the socks.
"That's. Uh. Sure... green?" he uttered.
"He means thank you very much for the thoughtful gift," Jenni said with a grin. "Enjoy the cake!"
---
The pens were met with curiosity on all sides. Ilraen and Nume each picked one up to inspect.
<So, the ink constantly changes colors, or does the pen itself change, too?> the Andalite asked, peering intently at it in case something was going to happen before his eyes.
"They aren't going to write in urple or something, are they?" Nume added with wells of skepticism.
---
(( Holding off on responding to the candies for the moment. ))
~Neshomeh -
"There is a distinct possibility." by
on 2014-02-01 17:57:00 UTC
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"The pens change colour at random. Sometimes the pens themselves change at random. I think it picks up Sue colours if you leave it exposed to Aura of Smooth for too long." Bill shrugged. "So I wouldn't use it on Sues, if I were you."
-
"I see." by
on 2014-02-02 17:17:00 UTC
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Nume put the pen down and not-so-subtly slid it toward his partner. "I think I'll just stick to red, thanks." He was in this against his will, he didn't have to be polite.
<I think they are very interesting,> Ilraen assured the scientists.
Once they'd gone on their way, he turned to Jenni. <If Nume does not want them, perhaps Henry would like one? He is beginning to write, he not?>
Jenni started to respond, but all three of them jumped when a bag of candy hit the table with a thwack. A voice called "Happy anniversary!", and they looked around for the source.
"Oh god, it's those two," Nume groaned upon spotting Christianne. "Thanks for the heart attack!" he called back, and shoved the bag into a pile with the socks and the pens.
(( How does Nume know them? They certainly interacted during the Mary Sue invasion of IAHF, but I'm thinking he's had an earful of rumors about their relationship for the last couple of years, and being him, he is not a fan. ^_~ ))
~Neshomeh -
"They're excellent for scribbling on the walls." by
on 2014-02-02 17:48:00 UTC
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Lori grinned. "I'm sure Henry would love it." She tugged at her husband's arm. "Let's go get something edible."
As Lori tugged Bill away, Christianne grinned over at Nume's scowling face.
"No problemo, sweetie!" she shouted as she tugged Eledhwen off to go get refreshments as well.
((Considering they're not together yet at this point I can definitely see why he's sick of them and the rumours around them. But E and C definitely take it in stride; they're pretty sick of the rumours themselves, too.)) -
"Party? With cake? For a ten-year-old?" by
on 2014-02-01 12:34:00 UTC
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Wobbles joined proceedings the only way she knew how; bursting in at pace with a party hat perched atop her massive rainbow-striped wig. "Whooooooooooo's the birthday lifeform? Come on, don't be shy! You're in the Cafeteria, you can't be that shy of... a... wha?"
"Human," said the Notary with withering scorn as she trudged behind her partner, "it is a tenth anniversary party. It is commemorating the extremely long service of a respected agent, who is also a human. I was under the impression that all your people knew each other."
"Oh. Okay, so, we can still do the balloons, right? Hiya mister Nume! Congrats on ten years of doing the strangest job in the known multiverse! You get a llama!" With that, she wobbled over to Nume and tied a large, surprisingly detailed balloon llama to his right wrist. "YAY!"
"I'm sorry about her, agent Supernumerary. She's... excitable. Human, you're in breach of several health and safety regulations."
"Uh, meaning?"
"Meaning get off of that ridiculous unicycle."
"Grouch."
"Well spotted." The Notary walked over to Nume and fished around in her robe pockets, eventually pulling out a hardback tome that made War And Peace look like a Mr. Men book. "This is for you. It's a beginner's guide to easy requisition of necessary items. Nobody fills out the order forms correctly these days and it makes life hell." Her voice got louder. "If anyone else at this gathering desires one, they are for sale in RC 1875 at a reasonable and competitive price. Follow the sound of human circus marches. I do not accept favours, payments in kind, or painted rocks. Thank you for listening."
"D'you really think they were?"
"Yes, and I told you to dismount."
"I know," said Wobbles as she trundled off in search of some cake. -
Nume sat in shock for a moment. by
on 2014-02-02 17:32:00 UTC
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"Why," he finally said, "is there a llama tied to my arm?"
Ilraen blinked all four eyes. <I am not sure, Nume. It was as though the whole Department of Angst were suddenly embodied in a single brightly colored humanoid form, and just as suddenly vanished, leaving behind naught but this inflatable object and a faint odor of sugar.>
Jenni wore a puzzled frown. "I think I know her. Or will know her. I dunno; it's hazy. Does the Nursery have a clown?"
"Don't ask me," Nume said. "At least the other one made sense, though... oh, look, she's talking to the Time Lords. Good lord, they're like thousands-of-years-old children. This is why Star Trek will always be superior."
"Don't say that too loud if you want to live another ten years. Who's very in right now."
Ilraen perked up as though he were about to say something, but Nume cut him off with a glare.
"I swear to Christ, if you start an Abbott and Costello routine right now I will strangle you with this llama."
Ilraen subsided. -
“Of course this is a good idea!” by
on 2014-02-01 16:18:00 UTC
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“Remind me again why this is a good idea?” the Librarian asked agent Desdendelle as the duo entered the Cafeteria.
“Same reason I dragged you here last time,” Des replied, rolling his eyes. “You're a worse recluse than me, and that's something...”
“Your point?” demanded the Time Lord before dodging out of the way of a large, red magpie.
Des stared at the magpie, which seemed intent on crashing into someone or something, before replying. “Point being you need to see more people than just dreary old me. Humans are social animals, and I imagine Time Lords are, too.”
“While that might be right...” the Librarian said, then paused. He narrowed his eyes. “Well...” he continued, pointing, “this is why I am a... recluse.”
“Should I know this person?”
“She is called the Notary, and she is the most obnoxious Time Lady I know.”
“Why's that? She stepped on your toes or something?”
“She is the worse obstructive bureaucrat I have ever seen.”
“Oh.” Des's mouth formed a perfect circle for a few seconds. “No wonder you hate her.”
The duo threaded their way between chairs, tables, and PPC agents in various states of food poisoning. Of course, their way took them toward where the Notary was advertising some sort of “beginner's guide”.
“Will you stop being a bureaucrat? Do you not see you are bothering people?” the Librarian told the Time Lady, annoyance plain on his face.
Des, meanwhile, looked apologetically at the table's other occupants. -
"Oh dear." by
on 2014-02-01 16:29:00 UTC
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"Not her." The Agent crossed his arms. "Who invited her?"
The Disentangler shrugged. "No clue," she said, walking over to the Notary-and-Librarian confrontation. "Hey, you two! Why don't we go have some cake? Yes? No? Too busy staring hatefully at each other? Gosh golly gee, I can see the sparks flying from here. Anyone got popcorn?"
"Lachesis, you're going to make it worse," hissed the Agent as he sidled up next to her.
"You keep saying that, and it will get worse," retorted the Disentangler. -
"Bothering?" by
on 2014-02-01 17:04:00 UTC
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"If good workplace practice and efficiency in a working environment in which lives are at stake bothers you, Jade Warden Librarian, then I respectfully suggest that you find employment somewhere less dangerous. Perhaps an actual library, if you could find one that would take on an exiled mountebank from a Chapter of fools and vagabonds. Now, are you going to purchase one of my clear, easy-to-read, helpful guides to the bureaucracy of the PPC, or are you just going to stand there gawping at me like a sheep with a heavy concussion?"
Wobbles trundled up to Des's side, a plate of cake in one hand and a huge array of balloons in the other. "Aw, boy. She's at it again. I'll never understand that girl, not ever. Not while she's being such a grump, at least. Here, have an ostrich." She proffered a string to the agent. -
"What's a Spinel Promontor?!" by
on 2014-02-01 17:09:00 UTC
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"Come to think of it, what's a Jade Warden? I didn't know you were into inane babbling, Notary. You haven't been replaced by anything, have you?" wondered the Disentangler, tilting her head to the side.
(Note: This is Feburary of 2013. The events that led to the creation of the Council happened in December of 2013. You suggested that your Agents don't exist back in this event, so perhaps we can chalk it up to time travel?) -
Annoyedness by
on 2014-02-01 17:30:00 UTC
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Were the Librarian one to curse, he'd have done so now. That not being the case, he simply frowned. “Yes, bothering,” he said. “Things get done in spite of bureaucracy, not because of it, fool of a lawyer!”
Raising a hand, he pointed at the Notary, nearly poking her. “You have no idea what you are talking about! And what is a Jade Warden anyway?! Unless you have filed forms until you went blind, you can see that my coat is obviously brown!”
Des, meanwhile, accepted Wobbles' balloon, absentmindedly putting it on top of his head. “Well, she isn't the worse I've seen,” he said, taking a packet of dried apples from a pocket and opening it. “Dried apples? I'm Desdendelle, by-the-way. You can call me Des.”
((Des and the Librarian were there by then - I'm assuming this happens after Of Course I Still Love You, which I haven't published yet...)) -
"Thanks." by
on 2014-02-01 18:28:00 UTC
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"Mmm. Apples and apple by-products. Thank you." Wobbles plucked one daintily from the bag and scarfed it down. "'M'name's Wobbles. I work in the Nursery and I'm pretty big in the A/V Division as well; I make a TV show for the kids down there. Also, I... might be an agent? When did that happen? Has it happened?"
Meanwhile, the Notary was on the verge of drawing her staser. "I - I would have thought you'd remember the Council you helped Agent Morgan set up, even though it concerns the homeworld you renegades so revile! And do not presume to talk about bureaucracy like you understand it! A stable, clear, and accountable civil service is essential for any organization with power, and the people who cannot accept this might as well be the mewling infants my colleague over there entertains of an afternoon!"
Wobbles wheeled over to the bickering Time Lords and prodded the Notary. "Uh, Agent Trampoline?"
"What do you want?"
"Um, this might sound like a silly question, but... exactly how busted is your TARDIS?"
"Extremely. I wouldn't be stuck in this dump with nought but clowns and exiled vermin for company otherwise. What of it?"
"Only, I think something might be a little bit wrong with time for us. Just a little."
"Don't talk nonsense, clown woman. I'd know."
"Like you'd know if the cassette player got stuck again?"
"... Present your evidence."
"Nobody here knows us, nobody here knows anything that's happened so far, and one of your tea party doesn't remember meeting two Doctors at the same time in the first meeting. That sorta thing tends to, y'know, stick in your noodle a bit."
"I... now you mention it, that is rather strange. It's almost as if something was wrong with time."
"Yeah, which I just-"
"It takes quite the intellect to figure out something like that, which is why I got it before you did. Of course, we could have waited for the universe to expire before you got it, but that is immaterial."
"But-"
"Be silent. Librarian, Disentangler, Agent, attend me. There's a paradox in RC 1875. We must fix it."
"Ya sure they're gonna help you? Only, the Librarian looks kinda ticked off at you. Like, that-close-to-snapping-and-then-snapping-your-neck ticked off."
"He will come. I am a representative of the Continuity Council of Gallifrey and I am in need, and article 15-b of our council clearly states - oh, yes, that doesn't exist yet."
"Okay. Desperate measures."
"And what do you mean by - PUT ME DOWN!"
Wobbles grabbed her partner and skedaddled at an impressive turn of pace, considering her cargo was trying to kick her in the head and she was on a unicycle. They made their way out of the door and vanished, never to return. Not for a good few months, at least. -
A puzzled pair of agents. by
on 2014-02-01 21:15:00 UTC
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Des and the Librarian exchanged looks.
“What was that?” the human agent asked.
“That was the Notary. From the future, apparently.”
“Why– nevermind. I'll probably fry my mind if I'll get an answer.” Des munched on a dried apple and surveyed his surroundings. “Y'know? I think you were right after all. There're way too many people here, not mention a party.” He pointed at Nume and co. with his thumb.
“Well, you insisted we would come here, so stand behind your words and interact,” the Librarian replied, annoyance dripping from his voice.
“Bloody bugger, you sound like my mother, except not,” Des said, looking around some more. Upon further inspection, the party turned out to be something about celebrating an agent's long stay at the PPC – a decade, apparently. Digging around in his coat's pockets, he procured a dusty book of Zen sayings. Muttering under his breath, he waved it around a bit – cleaning some of the dust and making him sneeze – before heading toward Nume.
“Apparently people are giving you gifts,” he said, “so here, have this. Joushuu's Book of Zen.”
The Librarian, meanwhile, made his way to the Disentangler and the Agent. “From your reaction I surmise that you have also encountered that obnoxious Notary,” he stated. -
"Who hasn't?" snorted the Disentangler. by
on 2014-02-01 22:34:00 UTC
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"Well, that is, who hasn't out of the who who's got time machines, but you know. Never expected to see them back here, though. Definitely remember seeing them in December. Does that come before February?" The Disentangler's brows furrowed. "Wait, no. It doesn't. If it did, we might've figured out exactly what sort of nonsense they were talking about."
"Take a breath, Lachesis," suggested the Agent.
"This is what happens when you do 2013 out of order," said the Disentangler, rolling her eyes.
"And to be fair, we might've also encountered the Notary on Gallifrey way before... you know." The Agent made a face. "We were chasing down a Sue who popped in from... what was it again?"
"Artemis Fowl," said the Disentangler. "One of those child genius things."
"Yes." The Agent nodded. "The Notary, or rather, Antrilovorasilendar --"
"She was that really annoying little Dromeian at the Academy, wasn't she? The one who kept on correcting everyone and talking in technicalities?" The Disentangler paused. "She got worse."
"Yeah, we weren't sure if the Canon would allow us to kill her and the Sue together." The Agent shrugged. "Guess that's come back to haunt us." -
*blink* These two were around, together, in 2013? (nm) by
on 2014-02-01 15:25:00 UTC
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-
When in 2013 is this? by
on 2014-02-01 16:21:00 UTC
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Because just saying "2013" is more vague than you'd expect. I remember wobblestheclown first mentioning Agent Wobbles back in December, which would technically be 2013, but if the party takes place in June, or September, or February, it would fit into slightly different places in everyone's chronological history, and Agent Wobbles might or might not exist yet.
-
February. by
on 2014-02-01 16:33:00 UTC
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The month I said I'd been waiting for to post this. Also the month named in the "Timeline" bit of the header to the story on my site. Which I kinda figured people would read before replying.
~Neshomeh -
Ah. Whoops. by
on 2014-02-01 17:01:00 UTC
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I kind of assumed it meant this was happening in February of 2014, rather than 2013. Mea culpa.
-
You can always claim timey-wimey HQ nonsense. by
on 2014-02-01 17:39:00 UTC
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Since there's now a thing going with the other Time Lords and all; wouldn't want to tell everyone they have to stop. ^_^; I was just surprised.
(I did say it was February and 2013 in at least two places, though, honest. Maybe I just didn't say those things together enough?)
~Neshomeh -
I believe the appropriate US term is "shenanigans". =] by
on 2014-02-01 18:02:00 UTC
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Also, you might've worked this out from reading through my fic, but I can be supremely unobservant at times. Specifically, the times when I'm awake. =]
--parp -
Just casually redirecting you up to the thread... by
on 2014-02-01 22:39:00 UTC
Link to this
...with the Time Lords.
The Disentangler and the Agent seem to have briefly encountered the Notary in the past in the middle of a mission (evidently a DW and Artemis Fowl crossover). Is it fine for that to have happened? It could be so brief that they just overheard her lecturing some classmates during her Academy days about the school rules or something, and got a bit irritated at her as well. Or maybe they had a full-blown introduction and disliked her anyway.
Also some timey-wimey things occured in which the Agent and the Disentangler seem to have encountered the Notary at the PPC in December before the events of this party, but you know how Time Lords are.
Sorry if that contradicted anything you had in mind. -
A brief primer (if you'll pardon the pun) by
on 2014-02-02 11:33:00 UTC
Link to this
That's absolutely fine. The Notary's TARDIS is one that's been maintained by a minor functionary in the sprawling government of one of the universe's oldest empires with the mechanical knowledge of a dead weasel. As such, upon crash-landing in HQ, the thing gave up the ghost entirely. Really, it's a miracle nobody got blown up by it.
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Does that mean... by
on 2014-02-02 19:51:00 UTC
Link to this
that the latest section of the Time Lord Script needs editing to exclude her TARDIS, too? It would be a shame, because I really like her being fully included in it - but if she doesn't have a working TARDIS, that can't be helped. And given the setup in the earliest parts, we know this is taking place only just after her arrival.
hS
(PS: Also, if you want to write another/the closing section, go for it!) -
Actually, thinking about it, no it doesn't. by
on 2014-02-02 22:03:00 UTC
Link to this
I think I can technobabble my way out of it with assistance from the Ruby Shipwright. Paradoxes and so forth. You know how it is.
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Or they could use alt-Notary's TARDIS. by
on 2014-02-02 20:47:00 UTC
Link to this
The Notary had a five-hundred-years-younger counterpart brought in by the temporal fold who referred to herself as "Spinel Promontor" rather than "Spinel Promotor", and more importantly, planned to take over HQ through bureaucracy before the arrival of the Ninth Doctor shifted her out of the fold and restored main universe Notary to her spot in space-time. If the main universe Notary's TARDIS is on the fritz, the TARDIS key that she still possesses might be able to utilize the space-time instabilities that the temporal fold caused to re-summon the alt-Notary and use her TARDIS to help pull the folds apart, with the two Notaries driving said TARDIS in tandem. Of course, this would mean that the alternate Notary would be stuck in the main universe after the temporal fold was finished, but that could be dealt with later. Plus, there's a pretty good premise for a story in there.
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Suicide on the Hogwarts Express by
on 2014-02-01 10:31:00 UTC
Link to this
I would like to claim the Rose Potter series for the destruction and death of the titular character.
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Rose Potter by
on 2014-02-02 01:42:00 UTC
Link to this
From what I read, Rose Potter is being sporked already.
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There is a mass PPCing of it going down apparently. by
on 2014-02-02 06:07:00 UTC
Link to this
I don't really know how it's going though.
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It looks like people stopped working on it a few years ago. by
on 2014-02-02 21:55:00 UTC
Link to this
The search bar also brings up that Cassie planned on taking it down using her Potterverse-native Agent back in 2012(though I'm not sure how that fits, since he works in the DIC and Rose Potter doesn't cross over with anything), but there's been no progress on that either. I suspect that the fic is cursed. Or it's just really long and stupid and people are finding a hard time putting up with it long enough to complete a mission. That second one strikes me as a little more likely, but you never know. Legendary Badfics may have gained a portion of their legend through supernatural properties. It certainly makes more sense than anything Rose Potter does.
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Speaking about badfics by
on 2014-02-03 04:34:00 UTC
Link to this
have you made any progress on that series whose author I asked you to help?
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Hold on there. by
on 2014-02-01 16:15:00 UTC
Link to this
You've been here for only four days now. This is the first time you've brought up PPC business at all, aside from that section a few threads down when you revealed that you plan to open a hole in HQ to the Halo universe that no one would keep an eye on for some reason, and now you're intending to claim a Legendary Badfic? Slow down. Those things are nasty enough as it is, and normally are only dealt with by writers who have proven themselves capable of sporking a few less-horrendous fics first, and regardless, I don't know if you're in the correct place right now to claim anything. I mean, it's not unheard of for someone to encounter a personally hateful abomination from a badfic thread here and say "Oooh, no. Nobody else take this, please. Once I get Permission, this sucker's mine!", but posting a claim on a Legendary Badfic less than a week after you introduce yourself is like a newbie showing up and then, the day after their debut, posting his or her Permission Request in the same thread that they introduced themselves in.
Postscript: What is with this thread title? At first I'd thought it was referring to one of the Rose Potter stories, but nope, they're all named after the British editions of the original books. -
Hey, be nice to the newbie! by
on 2014-02-03 05:17:00 UTC
Link to this
It's not like they get all the PPC protocols beamed into their heads the first time they come to the Board. :)
The ability to identify a very bad fic, and the desire to spork it, are after all some of the things that'll make a good PPC writer in time.
The reason for waiting is to give newbies time to read the original series and any other PPC stories that spark their interest, hang round the board and chat, possibly help beta some things, talk about writing, and generally get to know things before they start writing things in the PPC verse.
There are far worse descriptions for a newbie than "over-enthusiastic"! -
Chill. It's not like he was insulting them. (nm) by
on 2014-02-05 20:07:00 UTC
Link to this
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One, for instance, is "that one clown user". =] (nm) by
on 2014-02-03 11:51:00 UTC
Link to this
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I don't see what's wrong with you. The Notary is hilarious. (nm) by
on 2014-02-03 19:09:00 UTC
Link to this
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On Agent Penchant. by
on 2014-02-01 22:32:00 UTC
Link to this
(Information on her partner, Akishme, can be found here. I hope to gain approval for writing them as my Agents.)
Penchant is a unicorn pony recruited from a My Little Pony badfic. She was described as being "a dick, not understanding Twilight's love for him!" because she would often, rather harshly, tell the Sue-Twilight that she couldn't date Shining Armor, and make snarky comments (apparently the author didn't see how amusing said comments were). She was also created to be Twilight Sparkle's sister, and they "have the same colors but our manes are a bit different". Penchant isn't exactly happy about her origins or resembling a canon character, so she doesn't really talk about it.
Personality-wise, Penchant is a natural introvert. She's not unfriendly, per se; she's just socially gimped. She tries, though, really. Part of it is that, if asked for her opinion, she will give it exactly how she sees it. Penchant is brutally honest with people, as she feels sugar-coating things doesn't help. Even if she turns out to be right most of the time, it doesn't get her many friends. She gets easily annoyed with people, which also doesn't help. She's a no-nonsense kind of gal, and doesn't have a very high tolerance level. When annoyed, she snaps at people and, if they persist (and she happens to be knitting), she will jab them with her knitting needles. She doesn't really see a problem with her actions.
Knitting, reading, writing, and research are a few of the things Penchant actually enjoys. She doesn't like to be bothered when she's in the middle of something, and her already-low tolerance levels become non-existent. Penchant likes things to be calm and quiet, and will get upset if disrupted. Often times, she will recluse to her desk, surrounded by tall bookcases. The area makes her feel protected and she enjoys the solitude. She also enjoys insect collecting, and studying, taking care of, and breeding strange creatures. She has a particular interest in giant spiders and things with slime or spikes or tentacles.
In terms of interactions with her partner, as long as she can have alone time, Penchant gets along with Akishme just fine. The Argonian is able to get Penchant to loosen up and have fun, which is a pretty big accomplishment. They play games, crack jokes, and enjoy hanging out, however Penchant will become uncomfortable if Akishme already has company and invites her to join them, or vise versa. When it's just them, they have a lot of fun, though Akishme is skeptical of Penchant's love for... unusual creatures, and Penchant is wary of Akishme's harebrained schemes (she will go along with them, most of the time, but she's never too happy). They both think very highly of each other, and enjoy being partners. Something Penchant will never admit to is her envy of Akishme's ability to just talk to people and make friends.
Penchant is 5"8, with purple eyes, pale skin, and Twilight Sparkle-esque hair (dark blue, with a streak of both pink and purple). She's got a thin, lanky build, and small chest. Penchant isn't too fond of the way she looks, but prefers a human form a) because, after her experience with being in a badfic, she doesn't much identify as a pony, and despises looking very similar to a canon character, and b) she feels people won't really take her seriously as a candy-colored equine. As a pony, well, she looks very similar to Twilight Sparkle, but is missing a cutie mark. -
Sounds interesting. by
on 2014-02-02 00:00:00 UTC
Link to this
As one who enjoys solitude, but also wants friends IRL, I can relate to Penchant. I would be interested in reading how Penchant and Akishime interact.
One question, though: Which is Penchant's true form, pony or human? And if pony, how did she end up in human form? DORKS accident a la Cyba Zero? Plothole? And does she look like Unicorn!Twilight or Alicorn!Twilight? -
Oh! by
on 2014-02-02 04:52:00 UTC
Link to this
And, uh, how do I formally ask for permission? That's what I was attempting to get ready for by typing out all this on my characters. It was a pseudo-permission-request, I guess.
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Copy-pasta'd from the Wiki: by
on 2014-02-02 05:37:00 UTC
Link to this
What to Include in a Permission Request
Generally speaking, a permission request should include the following:
BRIEF character summaries for your agents. We don't want their full history—the purpose of this is just for the Permission Givers to check that they're not going to be Sues or Stus. This should include the department you intend to place them in. Try to avoid making a new one unless you have to, since we have a lot now.
A link to the badfic you intend to tackle as your first mission. Have to have done your research, you know.
A link to a sample of your own writing. This does not need to be related to the PPC, but should be representative. We want to see whether you can write well, basically.
And that's it. The exact format is up to you, and it does help to look like you're having fun rather than just tripping over a silly ritual. It is that, but it's a necessary silly ritual. -
Would those two descriptions of them be too much, then? (nm) by
on 2014-02-02 19:08:00 UTC
Link to this
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On a single page? Maybe. by
on 2014-02-02 20:32:00 UTC
Link to this
You could post an abridged version of your character descriptions. It doesn't have to be all encompassing: here's what I put down in my request.
"Gaspard was dragged along by his parents when they both joined the PPC. His spare time being devoted to reading books, playing games, and learning more about each ‘verse, he figured he could assist the Canon Protection Initiative to the best of his ability. He has been shuffled around several departments already, going from DoSAT to Floaters to DMS to finally be placed in Intelligence, where he is currently following an internship. He is very by-the-book, thus rather apprehensive when presented with a new situation. He loves logic to death, which makes it all the more funny to observe his reactions when reading badfic. Gaspard is not insane, but a steady stream of stupidity has already started to take its toll on his brain."
/shameless self-plug -
Alright, thanks! by
on 2014-02-02 20:57:00 UTC
Link to this
I'm so nervous, haha... I worry my writing won't be good enough or my characters will seem sue-ish themselves.
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She was originally a pony. by
on 2014-02-02 04:48:00 UTC
Link to this
Without the D.O.R.K.S, that's what she would be. She just personally prefers to be a human (had a brief discussion on that here.) Her appearance is like that of Unicorn!Twi.
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Uh...what happens when you mispell the name by
on 2014-02-02 00:02:00 UTC
Link to this
of an Agent who hasn't been created yet? Because unless I'm mistaken, that should have been "Akishme," not "Akishime."
What horror have I wrought upon the multiverse? -
Ghost!Mini (nm) by
on 2014-02-02 05:11:00 UTC
Link to this
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So, Rowling dropped a bombshell. by
on 2014-02-02 03:28:00 UTC
Link to this
So, if you've been watching the news, JK Rowling recently stated that she thought that Ron/Hermione was not meant to be. Good news for H/Hr shippers like me. A full interview is coming uit in Wonderland magazine soon, but mugglenet.com has some insights.
What's your views on this?
~Kitty -
Sadly, I've been proven right. by
on 2014-02-05 23:08:00 UTC
Link to this
Exhibit A:
https://www.fanfiction.net/s/10076581/1/Epilogue-Part-2
Character bashing for everyone (intentionally or not) in this fic!
The sad thing is, it's not even a spelling and/or grammatical mess. The OOC is despite the author having a modicum of intelligence. Ugh. I feel unclean.
Araeph -
...Uh? by
on 2014-02-07 20:46:00 UTC
Link to this
I like H/Hr, and that fic was just insanely unfair.
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What's mind-boggling... by
on 2014-02-08 00:15:00 UTC
Link to this
...is that the author makes Harry sound like a Grade A jerk and a nepotism advocate in the process. (Seriously, pulling strings to keep Ron on as an Auror?!) If your version of Harry talks, thinks, and acts like that, why would you want to pair him with your beloved Hermione? "Congratulations, Hermione, you've won the right to be with Sulky McNitwit for all eternity! Now let's have a kiss!"
Baffling.
~Araeph -
The problem with writing post-Epilogue fics... by
on 2014-02-09 11:33:00 UTC
Link to this
... is that most people are familiar with the characters as teenagers, and the lesser authors of the world keep that characterisation (quite often because they themselves are teenagers) rather than actually, y'know, think about what they'd be like as adults. Harry would, out of necessity, have had the moanier aspects of his personality kicked out by a relationship with either Ginny or Hermione, since both are noted for their inability to put up with people like that. Ron would've got a lot smarter by association with Hermione, and Hermione would've become a lot less hidebound when it comes to rules by association with Ron. We see bits of this happening already over the course of DH, but most authors are content to render their precious Golden Trio emotionally stunted twerps.
That said, I'd quite like to see a really good post-epilogue fic that does this sort of thing well. Any and all suggestions gratefully appreciated. -
NOOOOOO! by
on 2014-02-06 20:55:00 UTC
Link to this
*curls up in a ball and cries in the corner* Why do so many people hate Ron? Why??
The short fragment paragraphs in that fic made my eyes hurt. I get the author was going for a dramatic effect, but... ugh...
CAUTION: Falling fragments! -
I'm not usually an HP shipper by
on 2014-02-03 16:27:00 UTC
Link to this
But from what I read, my take is that she regrets pairing them up not because there's any specifically better ship, but that she feels that how she paired characters up towards the end of the series doesn't reflect how she feels about them now and how they could have grown.
... Which is perfectly valid, I think everyone who has written original fiction and gotten characters together has at least one pair where they look back and are like "You know what, that doesn't work as well as I thought it would."
I also think that it might be part of the backlash that she's occasionally gotten for having so many characters paired up by their late teens and presumably married only a few years after that. Although it happens in real life (and seems to have been common in the UK in the late eighties and early nineties, if the amount which stories from that time mention couples that young is any indication,) it's very different from the reality known by the fanbase, which is people who were being born in the late eighties and early nineties.
Personally, I saw the Ron/Hermione ship coming as early as second year (I was also a fan of Lloyd Alexander's Chronicles of Prydain, so I was no stranger to shipping the people who bicker the most,) but wasn't 100% sold on it after the bird incident in sixth year. Hermione's temper and developing ruthlessness, especially with her magic, didn't sit well with Ron's blunders. She's got a tendency to lash out at Ron far more than she does anyone else, and I didn't think that was going to make a great marriage.
Harry and Hermione always seemed like family to me, so I don't think it was actually necessary to have a marriage within the Golden Trio. Actually, I was on the fence about most of the student pairings in the last two books because 1) I felt that everyone involved was too young for the pairings to be permanent, 2) Many characters who were paired weren't given equal screentime and so pairings came off as very uneven, since we didn't know enough about one of the parties, and 3) I think Rowling is much better at writing mystery plots and children than she is at writing teens, and she fell into the trap of thinking that romances are absolutely necessary to writing teens or marketing to them. (Or just into the writing trap of wanting all her literary creations to pair off and settle down.) -
Shields up! by
on 2014-02-02 22:58:00 UTC
Link to this
I'm not a shipper - particularly when it comes to Harry Potter if only because that sort of thing can go right off the end of the lunacy scale - so have no real comment on H/G vs H/H, but I do agree that we're in for a rough time on the badfic front.
I can almost hear the cries of 'I knew their love was the OTP all along' from here... -
Meh... by
on 2014-02-02 20:01:00 UTC
Link to this
Honestly, I never even liked the idea of any of the trio being together. They just seem too much compatible as friends for a romantic relationship to work.
On the other hand, Ginny-Harry always seemed like Ginny's one-sided school crush. From my perspective, she always seemed more compatible with Neville.
To be honest, for the main trio, I don't remember ever shipping them with any of the characters presented in the book, and all of their romantic interactions with pretty much anyone seemed a bit forced. -
WHAT? by
on 2014-02-02 19:33:00 UTC
Link to this
First: Where did you hear that?
Second: Call me one of those weirdos, but I'm a Ron/Hermione shipper. I'm not 100% sure why JKR would say that (I mean, she was dropping hints since GoF, maybe even PoA if you really look), but it might have something to do with them falling in love over the course of a war... I love Ron and Hermione together.
To be honest, though, I'm mostly worried about this news being true because if it is, it's going to spawn even more Ron the Death Eater fics, which I despise. Ron is awesome. Yeah, he has flaws and isn't the best person all the time... but who is?
I should probably stop writing; I can't form a coherent thought when I get something like this dropped on me. -
I thought there was something fishy. by
on 2014-02-02 17:42:00 UTC
Link to this
I mean, the two of them have had way too many disputes in the books prior to Deathly Hallows, where all of a sudden they're all mushy-gushy because Ron read a book on how to charm witches. Once they're together... well, I really can't see it lasting, and it's remarkable that they've gotten at least enough years of marriage under their belt to raise two children.
Ooh, the plotbunnies are rolling around for a post-Epilogue, domestic-bliss-isn't-suiting-them sorta thing. I mean, I'm a Harry/Hermione shipper (back in my day we called it the Pumpkin Pie) too, and I'm not entirely sure how Harry and Ginny are soulmates (Agent Eledhwen's saying something along the lines of "I work in BBC Sherlock and Star Trek; I know what soulmates look like" right about... now). I can definitely see Hermione and Ron having shouting matches, Hermione telling Rose not to settle for a man like Ron, Hermione throwing herself into her work so thoroughly that she's never home --
(yes, this is speaking from personal experience, shh.) -
ItÂ’s amazing how differently this could be read. by
on 2014-02-03 13:11:00 UTC
Link to this
To me, all this bickering actually made Ron/Hermione believable. Most of it was about small things and annoyed Harry because it seemed so unimportant. But that’s the point. By using any opportunity to dispute, Hermione and Ron made sure that they could agree on most of what was important to them, and that the small things they couldn’t agree upon didn’t really matter. This doesn’t seem to be the worst way to build a relationship.
The one big issue left in the end was the supposed House-elf Enslavement Curse. This was solved when Hermione watched Harry charming Kreacher without the use of magic, and when Ron realized that "we can’t expect them to fight for us". I don’t think that "How to Charm a Witch" had much to do with this. But I have to say that I was a little bit disappointed there. Shoving the house-elfs out like little children? Now when Ron had said "Somebody should tell them what’s up, so they can decide whether they want to run, hide or fight" – naah, I wouldn’t have kissed him anyway :-)
Also, I seriously hope that Harry and Ginny, after this first kiss in HBP, talked about some important things rather than just snoging before there was time to tell Harry about the Quidditch final.
I don’t understand why Harry and Ginny, or Harry and Hermione, or Ron and Hermione, or anybody else, should be “soulmates” (and Still-not-an-agent Androia Avatar asks whether being soulmates would make them canon Sues and Stus). Considering that "right over easy" is one of the big themes of the books, I wouldn’t expect this to be so easy. I’d expect that they all have to work on their relationships to make them work.
And now I’m wondering whether Jo really said something entirely new. But I have to see the full interview to understand what happened there.
HG -
Thank you! by
on 2014-02-05 16:45:00 UTC
Link to this
You said it much better than I could have. *worships*
Ron/Hermione is an OTP of mine (wait- isn't that a bit of a contradiction? Meh.), so I get a bit incomprehensible when I try to discuss it. -
YMMV. by
on 2014-02-03 15:32:00 UTC
Link to this
Like I said, my perception of a good relationship is affected by personal experience, and Ron and Hermione act too much like my own (quite separated) parents for me to be invested in them as a couple.
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Yeah, itÂ’s a case of diverging experiences. by
on 2014-02-04 13:51:00 UTC
Link to this
The story of my first love is too complex to tell it here, but some of the reasons it failed where definitely
- not talking enough anyway (like Ron and Lavender)
- rather lying than risking a good quarrel (Harry occasionally does this to Hermione)
HG -
Then why did she write it? by
on 2014-02-02 06:39:00 UTC
Link to this
Isn't it the position of an author to decide which characters to pair off, when, and to whom? If J.K. Rowling didn't think Ron and Hermione would fit one another, why did she have them get married and make several children? I mean, from a certain perspective, going with the Ron-Hermione relationship when she doesn't think it could be altogether viable would be good from a Pair the Spares standpoint, since if Harry and Hermione paired up, there wouldn't be all that many main characters or central supporting characters for Ron to have flash-forward babies with that hadn't already been paired off, aside from Luna. (Now that would be an interesting story.) But she'd have been able to make it work if she really thought a big name should've been paired with someone less recognizable. It didn't entirely seem as though J.K. Rowling was aiming for name recognition in the final choices anyway, as evidenced by the fact that she already settled, and I use the term loosely, for having fan-favorite Draco Malfoy paired off with(gasp) a minor character!
And of course, leaving any main characters unmarried would be absolutely out of the question, since their referential offspring would be required to interact with one another on the eve of their first day of wizard school, making some form of final pairing an absolute necessity. How else would we know that Voldemort hadn't destroyed any chance to create a new generation of magic users?
Wow, I am a lot more invested in this than I thought I was. I don't even really like Harry Potter! -
Maybe it was more in retrospect? by
on 2014-02-02 08:32:00 UTC
Link to this
Obviously we don't yet have the full story, but it's possible she was more saying that thinking back on it she's not sure that's the way she would've done it now.
Of course, it's not like this would be the first time she's just thrown random stuff out there to stir up the fandom hornet's nest and stay relevant. -
Or it could just be that people change. by
on 2014-02-02 15:56:00 UTC
Link to this
Think about it: Ron and Hermione essentially hooked up not only fresh out of high school, but right after going through some really emotionally intense, high-stakes saving-the-world stuff. That's a pretty terrible foundation for a long-term relationship. It's not a huge stretch to imagine that the feelings they have for each other wouldn't last forever in the normal, boring, everyday world.
That goes for the rest of 'em, too. They're lucky if they stay compatible once they settle down.
They'd all still want to be there to see their kids off to school, though. Perhaps we just didn't get to see the chinks in the armor in the epilogue.
~Neshomeh -
Didn't she write said epilogue while she was writing PS? by
on 2014-02-02 17:10:00 UTC
Link to this
If so, that'd probably be why. I mean, she could have gone back to change it, but w/e.
- Yeah, having now seen an article... by on 2014-02-03 01:11:00 UTC Link to this
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Actually... by
on 2014-02-02 11:50:00 UTC
Link to this
Parts of the interview are on various news websites. If you Google it, it should come up.
~Kitty -
I agree. by
on 2014-02-02 11:48:00 UTC
Link to this
However, I would temper it a little.
I could be reading too much into it, but I don't think Rowling originally wanted to pair Harry and Hermione because it seemed a little obvious. Hermione's the primary female protagonist, Harry's the primary male protagonist, having them get together would be a bit hackneyed. This comes from someone who ships H/Hr, or Harmony, or Insert-Shipping-Portmanteau-Of-Choice-Here.
The three characters, as far as I can make out, are to show two worlds and two different approaches to magic. Ron's a normal kid from a magical household, Hermione's a normal kid from a Muggle household, and Harry's got his feet in both. Having Ron and Hermione get together is how Rowling shows that the two worlds can become one, the traditions of the old ways and the vibrancy of the new working together for a brighter future.
Or I could be talking through my hat, I don't know. =]
--parp -
Tidal waaaaaaaave! by
on 2014-02-02 04:13:00 UTC
Link to this
Honestly, I'm not a shipper.
My reaction to R/Hr? "Meh, OK."
My reaction to H/Hr? "Meh, whatever."
My reaction to H/G? "Eh, if that's what you want."
I ship friendship. :)
But what I CAN think about, and little else, is the tidal wave of fics that are going to be coming in! Hideous Ron-bashing fics, OOC Hermiones and Harrys running around, and the Ron/Hermione shippers hitting back with Harry-bashing...ugh. Better batten down the hatches, PPCers. It's gonna get ugly.
*dusts off the Red Pen files*
It may be time to return to duty.
—Araeph -
Heh. by
on 2014-02-03 07:09:00 UTC
Link to this
I'm sure there's a way to reasonably extrapolate from this new info to write decent fic, but I don't have the time to scribble it out myself.
That being said, I remember my days on FictionAlley's forums way too well. I can only imagine the thread titles for the shipping and anti-shipping forums... -
If you don't mind me asking, by
on 2014-02-02 07:01:00 UTC
Link to this
Why did the Red Pen files get dusty in the first place? Were you swamped with hings to do IRL?
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Yeah, pretty much. by
on 2014-02-02 13:14:00 UTC
Link to this
Also, LotR and PotC, my main two fandoms, have quieted down quite a bit. Though, with the resurgence of LotR on the Hobbit movie's release, there's still plenty of new material. And they're working on Pirates 5, so you never know.
Araeph -
...Pirates 5? by
on 2014-02-03 01:26:00 UTC
Link to this
You've got to be kidding me. Wasn't the fourth one horrible enough? (I mean, I couldn't get through it! The half that I did get through read like a cliched fanfic that had been acted out for no apparent reason! I've been told the mermaids were good, but as I couldn't make it far enough into the movie to meet them, I can't add to that opinion--but the first half of the film? Was dreadful.) Why make a fifth? Who's even going to be in it?
...seriously, why would anyone ever make a fifth PotC movie? I can't get my head around it.
(Also, hi! How've you been? It's been a while since I've seen you around the Board...)
~DF
PS: Pirates 5 for the love of--why--what--why would you even--/boggles/ -
Oh, there was a good reason. by
on 2014-02-03 02:52:00 UTC
Link to this
The reason being, that even though critics hated Pirates 4...it still grossed a billion dollars worldwide.
Yeah.
I mean, uh, obviously it's because part of the story still hasn't been told yet! :P
(I've been well--busy, but well, with the exception of a cold that's been bothering me since Tuesday. And you?)
Araeph -
That's a horrible the best reason I've ever heard! by
on 2014-02-03 04:02:00 UTC
Link to this
How awful. I hope it won't be as bad as the fourth...or worse...
On the other hand, you never know--it might surprise us all and turn out to be excellent! /puts on optimistic face/ You never know...or at least, we can hope...
...as long as the next part of the story isn't Capt. Jack Sparrow's long lost daughter with sparkly hair and eyes who hails from 21st century America and is a better piratate than everyone else, I think I can bear it. I think.
(Ah, colds. Bane of everyone's existence, more or less. Drink lots of tea, and stay warm!)
(I've also been well, but very much in a busy state as well--I spent the weekend in a different, if nearby, city, and then came back and went swimming the next day with my little cousin who's visiting from Israel. And then there's homework. And my new volunteer job, at a school, with fourth graders. So I've been busy, and am now exhausted, but all is well :))
~DF -
Nah, it'll involve a young, dashing male pirate... by
on 2014-02-03 11:23:00 UTC
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With whom all the female characters want to bump uglies. Also, he's a ninja and possibly from space. Or is Jesus.
Oh, who am I kidding, it'll be more Johnny Depp Depping his way around a slightly damp set as Deppishly as he possibly can because who needs a story when you've got quirky? -
About that one line... by
on 2014-02-02 06:36:00 UTC
Link to this
"I ship friendship."
Truer words have never been spoken before. Allow me to high-five you through the internet!
*Slaps monitor* -
I'm with Turtle by
on 2014-02-03 16:28:00 UTC
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Friendships are far more literarily important than Romances anyway.
(Literarily is not a word, you say? Wrong! I have made it so.) -
Re: Tidal waaaaaaaave! by
on 2014-02-02 04:44:00 UTC
Link to this
Hello, I am a newbie here to say hi, wish you well, and eagerly await the return of the Red Pen Files.
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Yeesh by
on 2014-02-02 04:57:00 UTC
Link to this
I have a terrible fic I wrote once, it's a Rise of the Guardians thing. Canon warping, OOC, terrible Mary Sues, angsty backstories, it's got it all. It's called Kali. Fics are always terrible when named after the Sue protagonist. For revenge, could someone please feed her to the Hindu goddess?
https://www.fanfiction.net/s/8793796/1/Kali
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No love for Rise of the Guardians? by
on 2014-02-03 03:24:00 UTC
Link to this
C'mon, this is awful and I don't have permission yet. Does no one want to kill Kali?
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Heh, to tell the truth... by
on 2014-02-03 23:56:00 UTC
Link to this
...I've actually had a reply post written out for a day or two, but haven't yet had time yet to edit it and make sure it makes sense and so on. It basically amounts to the fact that, like Neshomeh, I prefer to claim badfics based on whether or not they push my agents' buttons and/or would make good stories. However...hold on, let me dig it up...ah, here we go. A direct quote:
I haven't gone past the first chapter, but it already looks...well, since you wrote it, I'll be polite and just say it looks like it's probably missionable, yes :)
So yeah. I'll try reading the rest of it, see how far I get, and if I spot a good story/many pushed buttons, I'll be happy to at least consider taking it on. The main thing, though, is that I've both claimed a number of badfics already, and am currently on the (rather idle) lookout for a crossover, a Doctor Who badfic, and something that has at least one scene in Valinor...not all in the same badfic, mind you, but that's what I'm checking for. (I don't suppose this one ended up as a crossover? Well, I guess I'll find out...)
On another note, though, someone without permission is allowed to co-write a mission with someone who does have permission. You may want to look into that :)
~DF -
please kill it when you have time by
on 2014-02-05 00:12:00 UTC
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Kali Sue's got the personality of a moldy lemon. So does the JackRipoff! Sue.
People who don't have permission can co-write them? Tell me more. -
*attempts to keep Grease soundtrack out of head* by
on 2014-02-05 01:36:00 UTC
Link to this
Well, I read further...and it's just not making me all that angry, to be honest. The first chapter did--it seemed like pure theft of Jack's storyline--but afterwards...I mean, it's not all that good (apart from the SPaG, which is either perfectly fine or just lacking anything too glaring), but--I don't particularly want to set fire to it? I mean, it's filled with annoyances--Isolda Frost, for instance, certainly looks a lot like Jack Frost, and shares part of his name with no explanation to boot, and the unmarked POV shift I just saw was pretty jarring--but...it's not particularly filling me with rage. Not like some others I've seen. If you want to take it down so badly (and I assume you're made angrier by it than I am), I'm happy to potentially co-write with you; alternatively, you can find someone else--there are definitely other Rise of the Guardians fans around here--or just wait until you have permission. Your call.
And yeah, co-writing with one permission-less partner is a thing. See this section of the Permission FAQ article on the wiki for details.
~DF
PS: As an analysis--I've finished reading it, and, well, the good thing is that you've got some interesting concepts in there, and some cool story ideas (as well as generally good spelling and grammar, as I mentioned earlier). The main issues are the constant POV shifts, the cliches and imitations/ripoffs in some of the characters and backstories, and the fact that it's supposedly a movieverse fic but seems to be using what I assume are the book names. As well, it's missing a disclaimer, which FFN fics are supposed to have. Those are the main things I'm seeing; the rest are more minor nitpicks. In short, it's not the worst of the worst--but it's pretty far from the best of the best. I think I probably wouldn't take it on on my own, as I don't think there's much to make my agents angry or to use to make a good story for them, but if you've come up with agents who would be angry at it (or something along those lines), then I'm fairly sure an agent or two of mine would be able to grow a bit by being a sort of amused tag-along. At the very least, I'd be able to write them as semi-relaxed/slowly gaining tension for a change. But yeah--your call. And keep in mind that other people have seen Rise of the Guardians, and may see more mission potential for their agents in this than I do. -
The Grease soundtrack? by
on 2014-02-10 02:00:00 UTC
Link to this
I actually do have a concept for an agent who is a massive Jack Frost fan, so she'd probably be rather violently angry about this. As for co-writing with you, that is certainly a possibility. As a middle-schooler, I've got nights mostly free; I don't know how old you are. Of course, if you don't want to, that's okay.
About the names, those aren't bookverse names for Tooth and Baby Tooth. Those are names I found on the Internet that I thought fit. I don't know, I was rather awful a year or so ago. I have absolutely no excuse for Isolda or the cliches.
What should be done about Primoris? It's an obvious Villain Stu, but unless you've got some seriously OP agents they probably couldn't kill it. Maybe that's just the Suethor talking, though.
What's weird is that when I look back, I think I had a much better idea in my head that I wasn't talented enough to write. -
Personally... by
on 2014-02-03 04:19:00 UTC
Link to this
I just have very little interest in badfic posts in general, regardless of fandom. There are constantly new badfic posts being added to the pile, despite many admonishments to reply to a preexisting badfic thread rather than starting a new one, so there's this trend of bad writing being implicitly treated as more important than good, intelligent discussions. This annoys me. Also, most badfic is not that unique or interesting—that's part of what makes it bad, after all—so it takes more than a generic list of common failings to convince me it'll be worth my time to mock.
Please don't take this personally. I have these problems with almost every new badfic post, not just this one, and it's nothing to do with the fandom or the fact that it's your own fic. Since you wanted to know why people aren't biting, I felt like explaining my reasons.
~Neshomeh, jaded old-timer. -
Let's compare walking sticks! by
on 2014-02-03 16:33:00 UTC
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My problem with badfic posts in general is somewhat different: I have a hard time getting worked up about any badfic these days. I guess in part that's because we've had people deal with so much ludicrously over-the-top stuff - including, yes, me with Clbr__n and l-by-l - that there's not really a 'worse' to hit. "This time twice as many canons are brutalised!" Yeah, but that just means it's the same, but twice as long.
The thing I do occasionally still get worked up on is people messing up, not the characters, but the backstory. So when they blithely assume they can bring Luthien forward in time from her first death and nothing will change - yeah, that gets me. Oh, so does meddling with Finrod, but that's just me.
But even then, that's almost entirely in Middle-earth. Other canons, I don't really get angry about. It's a bit sad, really.
(Oh, and in this case, I don't even know the canon. But as a generic explanation...)
hS -
Mine has a knob on the end; does yours? by
on 2014-02-03 19:43:00 UTC
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(I'm lying. I don't actually own a walking stick. But I used to, and it did: a big greenish metallic marble.)
But yeah, there's that, too. Most things don't make me angry anymore, and if they do, I don't even necessarily want to deal with them, because being angry is no fun. I actually had a problem for the longest time where I was afraid to PPC in LotR, both for that reason and because I wasn't sure I could do it justice, not having done all the background reading like it seemed everyone else here had. ^_^;
Anyway, I tend to look for things that make me laugh at the ridiculousness. Most of "Ring Child" and "Blood Raining Night" fall into this category (except where they overstep right into disturbing and/or offensive). It's the specific word choices or faults in the logic that make funny mistakes happen, though, not the broad flaws. It's not just that Aragorn, Elrond, and Gandalf are OOC; it's that these wise and noble heroes are all cooing over some doe-eyed childthing and dandling it on their knees like little old ladies. It's not just that there are SPaG problems; it's that putting an h in the word "sitting" makes another real word that has the same function in the sentence, but an entirely different outcome. I require absurd mental images in my sporking material. (It may be telling that the only fic I claim scarred me for life was due to gross and persistent misuse of the word "as" rather than any content issues. It still hurts my brain.)
Also, anything I choose to spork has to make a good story for my characters. If it's not going to push their particular buttons, there's no point in writing about it, because it will be boring.
~Neshomeh -
My thoughts. by
on 2014-02-04 04:24:00 UTC
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I was working on a response to this post, but it appears you and hS beat me to the punch. While the both of you have covered what I wanted to address for the most part, I still want to put my two cents forward.
I've never been one for getting angry about badfic. Even when I first started in the PPC, my interest lay more in being entertaining and keeping my writing sharp than addressing the worst of the worst. Like Nesh, I always looked for stories that had some aspect about them that I could make funny or dramatic or otherwise interesting for an audience. The few times I tried to write out of frustration regarding what happened in the story, the results were weak and unfulfilling.
Part of the problem with using anger as driving force behind a mission is that it sort of requires the audience to know enough about the canon itself to share your anger. If they don't know or care about what's been altered beyond 'Wow, that seemed really bad!', they're not going to be all that committed to what goes on. Focusing on entertainment allows you to find more universal concepts that people can latch on to as being funny or dramatic. People don't need to know the nitty-gritty of canon to recognize the fault in an inadvertent goblin orgy in the mines of Moria or a walking talking zombie-killing sandwich.
Think about Mystery Science Theater 3000 (if you have no idea what I'm talking about, there are episodes on Netflix and YouTube that you can watch). The worst movies didn't necessarily make the best episodes. Monster A Go Go, even with Joel and the bots, is something of a tired slog. Even Manos can be a bit of a chore. But The Final Sacrifice or Hobgoblins? They have big hooks perfect for mockery. (Obviously this is all very subjective, as humor tends to be.)
P.S.: I don't have a walking stick, but I do have a cane with a brass duck's head for a handle. There used to be a tiny flask hidden inside (accessed by unscrewing the handle) but alas, it broke.
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Can we make our own Ring of Power? by
on 2014-02-02 15:32:00 UTC
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Sauron could do it, Saruman is rumoured to do it, what stopped us? Other than lack of knowledge of course.
Throughout reading the Silmarillion, it seems like you only need technical or magical knowhow to craft a ring to project and perhaps amplify your power and skills throughout the world. But elves and humans may have restrictions on utilising the knowledge.
You need to pour your spirit into the ring to make one, so you have a very high risk of death. Or maybe human spiritual power is too paltry, so what we pour into the ring my only make us powerful enough as before we make the ring, making it pointless.
Or maybe there are essential ingredients on making the ring that is known to the Elves and Sauron, but humans have no access to. Repeating the same process without the ingredient may kill you off.
Or perhaps even the ring is useless after being made, except as a Horcrux. Since we aren't in full control of our spirit. Elves may be better on us on this department, but it maybe like splitting their body, as they live in mortal and spirit realm at the same time.
Now I have three scenarios for what would happen:
1. The ring amplifies the person's power, making him a proper human sorcerer. He may have amplified diplomacy skill, strength, agility, even lighter forms of prediction due to their enhanced ability to calculate the probabilities of anything happening.
2. The ring is useless when they use it, but when given to another person, they my become more and more like them. Give it to the right person, I'm thinking somewhere along the lines of US Presidents, Google CEOs, or even the Pope himself, and in a few years, the ringmaker's plan will come into fruition.
3. It's just plain useless except as a Horcrux. But it activates when the ringmaker dies and directly controls the body of the wearer.
What do you guys think? A good story can be made from either three scenarios. Although 3 is oft repeated already. -
Hmm. by
on 2014-02-04 07:01:00 UTC
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tl;dr: I don't think so.
In Tolkien's work, we see a huge distinction being drawn between the magic of the elves (and good, in general) and that of Sauron - in fact, the hobbits get called out on using the same word for both. The elves use their gifts for creation and sub-creation, producing new things to enrich the world. On the other hand, Sauron uses his power to control and corrupt. It's very telling that one of the first signs we get that the Numenorians are slipping under his influence is their thirst for immortality - desiring control of their own destinies by staving off death.
Of the Great Rings (the one, the three, the seven, and the nine), it's pretty clear that the ones Sauron had a hand in (the seven and the nine) exist to serve Sauron's power. The seven, perhaps not as much - although I'd be inclined to give that credit more to the dwarves, who were built to withstand the worst of Morgoth's evil, than to the rings themselves. I haven't seen anything regarding what happened to the smiths of those rings, but the size of the numbers and the similarities of the end result make me suspect that each of them definitely do not represent a fraction of the spirit of their crafters. They were made with the direct assistance of Sauron, which probably helped significantly.
The One Ring, on the other hand, pretty obviously represents a sizable piece of Sauron. It is arguably the most Powerful magical artifact to ever show up in Middle-Earth, and unquestionably heads that list if we remove artifacts made by the Valar themselves.
All but three of the Great Rings were produced by, or with the direct assistance of, Sauron. Much as I hate to say it, I doubt that our hypothetical human ring-smiths come close to his abilities or potential to produce power.
The three were, as I'm sure you are aware, not forged with Sauron's help. Celebrimbor, the second-greatest crafts-elf ever, made them on his own. As tends to be the case with Tolkien, his parents are important - he's the grandson of Feanor by way of Curufin, who was the most like his father. Celbrimbor's journeyman piece was a dragon's hoard of jewels, produced over the span of forty years in Nargothrond. Sadly, Glaurung showed up to provide the dragon for the aforementioned hoard, and we all know how that ended.
It's pretty clearly stated that the elves of Eregion during the second age were only outclassed in creative ability by Feanor himself, and Celebrimbor was the leading light of that group. He was very much his grandfather's grandson (even down to creating a set of three artifacts that Evil would go to great lengths to claim). Given that the three are distinct artifacts, made by the same smith, I rather doubt that any of them cost him part of his spirit, beyond what any artist puts into their masterwork.
As an aside - it's interesting to note that of the three bearers of the Three, they had three very different uses for their rings, and three different reactions to being offered the One Ring. Elrond, who did not use his ring overtly, was not hugely tempted by the One. Gandalf, who used his ring for Good (the creation of passion and inspiration) had more trouble resisting, but was able to use that to motivate Frodo. Galadriel, however, who had used her ring for the preservation of Lorien (see earlier notes on Numenor and the slide from preservation to control to corruption), had a significant struggle when offered the Ring, and spelled out in no uncertain terms what would happen if she claimed it. Anyways, back to the story.
The Great Rings were all either made with the direct assistance of a Maia, or by the greatest ring-smith of the age (and the second-greatest craftsman of all time). In comparison... humans really don't match up very well. There are some impressive feats of construction in human history (Orthanc and Minas Tirith, for example), but nothing that comes close to the artifacts created by the elves.
Thematically, great works of Creation aren't really a human thing - the Valar and Elves create great works, but to the humans are given the nebulous "other gifts" that aren't really explained beyond dying. We never see humans create even the most minor of artifacts of power, let alone something deserving a capitalized title or a place among the Great Rings.
So, no. I don't think that a human could make a Ring of Power, or even a ring of power. We never see humans using magic directly in LoTR (or the additional volumes, to my understanding), and even if one could, I doubt that any ring created by one would serve as more than a focusing device for their innate power. -
Humans and magic. by
on 2014-02-06 17:02:00 UTC
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Or rather, Edain and magic, since we know next to nothing about the Middle Men and Men of Darkness.
The biggest exception to 'men don't use magic' is the Druedain - the Drugs, or Woses, or Wild Men, or what have you. There's a lovely (if rather strange) story called The Faithful Stone, in which one of this sub-race of humanity imbues a stone effigy with his spirit, to the point where it can defend a house - but he suffers from its burns. That's a key point to remember when your spirit is involved - whatever happens to it, happens to you. Sauron found that out the hard way.
Other than that... there's the unusual case of Isildur's curse on the men of the White Mountains, which had the effect of binding their spirits to a location after they died. Again, we're looking at tying a soul to an object - the same trick used by Sauron to make the One, and, if I'm right, to power the Nine and Seven, and give the Three their abilities. So, in theory, at least one man (Isildur) and one race (the Druedain) have abilities that could allow them to make rings of power.
Except... there is nothing else comparable. The Witch-King has powerful magic - he broke the gate of Minas Tirith with lightning or somesuch - but he is augmented by a Ring, and by Sauron. Men of Numenor can make an indestructible form of black rock (Orthanc, the wall of Minas Tirith) - but we don't know if that's magic or engineering. And the only other magic I can think of is Elendil, who somehow locked one of his Palantiri so it could only look West - but that might be as simple as setting the thing in concrete so you can't rotate it.
Other than that, Mannish skill seems to lie in augmentation, not magic. Numenorean blades - like those found in the Barrow - are strong, light, and capable of wounding a body located in the Unseen realm... but is that magic, or craft?
Then, of course, you have Beorn, and the Beornings. They have a magical ability to transform into bears - but it's a difficult one to fit into the grand scheme of things. ;)
hS
(May try and write a more fully-researched version of this at some point; dunno) -
Those restrictions all seem to not be based on ability. by
on 2014-02-04 08:43:00 UTC
Link to this
From the looks of what you said, the Elves have better knowledge of how to craft magical items than humans as their default state, and the Maiar are more capable of creating magical items because they themselves are magic, whether that magic is the good or evil sort. Thus, if a human were hypothetically given the knowledge on how to infuse the rings with power, possibly by a particularly ambitious Elf or Maiar who planned to use the new Ring or Rings for their own purposes, there wouldn't be much stopping the humans from creating the Ring as long as they had smiths who were good at what they do. And there's really nothing saying there wouldn't be anyone who was. In fact, some of the advantages that humans have over Elves are industry and versatility. They might not have the ability to produce the most powerful items in the world, but they'd certainly be capable of optimizing what they can do if given the knowledge and resources to do so.
Of course, where they would get the power to infuse the Ring with becomes the bigger question. A magical being could just infuse the ring with a portion of their own essence, but as has been said elsewhere on this thread, humans probably would not be able to use their own power, simply because they wouldn't have enough to do anything useful. I wonder, though, if a crafter might be capable of tapping into the essence of many people at once while creating a Ring. A lone human wouldn't be able to infuse much energy into a Ring, and would probably die trying, but if a skilled enough smith infuses the Ring with portions of the latent power of an entire city, it could conceivably wrack up plenty of stored energy, enough to create a magical artifact that people would almost certainly refer to with capital letters. Of course, the act of leaching away people's spiritual energy to power a magical artifact would be inherently evil, but no one ever said that the smith in question got his Ring-making knowledge from the good guys. -
That's not what I'm saying... by
on 2014-02-05 04:48:00 UTC
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Magic, and especially magical artifacts, in Lord of the Rings does not work like conventional fantasy magic. The magical artifacts we see in the books were mostly created by Very Exceptional People - Aule (a Valar), Sauron (A Maiar), Feanor (the greatest craftsman to ever live), and Celebrimbor (the second-greatest craftsman to ever live). By the time you've left that incredibly rarified circle of craftsmen, you're down to magical artifacts that, at best, glow when enemies are around - and even those were created by master smiths of the greatest Elvish kingdom of Middle-Earth.
In comparison of ability at creating magical artifacts, there are no humans in Canon who can be described as "good at what they do". There are none who can be described as "reasonably competent", or even "amateur" - there are, in fact, no humans who create magical artifacts at all. There is no inclination given that humans have any ability in that direction. In fact, the one human who is described as having "the hands of a healer" - Aragorn - gets that from his elvish heritage. (And even that is relatively minor - healing goes well when he is involved. No D&D-esque healing spells here.)
And then there's the big-picture theme of the entire world. All of Lord of the Rings is about the Fall - from the religious scale of Morgoth's greed and evil down through Feanor and his sons, to Saruman and so many other characters in LotR proper. Arda is a land scarred from evil, anything but the beautiful vision that the Valar had before the dawn of time. The entire series follows this fall, as Arda slips from the grand, beautiful, and magical, into the mundane and human. This falling motion and humans' place in it makes me very, very skeptical of the thought that humans could Create magical artifacts of any sort.
So, no. It's not that elves have "better knowledge". It's that humans in LoTR don't work that way. LoTR itself doesn't work that way - fitting "and then humans made a Ring of Power, yay?" into it is pretty solidly against the theme of the world. -
Yes, but... by
on 2014-02-05 03:36:00 UTC
Link to this
...that leaves the question of controlling the Ring. When Sauron created the One Ring, he poured enough of his life force into it to make it immensely powerful. In the process, though, he also infused it with his own willpower, which creared no end of issues for Frodo and Co. Taking a bit of life force from a wide spectrum of people could actually weaken the Ring's power, if that many diluted willpowers were constantly struggling for dominance within it.
I'm doing a poor job of explaining.
Into each Ring went not only the maker's magic, but a bit of their personality as well. That's how Sauron influenced the Ringbearers. That's how he revealed Isildur in the river and turned all four Bearers against their own allies. How would the combination of a city's worth of personalities affect the power of a Ring? How would it influence the wearer if the wills of the maker's victims were at odds with one another? -
Ooh, you're right. by
on 2014-02-05 21:14:00 UTC
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Not a lot of details were apparently ever revealed about where specifically all but four of the Rings came from, but according to the Tolkien wikis I found, it's Sauron's unified consciousness that gives the twenty capital-letter Rings their power, because he was the one who told the original creators of the Rings how to craft them, and this connection to Sauron was so strong that they began to lose their magic when he was dethroned. Even if there's a possibility to make a Ring without inadvertently linking it with some Ainur's mind, which is complete speculation, if the force holding its magic in place is a chaotic mass of partial minds, that Ring's power would be disparate and lessened at best. More likely than not, since none of the constituent minds would have had much magical power to speak of, the new Ring's magic level would be negligible to nil.
I'm not sure how telling someone how to create something gives the person who provided the blueprints power over the finished product, but that's the way magic works in the Lord of the Rings universe, I suppose. I spoke from an ignorance of the details. -
I'm curious. by
on 2014-02-06 09:21:00 UTC
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Where did you (plural you) get the idea that all Rings of Power are created by implanting some of the maker's power into them? The only Ring that was ever said of was the One - which Sauron specifically created to control the others. The imbue-it-with-your-power trick was also used by Melkor on the whole of Middle-earth (rather harder to destroy, but also rather more diffuse).
I've never gotten the impression that the Sixteen were imbued with a person's power - or Sauron's specifically - and we flat-out know Sauron had nothing to do with the Three.
I suspect the wikis you found were referring to the corrupting power of the Rings. The reason the Sixteen enslaved people is because a) Sauron maybe put in a back door when he helped forge them, and b) the One was deliberately designed to control all the others. The Three, of course, didn't enslave their bearers - look at Narya, which was quite happily passed from Celebrimbor to Gil-Galad to Cirdan to Gandalf.
We know very little about how the Rings were forged, and what the nature of their power was - but I'm pretty sure we can safely say that stuffing your personality into it like a bejewelled horcrux was not part of the deal, unless you're a Dark Lord making one in your evil volcano fortress. I think even Celebrimbor would have baulked at splitting his mind into twenty (or many, many more - remember the lesser rings!) different fragments.
hS -
On Bejewled Horcruxes by
on 2014-02-06 20:26:00 UTC
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You're correct in saying that not all the rings were made Horcrux-style as Sauron's were, but seeing as that's the only method that was revealed in the canon, wouldn't that be the method we used as well? There are definitely other ways to do it, but not that Tolkien disclosed (to my knowledge, anyway).
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Are you saying that we don't need our souls inside it? by
on 2014-02-06 11:42:00 UTC
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This is my understanding of how they work. by
on 2014-02-06 15:37:00 UTC
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The Rings of Power, on Netilardo.
The summary version: the Rings of Power, fuelled by their bearer's desires, link themselves to said bearer (thus providing the bearer with immortality) and either shift the bearer entirely into the Unseen realm (the Sixteen and the One), or simply provide a conduit (the Three). Once given access to the Unseen - the realm of spirits - the bearers are essentially able to manipulate souls with their bare hands, which is pretty darn magical. Of course, when you come back, you leave a little of your body behind - and the Rings don't just use your desires, they amplify them...
I've tried, in the long version, to bring in all the known powers of the Rings and link them into the theory. I think it works.
hS -
Since it appears that you're still working on Netilardo, by
on 2014-02-06 18:27:00 UTC
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Is there enough information to do an entry on the Watcher in the Water?
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There's always enough information. by
on 2014-02-07 10:43:00 UTC
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What is the Watcher in the Water? Gandalf - the person most likely to know - has no idea; his only contribution is that 'the arms were all guided by one purpose' (obviously), and that he thinks it came from under the mountains. Surely we can do better than that!
A Giant Spider
Gandalf's description of the Watcher as 'older and fouler... than Orcs' suggests some form of primordial terror, of which the only one we know by name is Ungoliant. Like the Watcher, she possessed many legs (though admittedly, not the twenty seen on the Watcher). Many spiders can survive underwater for significant lengths of time - could the Watcher be one of Ungoliant's spawn, sister to Shelob, acclimated to its watery home after thousands of years?
Eh... probably not, in all honesty. But it seemed like an interesting idea.
The larval/adult form of the Fell Beasts
The other (nameless) creatures from the beginning of time are the fell beasts (Tolkien never capitalises it) ridden by the Nazgul. Could it be that, like mosquitos, they begin their life as a water-bound monstrosity, before shaking off the tentacled larval form and taking to the air? Or, alternately, could they shed their wings and settle into a sedentary lifestyle, feeding on passers-by?
Again, it seems unlikely - but at least the metamorphosis would explain the differences in appearance.
A Naiad
Or, more accurately, the nature-spirit of the Sirannon, a relative of Goldberry (the river-spirit of the Withywindle). We know that nature-spirits, or incarnations of landforms, can become malevolent - Caradhras - and even prehensile - Old Man Willow. It may be that, when the Sirannon became dammed, forming a massive stagnant lake, its spirit too became corrupted. Having previously used a humanoid or other form - or maybe even no corporeal form at all - it could have taken on a new aspect: a many-tentacled creature, 'pale-green and luminous and wet'.
The main problem with this theory is time. We know the Sirannon was free-flowing when Gandalf passed through Moria, sometime between 2850 and 2950. We know it was blocked by 2990, when Balin's Colony encountered the Watcher. Is less than 150 years long enough for a nature spirit to turn to evil, when it is already tens of thousands of years old? It seems rather unlikely. Apart from that, though, this is probably the most plausible theory, in terms of the way Arda works. The final theory, however, is far more thematically appropriate.
The Balrog
The Fellowship encounter three monsters in Moria. First, the Watcher under discussion. Second, the creature which duelled with Gandalf at Balin's tomb - the sorcerous shadow which nearly defeated him. Finally, the Balrog, Durin's Bane.
The latter two of these creatures are identical. Could the third one be, as well?
We know that the Watcher was more intelligent than it appears: Gandalf notes (to himself) that it reached first for Frodo the Ringbearer, suggesting a degree of magical sensitivity. We also know that the Balrog was cleverer than it looked - while it acts as little more than a monster at the Bridge, it earlier used magic as powerful as Gandalf's. Is it significant that the Watcher is said to have been sleeping at the far end of the lake? Could it, in fact, have still been partly asleep?
It is significant, in light of this theory, that Pippin aroused the Balrog by dropping a stone down a well. Wells don't usually lead to underground caverns full of orcs - they lead to underground streams. After four days, the Watcher/Balrog may have convinced itself that it had imagined the Fellowship - until a pebble came clattering down onto its head as it roamed through the waterways.
Thematically, it seems appropriate for the only monster to be the Balrog - and it also displays a very specific path through its attributes. Consider:- The Balrog, at Balin's tomb, is a creature of shadow.
- At the Bridge, the Balrog bursts into flame.
- On the Bridge, we read that 'The fire in it seemed to die, but the darkness grew'; it reverts to shadow.
- When Gandalf describes his fight with the Balrog underwater, he speaks of it as 'a thing of slime, stronger than a strangling snake'.
- Finally, on the mountaintop, the Balrog bursts back into full flame.
The key point is the 'thing of slime' section: it has no parallel in the story beforehand. It takes place underwater, and describes the Balrog as snake-like. This description doesn't fit the Balrog - but it matches exactly what we know of the Watcher in the Water. Furthermore, by placing the Watcher at the beginning of the sequence, we form a perfect, symmetric pattern: first slime and water, then shadow, then flame, then shadow again, and finally back to slime and water before the climactic battle. Thematically - and mythologically - it works very well.
Of course, this theory neatly invalidates an argument about Balrog wings made by the Encyclopedia of Arda: that we can draw an analogy with tentacles. There's absolutely no evidence for Balrog tentacles, and its safe to presume that they didn't form any part of a Balrog's anatomy...
hS -
Beliefs in spirits and 'pagan' deities are still here... by
on 2014-02-06 16:23:00 UTC
Link to this
In the modern world. So we could have a Maia, still working or dallying around in this world, reveals to a human how the rings of power was made. Then the human tried to remake a new ring of power, but instead someone unsavoury occurs. And the ring becomes a series of horror movies, not to be confused with The Ring.
The Eastern worlds, whether Asian, Australian, Polynesian, or numerous others, are still connected to their mythology, so they could meet some spirits along the way. Base on Our-World-as-The-Seventh-Age hypothesis. If you read a few stories of orang bunian, you may find uncanny similarities with Tolkien's Quendi.
'Sorcery' could also literally be deceits, such as politicking, lying, manipulation, and social engineering. -
Wait, I'm confused. by
on 2014-02-06 21:04:00 UTC
Link to this
I managed to find out what you were saying regarding a Seventh Age fairly quickly(and on a related note, the numbering system is off for whoever decided these Ages. The first set of Ages that were given names lasted for centuries at a time, and the supposed "Sixth Age" only lasted for less than fifty years, with no huge world-shift between the alleged Sixth and Seventh as happened before the beginning of any preceding Ages), but I'm not sure what you're describing here. A Maia survivor meets a human several thousand years after the elves sailed away and the dwarves presumably went extinct, teaches him how to make a ring, but someone interrupts him partway through, and then the partial ring becomes a successful horror movie director? I feel like I'm missing a couple of steps here. Did someone put on the ring, unwittingly tap into its Maia progenitor's dark history, and use that knowledge to create the franchise? Is it the same guy who interrupted the Ring-making process?
This entire line of thought has given me a mental image of a group of Maia discreetly mingling with humans for millennia, only for a few of their number deciding one day to try and market the history of their species as a television series. They would have only the faintest idea of how the process works, and there would probably be some shenanigans as they try to prevent themselves from vaporizing some sleazy entertainment executives and try to secure the most accurate reproduction of their history. People want to change things, but they don't want to allow it, because it's history, but the people adapting the series wouldn't know that it was history. More shenanigans! Wait, no, the humans probably would know about at least some of these events. Wouldn't there be some kind of fossil record of all of the fell beasts and giant dragons and mysterious really short people? Would it just be covered up by some sort of nebulous government body, and the Maia's attempt to produce their television series unwittingly attracts the attention of that group, who have realized that one of the new shows in development is striking a little too close to the truth to be coincidence, and the Maia would need to juggle the production of their new show while on the run from the men in black?
...
I've been away from the computer for about twenty minutes, and when I came back, I reread my post before sending it, to check for spelling errors and such, and I came to a realization. That entire spiel up there, about the Maia television show, is an incredibly terrible idea. I'd delete it, but my post would be bland without it, and I find its awfulness genuinely amusing. -
Oh, but there is a huge world-shift. by
on 2014-02-07 00:43:00 UTC
Link to this
This is Tolkien's modern world, remember? Now, draw upon your knowledge of world history and tell me a hugely-important world shifting event that happened in the last 65 years or so? In, say... 1945? That went bang?
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On the ends of Ages. by
on 2014-02-07 09:55:00 UTC
Link to this
Contrary to popular opinion, the end of the Second Age did not come with the Downfall of Numenor and the reshaping of the world (though it really should have, considering); it actually lasted another 120 years or so, until the fall of Sauron.
In fact, all three Ages we know about the end of are terminated by a) massive war, and b) the overthrow of a Dark Lord. The First Age ended with the fall of a rebel Vala, while the Second and Third were both Maiar (actually, the same Maia).
To quote a wiki, 'Tolkien said in a letter written in 1958 that he believed the Ages had quickened and that it was about the end of the Sixth Age/beginning of the Seventh.' I'm pretty sure that's accurate, since I remember reading it myself in Letters.
As wobbles has suggested, that immediately evokes a particular idea for the end of the Sixth Age - World War II. If we assume the 'Dark Lord' paradigm remains in play, it looks like Hitler is in Sauron's shoes.
(I'm actually dubious about this - I seem to recall Tolkien being more contemptuous than scared of Hitler. But it does fit the timeline)
Tolkien also said that the events of the War of the Ring were around 6000 years ago. That gives us the following dates:
Creation of the World: 5000 Valian Years before sunrise = 47910 solar years = 60954 years ago
Creation of the Two Trees: 14,325 solar years in length = 27369 years ago.
Sun rises: 13044 years ago
Second Age begins: 12460 years ago
Third Age begins: 9019 years ago
Fourth Age begins: 6000 years ago
Fifth Age begins: ?
Sixth Age begins: ?
Seventh Age begins: 1945
The lengths of the ages with known lengths (I discount the First, because it may well be the full 48000+ years between creation and the fall of Angband) are:
II: 3441 years
III: 3019 years
IV + V + VI: 6000 years.
Knowing what we do about Tolkien, can I propose that the Fifth Age ended with the crucifixion and resurrection of Christ? That is, to Tolkien's worldview, the defeat of Death and/or Satan. That would allow us the following dates:
II: 10515 BC - 7074 BC (3441 years)
III: 7074 BC - 4055 BC (3019 years)
IV: 4055 BC - ? (BC)
V: ? (BC) - AD 33
VI: AD 33 - AD 1945 (1912 years)
And would you believe it - that makes a straight-line graph of length/number. The equation comes out as y (length) = -379x + 4180. Applying that gives us the Fifth and Fourth Ages:
IV: 2664 years, or 4055 BC - 1391 BC
V: 2285 years, about 800 years too long for the 1391 BC - AD 33 slot. ;) So it's not perfect (or rather, it implies that the end of the Third Age was more like seven thousand years ago), but it gives us a ballpark - the IV - V switchover happened somewhere in the 1600-1300 BC region.
Anyone want to track down a Dark Lord in there somewhere? I note that traditional chronology dates the Biblical Exodus to between 1500-1300 BC...
hS
PS: This discussion mentions a length of 2500 years for the Fourth Age, which is actually pretty darn close to my calculation. Hmm... -
This isn't perfect, but... by
on 2014-02-07 11:45:00 UTC
Link to this
I did some digging, and some scholars purport that Moses was born in 1393 BC. Perhaps that theory about the Exodus isn't so far off the mark...
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Somehow it's extremely close enough. by
on 2014-02-06 21:36:00 UTC
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What I'm trying to say is this:
A person walking in his native locality finds the spirit, or Maia, that his people have been venerating/celebrating for centuries. They often talk to the Maia until one day, the Maia decides to teach him RingMaking. He makes the ring...
[Actually, being interrupted at critical stage of the Ring-making process is good enough. A misstep in spells, or even esoteric prayers, often demands the same rituals to be restarted from the beginning. Or you will have repercussions, or have to give out pengeras or something.]
... then he wears it on. Something terrible happened to him that drive him mad, kill him, or put him under direct control of the Maia itself, even.
Then the ring falls into numerous hands, who all died, but puts some of themselves into the ring in the process. One day, the ring gains full sentience, and relays its story to its next wearer. The person, who is the first one ever able to weild the ring without harm, sets off to use it to write creepy stories based on what the ring told him, and the title of his series are called The Ring, not to be confused with the frightening movie already in the market, The Ring.
[That's what I'm trying to say. But I think a Maia-run TV show would be an interesting idea. Not to mention the ensuing battle between Tolkien scholars, government, religious figures, and everyday Joes and Janes once they realise what they have researched is not what is actually happened in their world.] -
I don't believe so. by
on 2014-02-06 14:02:00 UTC
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But everyone seems to disagree, so I was wondering why.
I'm working on a 'Not-so-crackpot Theory' essay for Netilardo discussing what exactly we know about the Rings; I'll see if it turns out to be relevant.
hS -
Re: Ooh, you're right. by
on 2014-02-05 22:27:00 UTC
Link to this
Thanks for rewording that. Your explanation made much more sense than mine. :D
I still like the idea of drawing from multiple sources, though. The PPC has access to all sorts of magic and technology that isn't canonical to LotR. What if you drew power from sources without free will, like magical plants, artifacts, zombie hordes, or freshly brainswept bit characters? -
Yeah, but it wouldn't be a Tolkienverse Ring of Power then. by
on 2014-02-06 02:21:00 UTC
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If we use extracanonical sources of magic, and infuse them with the resources available in the Lord of the Rings, it wouldn't make an item native to either the Tolkienverse or whichever other continua the extracanonical influences were drawn from. It would be a multi-universal magical artifact, which is a pretty cool idea, but not what the thread was really asking about.
I'm not saying it would be impossible, though. To the contrary, picking multiple magic systems to use in an artifact's creation could lead to one system covering another's weaknesses, and a skilled magic-user could potentially create far more powerful enchantments than either system could alone because of that. It just wouldn't be the same sort of item.
Rings with mystical power exist throughout the multiverse, but they can operate under vastly different rules depending on who created them, in which continuum, and why they are being used. Just bringing in any extranormal ring from an outside source into Middle-earth isn't going to make it a Ring of Power, no matter how cool a Green Lantern Aragorn would be. -
Whoops, sorry. by
on 2014-02-06 02:28:00 UTC
Link to this
Well, that changes matters quite a bit! I'd assumed the thread was talking about a Generic Ring of Power for the PPC based on the rules of the Tolkienverse, not a Ring that could actually fit into the canon. Guess I didn't read closely enough.
I suppose you could draw power from unsavory canonical creatures, like Wargs, who lack free will. -
Or... by
on 2014-02-06 02:36:00 UTC
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...would the Ring then be controlled by a jumble of Warg animal instincts, rendering it utterly useless except in the instigation of riots?
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Either that or it would just drive its wielder insane. by
on 2014-02-06 02:51:00 UTC
Link to this
If exposure to a ring housing a portion of Sauron's consciousness turns someone evil by sending the sheer forceful presence and powerful will of a Dark Lord into the wearers body via skin-to-Ring contact, exposure to a Ring that directly connects a mind to a mess of frenzied thoughts and animal emotions that were pulled into the ring in the Wargs' final moments would send all of that tumult rushing into the mind of its user. Nobody would be able to wear that for more than a few minutes at most before losing it completely and running around at random, using whatever power the Warg-ring would give on anything that moves.
We would need someone of unexpected fearlessness and unprecedented power to go toe-to-toe with the Warg-ringed maniac and bring them down for the good of all Middle-earth. We would need... Green Lantern Aragorn.
(I'm so sorry, I just cannot get that idea out of my head.) -
This isn't Green Lantern Aragorn, but I think it's okay. by
on 2014-02-06 14:11:00 UTC
Link to this
-=BEING AN ACCOUNT OF THE LOST RING AND THE THIRD LAMP=-
At the dawn of the world, it is written that the Valar found Arda dim and featureless, a vast plain with neither life nor colour. They thus collected what little light was around and forged the Lamps for them, set in the great towers of Ringol and Helcar, and retired to the island in the centre of Arda to enjoy their paradise before Morgoth the Destroyer sundered their towers and ended those days.
But Illuin and Ormal were not the only Lamps...
Aule, the master smith of the Ainur, who loved creation for the sake of creating, did not wish to wait for the Quendi (as the Elves were once named) to arrive to pass on the secrets of smithing and the working of metal. Thus, in his secret places, he began to forge his own race of beings, who would later be called Dwarves. While he worked upon them, the chaos Melkor wrought upon Arda was felt far away, across space and time itself, and the dedication of Aule to overcome fear and darkness was lauded by those yet unknown to the Valar.
To Arda traveled one who was named Helma-luin in Quenya, but in his own tongue was called Guardian, and he came to pay homage to Aule. The great Ship of Helma-luin that travelled to Arda came through the skies over Arda as might a bird, and was silent and arrived unseen. He bade Aule meet him in secret, charging him with the safety of a third Lamp, which Aule named Laiture. It was Helma-luin who also brought the first great Ring to Arda, and he made Aule swear never to share his knowledge of this Ring with another, nor to submit it to the will of Iluvatar. This angered Aule greatly but he still gave his word that the Ring and the Lamp would stay secret, for as Helma-luin said, he was bound only to submit his own creations to Iluvatar, and Laiture and the Ring were made by the master-smiths of Helma-luin's own people, given as gifts only to those worthy of their power.
With the Ring of Laiture safe, Helma-luin parted and never again was seen in the Years of the Lamps, nor any Ages thereafter. Aule sought to understand the magic of the Ring, which he named Niraturne, for the wondrous Ring of Helma-luin bade whatever the wielder might imagine come into being as a spirit of green light. It was through the power of Niraturne that Aule fashioned the race of Dwarves, but when he made to smite them was when Eru Iluvatar discovered the Lamp and the Ring that had been given to the Valar. Aule threw himself upon the mercy of Eru, told his story, and the Supreme Being was touched. The Seven Fathers of the Dwarves were spared and Aule was allowed to keep Niraturne and Laiture to himself, and this was well.
When Melkor attacked and spilled the Two Lamps, the power of Niraturne was unleashed to hold back the tide of devastation. Aule remembered his vow to keep his Ring a secret, and so used it to create impregnable armour and the mightiest of hammers, which he named Sulendam. It was with this hammer that the doors of Utumno were smote in the War of the Powers and the chain Angainor forged, and this was in part how the other Valar came to know of the ring Niraturne and the hidden Lamp Laiture.
For when the Lamps were sundered and the misty light of the beginning spilled back upon the ground, Aule lit the way for the other Valar with Laiture, which he held in his right hand until the damage was repaired. He told the story of Helma-luin to the others, and they believed him, for they knew it was not in the nature of Aule to lie or deceive.
Laiture's light was used to grow the Two Trees and help construct the citadels and fastnesses of Valinor, and thereafter it was locked away. Niraturne, however, was instrumental in the creation of the Silmarils and the Jewels, and when they were taken the Friend of the Noldor was greatly fearful, for what if the Dark Enemy had taken Laiture and destroyed it? Thus, though Sulendam would never be carried in battle, Aule used it to beat the swords and shields of those who would fight in the War of Wrath, and it was he who persuaded the Valar to aid Earendil, for Vingilot's passage through the air reminded him of happier days when Helma-luin's sky-ship had come.
After the War of Wrath was ended and Morgoth cast through the Door of Night, it was decided by Eonwe that the power of Laiture and Niraturne was too great for even an Ainu to wield. Thus, they were cast into the sea by Aule, but both the Lamp and the Ring rose up, spiralling past the Walls of the World and out into the Timeless Void. The Valar were fearful of this, for what if Morgoth discovered them and used them to break his bonds and return? But this was not so, and nor would it be so, for the people of Helma-luin were wise and had bade the Ring and Lamp seek out only those who were doers of good and noble deeds. And so passed the last of the Lamps and the first of the Rings from the world, and whither they have gone not even Eru Iluvatar can know.
---
I hope this isn't too awful; it's been a long time since I read The Silmarillion and most of the names were cooked up from likely-misunderstood Quenya. And yes, symmetry was greatly important, nine shall be the number of your counting, et cetera, et cetera, but this was the best place to fit something like a Green Lantern ring and its attendant power battery.
Thank you for reading. =]
NO FLAMMING PLZ EVVEN THO THE FIREYNESS IS SOOOOO PRETTAY LOL NOT SA PRETY AS LEGGOLAS THO LIKE OMG and so on. -
It is a beautiful idea. (nm) by
on 2014-02-06 03:02:00 UTC
Link to this
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OK then. by
on 2014-02-04 08:37:00 UTC
Link to this
"We never see humans using magic directly in LoTR (or the additional volumes, to my understanding), and even if one could, I doubt that any ring created by one would serve as more than a focusing device for their innate power."
This is what I'm going with. A human trying to emulate the actions of Sauron in order to gain great power, but in the end, his method is not working at all, at least not to the extent he's thinking. Thus he had to find a way to find out how to use it anyway.
I'm partly inspired by Code Geass in this regard, where with limited geasses, people could achieve great things if their work for it extremely bad. And extremely bad he works for it, as the world is almost destroyed by his actions' consequences. -
Probably not a good idea. by
on 2014-02-02 21:50:00 UTC
Link to this
While it certainly is possible, you'd better have a good explanation for why it exists. You should also make sure it isn't the equal of the canon rings. Here's the wiki article on it.
http://ppc.wikia.com/wiki/Extra_Rings_of_Power -
Human-made rings, of course it won't as mighty as Maia rings by
on 2014-02-03 05:18:00 UTC
Link to this
At most, it will only enhance one skill at a time. The One Ring could channel much more power than that.
The secret to make an effective villain or hero(!) out of it is how to employ it. Maybe she could date a CEO, giving the ring which will make him more suggestible to her and her minions.
Or as in Limitless, enhancing his own self mentally, but without any side effects(?).
Or maybe the ring is extremely powerful, but the maker and quite a few of his victims died before he could use it.
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Uh... what the...? by
on 2014-02-02 18:19:00 UTC
Link to this
I am honestly not sure what to think of this, so I figured I'd bring it here and let you guys pass judgment:
https://www.fanfiction.net/s/9633218/1/Us-and-Them -
... wut? by
on 2014-02-02 22:19:00 UTC
Link to this
Leaving aside for a moment that Mickey Bricks'd eat this lot for breakfast on his tod, why are these things even crossed over? I mean, I get that they're both shows about conmen (insofar as the wretched meat-propelled haircuts in Swindle's cast can be called men), but this serves no purpose at all. It insults both sets of characters and bashes them together without any real thought put into it. Someone who gives a toss about Leverage, if you're reading this, please make it die.
As an aside, Leverage is a show that exists because the network that set it up didn't want to pay the BBC for the rights to Hustle, which you should watch because it's a much better show. It's a similar origin to noted blob of gull vomit Elementary, though in that case CBS tried and failed to get the license to the BBC's Sherlock and announced Elementary three weeks later. This is, of course, a complete coincidence. Obviously. -
What the heck. by
on 2014-02-02 19:36:00 UTC
Link to this
I couldn't make heads or tails of this thing.
*crawls in a hole and dies*
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No. No. We're still in recovery mode, damnit! by
on 2014-02-02 19:35:00 UTC
Link to this
*sigh*
Dear God.
Okay, does everyone understand what the Gravity Falls fandom has been through? Two incredibly disgusting, NSFW fanfics, the news that there would be a year's hiatus between seasons, and the disappointment that a cool and creepy website apparently had nothing to do with canon.
It's been hard.
And do you know what we needed the very, absolute least?
First Person Psychopath.
Not a joke.
https://www.fanfiction.net/s/9773295/1/There-I-was
I'm just gonna go cry. -
Er, sorry... by
on 2014-02-02 19:54:00 UTC
Link to this
...I just wanted to point out that you've created a badfic thread just below this one. You might want to hold off on creating new report threads if there's already an active one on the main page of the Board...
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Not even gonna... by
on 2014-02-02 19:46:00 UTC
Link to this
After reading 'Dipper Goes to Taco Bell', I don't think I'm brave enough to try that link...
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Permission Request by
on 2014-02-03 03:50:00 UTC
Link to this
My Agents:
PENCHANT is a unicorn bearing a resemblance to Twilight Sparkle, recruited from a My Little Pony badfic, who uses a D.O.R.K.S to maintain a human form. She's a very logical, no-nonsense individual who enjoys knitting, reading, writing, and taking care of strange creatures. She's not too good socially and tends to be blunt, resulting in her not having very many friends. She was partnered with Akishme the Argonian in hopes that she could keep the childish lizard in check. That, surprisingly, was a success, and, as long as Penchant can have alone time once in a while, the two get along great. She gets envious of Akishme's abilities to make friends with just about everyone from time to time, though. They are both in the Department of Floaters.
(More on Penchant here.)
AKISHME is an upbeat Argonian female, who prefers cracking jokes to cracking heads during a mission (though she wouldn't say no to doing both). She comes from Cyrodiil -a shack on the Imperial Waterfront, to be exact- and can be fiercely protective of her home continuum, preferring not to tackle missions concerning the Elder Scrolls world. She will do almost anything to have a good time, often at the expense of others. She has little to no concern for rules; isn't getting around them half the fun anyway? She's an over-confident, fun-loving person, though she is quick to anger if you happen to say all the wrong things. When angry, she's sure to let everybody know, backing up her rage with a handful of magic spells and the blade of her Daedric sword.
(More on Akishme here.)
A sample of my writing can be found here (it was written when I was coming off my Mario Puzo addiction, please bear with me).
I intend to take on Soccer Star extraordinaire as my first mission. -
Well, let's see what we've got. by
on 2014-02-03 04:32:00 UTC
Link to this
A pony and a lizard. Interesting combination. It is nice to see some more non-human agents, though your unicorn seems to like looking human. I like the "no nonsense" vs "rules are meant to be ignored" personalities. No real complaints here.
Your writing sample looks pretty good, if a little bit on the melodramatic side. The SPaG is in good working order. You do have a tendency to repeat information that you just told us, though (the public persona bits in the first few paragraphs, for instance). Keep an eye on that as you continue to write.
As far as your choice of badfic, I applaud the choice to have your Floaters taking on a non-Sue story right out of the gate. Also, did the author forget that these two hold the Crests of Friendship and Courage? Those are supposed to be their strengths, and this author has turned that on its head.
So, final verdict: Permission Granted and happy hunting.
-Phobos -
Congratulations! (nm) by
on 2014-02-05 19:11:00 UTC
Link to this
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Congratulations! (nm) by
on 2014-02-05 03:17:00 UTC
Link to this
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Yay! by
on 2014-02-03 19:59:00 UTC
Link to this
I'm so happy, thank you! I don't know what to say, but I'm excited to begin work on my first mission! I probably won't be excited once I start reading it, though, hah.
Thanks for the congratulations, guys! Means a lot~ -
Well Done! (nm) by
on 2014-02-03 15:48:00 UTC
Link to this
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Congratulations! I can't wait to read your fic! =oD (nm) by
on 2014-02-03 11:25:00 UTC
Link to this
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(I'm so nervous..!) (nm) by
on 2014-02-03 03:52:00 UTC
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I did a fic or possibly-fic-like thing! =oD by
on 2014-02-03 15:34:00 UTC
Link to this
Trigger warnings for rape and serious injuries, both inflicted on children.
I'd like to thank my betas; Neshomeh, Desdenelle, and Ekyl. Their families will be safe from the Great War of the Beast. =]
Anyway, here's the first installment of the Wobbles and Notary PPC Power Hour! (I'll get one of my musician friends to do a theme song at some point. [=)
Hope you like it as much as I enjoyed killing it.
--parp -
Oh, I forgot how utterly creepy Coyote can be *shiver* by
on 2014-02-06 05:17:00 UTC
Link to this
In other news, though, let me just say: I love your agents. They're perfectly mismatched, and play off each other so well, and I think I can sense some character arcs in their futures, maybe?
The mission was wonderful, as well, and you have Coyote so very perfectly. My one quibble was that, since I haven't seen the badfic, and you didn't put many quotes in, I didn't really get a sense of some parts and it occasionally felt rushed. But really, I understand completely why you censored. I think I prefer it that way, actually.
All in all, amazing first mission!
-Aila -
Re: Mission by
on 2014-02-06 04:30:00 UTC
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the personalities of your agents really shined through here, which was especially useful on this mission, since the necessity to censor the most problematic content left the agents' actions and dialogue to carry the story. For this first mission, you managed to both get across the basic characteristics of both agents, but also to show the types of situations that make their usual attitudes falter (Wobbles' overprotectiveness towards children, the Notary's inability to keep up her prim exterior around warped reality).
I would have liked a bit more description at the exorcism scene. Due to not knowing the canons, I had difficulty understanding who was getting exorcised first, and found it a little weird that the other canons seemed to be showing no reaction to the sudden appearance of the agents in the room, especially since one of those canons is later revealed to be a replacement.
Also, one spelling error:
“'Ah, Ysengrin. Feeling alright? Not too stressed, not too bitter?'”
"alright" should be "all right." -
On alright/all right... by
on 2014-02-06 09:47:00 UTC
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Alright has no logical reason to be incorrect; we already have merged words like, er, "already" or "altogether". As far as I'm concerned, that means it's okay to use over all right.
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We could use it alday! by
on 2014-02-06 14:51:00 UTC
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If we all ways spread it alover the internet, it will all so be an alround success!
'Already' has a completely separate meaning to 'all ready'. 'The ships are all ready' is accurate; 'the ships are already' makes no sense (and in fact, you'd need 'the ships are already ready'). 'I was already there', but not 'I was all ready there' (actually that /is/ a correct sentence - but has a different meaning). Yes, 'already' is derived ultimately from the two words, but it has a different meaning.
'Altogether' is closer in meaning, but still different. 'The ships are all together', 'It was altogether different'. The former suggests a collection, the latter suggests more a... totality? I don't know. I'm pretty sure you can't interchange them in most sentences.
Alright and all right, though? They mean the same thing (except in the grammatically dubious 'these gloves are all right [gloves]'). And, of course, 'alright' is already a word with its own distinct meaning: it's an Old English term meaning 'exactly', and apparently modifies 'so'. If you can make head or tail of 'Alrihtes swa alse þe wise teolie þenne he wule sawe nimeð ȝeme of twam þingen,' put up a translation and let us know.
(It also, in conjunction with in, means 'in compliance with the law', which is a fantastic turn of phrase: 'he married his wife in allright'.)
hS
PS: The OED says this:
'The form alright is frequent, although more widespread in non-literary printed sources (e.g. newspapers and journals) than in literary texts. Compare the standard spellings of already adj. and adv., altogether adj., n., and adv., always adv. Although these analogues exist, the form is strongly criticized in the vast majority of usage guides, but without cogent reasons. See further P. Peters Cambr. Guide Eng. Usage (2004) 31/2 and Webster's Dict. Eng. Usage (1989) 78/2. The criticism has occasionally even extended to questioning the legitimacy of solid and hyphenated spellings of the word; compare:
1926 H. W. Fowler Dict. Mod. Eng. Usage 16/1 The words [sc.all and right] should always be written separate; there are no such forms as all-right, allright, or alright, though even the last, if seldom allowed by the compositors to appear in print, is often seen..in MS.' -
Alright VS All Right by
on 2014-02-06 18:17:00 UTC
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IN THIS CORNER, the Grammar Nazis, who insist that alright is wrong because their second grade teacher told them so, with such phrases as "Alright is never all right," and "Alright is Alwrong!" They hold that the rules of grammar are not arbitrary, and that the modern English language should never, ever, ever change.
IN THIS CORNER, the Alright users, who say that there is a clear difference between Alright and All Right. They say that language changes over time, and the phrase that once had two different definitions will now have one clear definition. 'Alright' is for OK, acceptable, fine; where All Right is to be used for 'collectively correct.' Consider these sentences:
The speech was all right. Did the speaker state all facts correctly, or was the presentation acceptable?
The students were all right. Are the students unharmed, or did they all pass a test with flying colors?
More importantly, there are times one is appropriate, where the other is not. For example, using examples from somebody else on a voting poll debating this issue (alright is ahead with 53% of the votes):
A) What did you think of the movie?
B) It was all right.
A) How did you do on the quiz?
B) I got it alright.
In the first example, it seems more suitable, in my opinion, to use "alright", while the second example feels completely wrong.
There is a clear difference and distinction. I, myself, will continue to use alright where appropriate. As it is unlikely to appear in formal writing for the context I use it in, I should have no fear of being reprimanded by a professor.
Alright? Alright.
PS. hS, that example of alday was silly. I see what you were trying to show, but it is just purposefully insulting. There is never any way the phrase 'all day' could ever mean anything then 'a collective period of time lasting around 24 hours.' However, as I have pointed out, alright and all right do have different uses. Good day. -
[Lord Elrond eyebrow] by
on 2014-02-06 19:24:00 UTC
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Given that I didn't actually make a statement on either side of the debate - and closed with a quote from the OED which says that there is no justification for arguing against 'alright' - I don't think you can really say I was being 'purposefully insulting'. The comment in question - since it extended into the line 'If we all ways spread it alover the internet, it will all so be an alround success!' - was (I think pretty clearly) intended to be humorous.
hS -
Ah, whoops. by
on 2014-02-06 19:55:00 UTC
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I thought you were being needlessly sarcastic to prove a point of how silly the word was in your opinion. To be fair, that was partially because I saw similar arguments from other folks who were completely serious about their comments. So, my apologies for seeing innocent humor as sarcastic attack.
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Accepted. by
on 2014-02-07 09:21:00 UTC
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And to expand a point I don't think I actually made...
There are two types of 'al-' words.
-The first, exemplified by 'altogether', have a very close meaning to the decompounded form. 'The soldiers were, all together, evil' is pretty close to 'The army was altogether evil' - not identical, but close.
-The second is where the 'al-' has seemingly no connection to 'all '. Look at 'already'. Where does 'completely prepared' turn into 'at a previous time'?
Well, according to the OED, way long ago. As an example I can understand:
c1380 Sir Ferumbras (1879) l. 1117 Wanne þay come to þe castel ȝate..þe porter alredi was þer-ate.
'When they come to the castle gate, the porter already was there-at'. Which, actually, spans the two meanings - the porter was there before them, and he was all prepared there.
By the time of Chaucer, the two meanings have genuinely split:
c1400 (▸1391) Chaucer Treat. Astrolabe (Cambr. Dd.3.53) (1872) ii. §11. 22 The howres of the clokke ben departid by 15 degrees al-redy.
'The hours of the clock were departed by 15 degrees already'. You can't make that a use of the 'prepared' version.
Actually, the OED points out that 'all prepared' is an adjective, while 'previously' is an adverb. That may be significant.
With 'alright', you seem to be suggesting taking an even stronger version of the first type - the two terms aren't just connected, they're synonyms - and, through a secondary meaning of the 'all ' version, making them into the second type. That is, in fact, roughly what happened to 'already'.
The main difference is that, it appears, 'all ready' kept the original meaning (all prepared), while a new or secondary sense was attached to the contraction. Your suggestion seems to be the other way round - at least, I'm moderately sure that 'all right' as in either dexter or correct is less common than 'all right' as in 'all okay'.
Interestingly, 'all right' itself seems to be a fairly modern coining: the original 'alright' ('exactly') is ancient and obsolete (by around 1500), while 'all right' only appears in the mid-1600s to 1700s, and only really took off in the 1800s. The 'all accurate' and 'all dexter' versions, not being isolated phrases, don't have OED entries, but I guess go back as far as the word 'right'.
I dunno. Personally I think 'alright' is ugly, and so use 'all right'; but there's probably a lot of words I do that with (on the inverse side, I prefer 'okay' to 'OK', despite it being the newer form).
Final quotes:
'All right' can be attached as an interrogative, in the assumption of agreement. The OED's first example of this?
'1929 E. Wilson Diary in L. Edel Twenties (1975) 514 O.K., all right?'
And the oldest use of 'all right' the OED could find? It's Chaucer again, used as an intensifier at the end of a sentence (as in, 'Oh, we hate badfics, all right'):
'a1413 Chaucer Troilus & Criseyde (Pierpont Morgan) (1881) i. l. 99 Criseyde was þis lady name al right.'
hS & the OED -
As World-Jumper said last time, by
on 2014-02-06 05:29:00 UTC
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That isn't really an error. It's more of a stylistic choice than anything else. "Alright" is a word, and both "all" and "right" are words. You can't use "alright" in all situations where "all right" would be possible("We need to find some left gloves!" "You can't, Horace! They're all right!"), but it can be used here.
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Um, no, actually. by
on 2014-02-06 14:14:00 UTC
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"Alright" is not a word. It's a slang contraction, like "ain't." And while it's understandable to use "ain't" in dialogue, as it sounds different from "isn't," and a character might just talk that way, "alright" and "all right" sound identical (to anyone who isn't a PPC agent). There's no argument that the character is using a slang expression; the phrase has just been spelled wrong.
(And yes, "The gloves are all right," could mean either, "The gloves all go on right hands," or "The gloves are okay.") -
These two are precious! by
on 2014-02-04 13:35:00 UTC
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I have never even heard of this canon, so I had some problems to imagine what was going on, but I do understand that this is for my best. You did a good job making this clear.
Alas, I have to do my usual nitpicking:
Wobbles just curled up in a ball and continuing her doodle of a happy kitten, which was now almost a still life.
I’ll just accept that wobbles is able to doodle while she is curled up in a ball, but I feel this should either be continued or maybe the and should be dropped? But I’m not a native speaker and my grammar may be wrong.
I became confused by the following section:
Wobbles turned to face her, letting Annie slump to the ground. “Notary, shut up. I only want to know one thing. That thing would be that you got the canon to a nurse, and if I find out that you belittled her or were short with her then I swear to God I’ll kill you.”
“Ha. Ha. Haaaaa.” (Is this the Notary laughing about Wobbles empty threads? Or a third person / the wraith?)
“I - this is important, you stupid clown—” (This cannot be Wobbles insulting the Notary, right?)
“I’m not stupid!” Wobbles screamed. “And don’t you dare laugh at me!”
Also, there seem to be too many words here:
The Notary ignored her, instead digging through her robe’s pockets a out again and pulling out a long, black device with an array of old-fashioned dials on the front.
HG -
Before I read... by
on 2014-02-03 20:14:00 UTC
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...I just wanted to say that I utterly adore Gunnerkrigg Court (Thread was the most adorable chapter ever, admit it), and I am utterly horrified that such a badfic could reside in the fandom. Not surprised, merely horrified. I'll have something more gushy and constructive once I actually read your thing.
-Aila -
Your agents are perfectly matched by
on 2014-02-03 18:03:00 UTC
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By the standards of the PPC, of course, which means "create maximum shennanigans within the confines of the job."
I think there may be something wrong with this sentence, however: "The Bad Things that tended to happen to agents in the field (of which, according to the ) could get a hell of a lot worse if a wraith wasn’t properly exorcised from the canon it was possessing."
I have no idea what's going on in the parenthases, and there is no object to that parenthetical aside... maybe it got deleted?
The Notary is actually pretty scary if you stay in one place for long enough... Though, this one is comedy gold.
"It reminded the Notary of her old job on Gallifrey, and Wobbles of the Notary."
Of course, little is scarier than Coyote if you hold still long enough... -
There is no parenthetical aside. by
on 2014-02-03 18:26:00 UTC
Link to this
There never was a parenthetical aside.
We have always been at war with Eurasia... -
lol (nm) by
on 2014-02-04 00:45:00 UTC
Link to this
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Something I forgot to ask. by
on 2014-02-03 17:12:00 UTC
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What does the Notary look like? I don't think you've ever described her, or perchance I missed the piece.
(I typed this post while holding a Petit-beurre in my mouth. Heh heh.) - Here's a tektek I made a while back... by on 2014-02-03 17:52:00 UTC Link to this
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*wanders over* I think she's pretty. (nm) by
on 2014-02-06 05:05:00 UTC
Link to this
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I like it. by
on 2014-02-03 22:29:00 UTC
Link to this
The description of her on the wiki page is also really neat, too. However, you might want to pay a bit more attention to equalising descriptions and stuff in future stories; we got a really good picture of Wobbles through this mission but like Des I had no clue what the Notary looked like until now. Of course, this mission seemed to be largely from her POV, so comes with the territory I guess.
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Heh heh. by
on 2014-02-03 20:01:00 UTC
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So the Librarian could also point at her and laugh about her ridiculous clothes, were he the type to point and laugh.
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I almost feel sorry for the Notary. by
on 2014-02-03 16:20:00 UTC
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Over Wobbles, that is, not the fic.
Which is to say, I almost feel sorry for her over Wobbles, but don't, because I know her too well. I do feel sorry for her over the fic.
I thought you kept your characters, er, in-character very well, and I liked some of the nuances - the idea that the Notary does paperwork to calm her nerves, for instance. You also got Coyote scarily in-character, so that's... good? I guess? I'm not sure I'd want to be able to write Coyote, but...
Ehm, probably the only negative, which isn't really a negative, is that killing a 'fic which is that squicky makes it hard to actually show what's going on. I glanced over the original before reading, so I'm not sure how well people who haven't will know what the fic is doing. Maybe someone will say.
Also: you left Coyote with knowledge of the PPC. That's... scary, again. If the Notary's doing paperwork, she miiiight want to send a message to Building Maintenance and get them to isolate any sections of HQ in the GC universe; that's one PPC-aware canon you don't want to share a 'verse with.
hS -
Would he care? by
on 2014-02-03 16:52:00 UTC
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I mean, my GC knowledge is largely limited to the fact I binge-read the entire thing a couple weeks back, but the vibe I got from him is that for the most part he'd find it more amusing to let us do our thing than to do much to get in the way.
...Of course, this is a sinister trickster god, so what he finds interesting today might not be what he likes tomorrow. -
Oh yeah, sure. by
on 2014-02-03 16:59:00 UTC
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Up until he decides it'd be funny to turn all the walls into Slorp or something.
That's my point: Coyote isn't malevolent, he's unpredictable. And having HQ open to something that powerful and that random sounds like a very bad idea.
hS -
So, basically, what you're saying is... by
on 2014-02-03 18:09:00 UTC
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...It would probably be a bad idea for me to have Discord know about us. Good to know...
(Right, so, that changes how Unicornicopia is going down... Dangit...) -
You were going to let Discord loose in it? by
on 2014-02-04 02:44:00 UTC
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It might be a good thing that you decided against that, then, depending on the details you'd have used in the execution and the version of Discord you would have brought in. If you give him a whole alternate universe to play with as he likes, he's not going to want to leave, and certainly isn't going to want to destroy it. Hollow it out and fill the core with red-hot marshmallow paste, maybe, but not remove it utterly. He'd play with the aberration on canon until Canterlot come. Crystal Empire come? Dang it, human idioms don't translate well into the My Little Pony universe. He'd be there until Appelox consumes the deviation from the Heart World, then. Roundabout, but to the point.
For curiosity's sake, what would the specifics have been? Perhaps I was entirely wrong in my assumption. -
Well, it helps if you know the story. by
on 2014-02-04 04:57:00 UTC
Link to this
In the abomination known as My Little Unicorn, the evil sorcerer Titan finds himself trapped in the Space Between Spaces. Somehow, this allows him enough power to bring Discord out of imprisonment (ths was written about mid season 2), into a pocket universe and transform him into an 'eviler' version, with red and black scales and everything. I would get mad at how badly Mykan butchers Discord, but his idea of what makes a good villain is so corny, so uninspired, that it just becomes silly. Because, clearly, an intelegent being of chaos who sees reality as his personal plaything is so much worse of a villain then a red and black mindless monster whos only motivation is to destroy everything. Honestly, read the MST by fan/fic/ theater 3000 (have I promoted them enough on the board yet? Because I think the last 10 times were not enough) as it is the only way to read this thing without hurting yourself. Anyway, I'm getting off topic. So Stu!Discord destroys Unicornicopia, Equestria is left in ruins by Night Mare Moon (and yes, I do know it's spelled Nightmare Moon. Mykan, however, does not.) and all hope is lost for the Equestrians and the freaky anthro alicorns. So, with no other choice, Celestia and the Grand Ruler make a hybrid world of the two. There, the canon is beyond recognition, and the first fic ends.
Marvin and Printworthy would be killing it long before that could happen. How I saw Discord helping was this: Titan would free Discord, going through his little monologue before transforming the Spirit of Chaos. In the middle of the speach, Marvin and Printworthy burst in, charge Titan, and kill him before he can mutate Discord. Discord reveals that he knows about the PPC and Unicornicopia, and he would be more then happy to destroy that world for them. The three go in, wrap up charges, and let Discord have some fun.
I have not worked out all too well how this mission is going to go down, but I do know that I will be turning the fic against itself. I even have an idea to use Nyx from Past Sins in killing it.
Oops. Spoilers. -
You should probably keep the missions self-contained. by
on 2014-02-04 05:26:00 UTC
Link to this
Introducing characters from other places in the MLP multiverse would more likely than not either end up confusing people or seeming unduly shoehorned in. Dealing with a single badfic all the way through, only for a character from another more respected fic to come in at the end to solve the problem would require some background explanation in-universe, probably with some sort of previous setup involving that character. Otherwise, it would just come out of nowhere, akin to an Agent pair in Star Wars saying "Hey, super-Sith Sue! You're too powerful for us, but not too powerful for Yoda! Ger her, Jedi Master!"
One of the reasons canon characters don't know about the PPC, from a meta-fictional standpoint, is to prevent the Agents from delegating their tasks to someone else, or from having pre-existing allies that they know beforehand can help stop the badfics, both of which run the risk of unduly increased speshulness. Going out to enlist the help of a well-known fanfic character runs into a similar problem, with the added issue of the reader possibly not having heard of or read said character's fic of origin. Nyx would need to be established primarily through the Agents' back-and-forth, to make sure that everyone is up to speed, and frankly, she sounds very Suvian when going by her description alone, which would be problematic regarding the perception of the readers. -
She would not be solving it. by
on 2014-02-04 06:21:00 UTC
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Not by any means. More, I was thinking that, since they need some of the fic to continue on before they can nab particular characters, but don't want to see Equestria actually become enslaved to Night Mare Moon, they think of an alternate solution. Since Nyx is supposed to be the rebirth of Nightmare Moon, but much more reasonable, Marvin would think of replacing the replacement with her. Nyx would 'perform' what the Words told her in the lightest sense possible, and immediately have her Children of the Nightmare fix whatever she was told to do. There, rather then Celestia being tortured in the original story, Marvin and Printworthy would have time to plan how Unicornicopia will ultimately fall, as well as having less to clean up later.
Mostly though, I wanted to have it so we have a scene where Marvin and Printworthy promise Nyx protection from Sue hunters, in return for help with killing this beast. After all, Nyx is (in my opinion) a Sue, and although her story is far from being spork worthy by any means, she may still fear the legendary PPC coming after her. After gaining reassurances that, no matter how much she forces Twilight to carry the Idiot Ball, or is so much better then everypony else, or makes her story end in the cutest (and stupidest) possible way, she need never fear the assassin's blade. That is, of course, if she does one little favor...
(It may sound like I hate Past Sins. I don't. I find some of its story elements rather Sueish, and I dislike some of the ways Pen Stroke desides to take it, but on the whole it's a good fic. Probably the best Suefic I have ever read! But Nyx is such a Sue, I mean, come on!)
However, that said, I see your point. At the moment, my mind is just trying to see how this thing can be done. I go through a lot of bad ideas that I think are amazing at the time, then realize how bad it really is, and change the story accordingly. I don't think even my beta readers understand how much Death and Resurrection changed over the course of the sporking. In one of my early drafts, Marvin and Printworthy had several pages dedicated to them bumming around Canterlot for absolutely no reason. Griffon was causing chaos in the capitol (this was when I thought Griffon was a mini), and the agents managed to get a good night's rest before casually waking up, doing some light shopping, and eventually bothering to portal ahead to 'three days later.' It was long, stupid, and did nothing to showcase my characters or the badfic. Yeah. So, thank you for voicing your concerns. You probably spared me a re-write and a lot of thinking. Probably. Though I still want to see that contract being made... I'll think about it. -
I have the exact opposite problem. by
on 2014-02-04 07:42:00 UTC
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Whenever I'm planning something, I always think it will be shorter than it actually is, and then have to plan scenes to bridge the exchange of dialogue in one scene with the action sequence in another to the exposition in another, and everything ends up in the wrong order. It's one of the reasons I've not gotten my Permission piece out yet. That and the fact that I've got three other things I need to do before I can focus on it with any sort of decency, and homework keeps coming up and getting in the way of anything productive. I'd almost relish knowing that I could cut a scene without affecting the plot in any way, because I could dissect it and use the bits of description or dialogue I liked to fit other scenes together.
That premise, now that you've laid it out, has two other major issues: for one, the plan hinges on Nyx having known about the PPC beforehand. If Marvin and Printworthy explain the PPC to her, in the same conversation that they ask for her help, it will sound ridiculous and unconvincing from her perspective, since her world would never have been visited by the PPC before, as shown by the fact that a high-grade Sue like herself still has all of her blood in its original place. Just on principle, though; I'm not claiming that the Agents would both be unable to tell the truth accurately and accessibly. For the other, how would Marvin and Printworthy get rid of the Night Mare Moon so that Nyx could take her place? You aren't exactly going to be able to lock an alicorn-level Replacement Sue in a cabinet under the stairs until Nyx shows up and usurps her.
However, I can see a bit of Interlude potential in Nyx, or possibly a Nyx, since Past Sins is apparently popular enough to spawn fanfic-fanfiction at this point, discovering the existence of other worlds, perhaps after a rogue Agent or extradimensional threat targets her unexpectedly, but I don't know what sort of story purpose that would serve in the long run. It could be setup for some later crisis, but I'm hard-pressed to think of anything that a Nyx could do that three or four magic-wielding Agents couldn't do just as well. -
Fair point. by
on 2014-02-03 17:02:00 UTC
Link to this
After all, he didn't exactly promise not to give the PPC any trouble, he just seemed fairly agreeable in a creepy way. I think I lost track of the point I was making here...
(Side note: I didn't know you were into GC! It seems to be pretty big around here, and online in general.) -
I did want to write Coyote well. by
on 2014-02-03 16:44:00 UTC
Link to this
This is mostly because he wouldn't do what he does in this fic; he's a trickster god with incredible power and what TV Tropes describes as Blue And Orange Morality, but he wouldn't ever do something that could hurt Annie like this. I left him with knowledge of the PPC because, well, do you want to try and neuralyse something like him? Remember that while Wobbles is braver than she looks, the Notary's the only one who can reliably use a neuralyser and she's, well...
She's someone who stole a blockade runner from the war effort and ran away purely to save her own skin.
Heh. Antimony Carver is a teenaged part-fire elemental with a special gift for befriending gods and demons, and she's still a better protagonist than you'll find in most fiction. Tom Siddell writes the characters Suethors think they're writing. 'S'kinda why I took this fic on in the first place; GKC deserves better. =]
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Equipment idea by
on 2014-02-03 20:02:00 UTC
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I thought up a new type of PPC equipment. It's a Canon Round. They have sections of canon inscribed on them and the canon burns them to death. Please, tell me what you think. :-)
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Kind of a thread hijack by
on 2014-02-04 17:11:00 UTC
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I seem to be doing this a lot lately.
Having read this and been thinking about one of the missions I've got lined up, would it be possible for in the Harry Potter continua to charge Mary Sues by Howler, allowing Agents to be at a safe distance to then take out said Sues from range, potentially even using the Howler as a distraction (this is of course assuming the Sue hasn't already 'found' a way of getting rid of Howlers)
Storme Hawk -
I like the idea, but by
on 2014-02-05 19:34:00 UTC
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there may be some logistical problems to be considered.
As far as I remember, the canon sources don’t give us a "How to create a Howler" instruction, and I doubt that Harry would know how to do it. Hermione might know, though.
The information may be found in the library, but at least one of your agents may need to be a witch or wizard native to the Potterverse to be able to understand the instructions and perform the task.
How is it done?
Do they need a magic quill and/or magic parchment? Where do they get it?
Do they write using the tip of their wand instead of a quill? I’m sure this cannot be done with a Muggle-use wand from HFA. PPC wands can perform more spells, but I don’t like the idea of DoSAT just building wands for all occasions. Again, you may need a native witch or wizard wielding a canonical wand.
Do they write an ordinary letter and then enchant it (resp. the Charge List) to make it a Howler? I’m not a friend of made up spells, but perhaps the readers don’t need to see how it is performed.
Do they need an owl, or may a Howler be delivered by other means?
I’m looking forward to see your solutions.
HG -
Having looked into it... by
on 2014-02-06 22:06:00 UTC
Link to this
There seems to me to be two methods that one create a Howler. Due to the fact that all Howler's (in the books at least) are red envelopes or letters, whilst normal letters and such are made of white parchment, it seems logical to assume that the a Howler is made from a special type of paper that's been enchanted to convey the senders message as loudly as possible, I'm going to call this Howler Paper from now on.
The first way I thought of was that the Howler paper is written on, just like a normal letter, and then after a spell of some kind, it is 'activated' and then quickly attached to an owl who flies it to it's recipient. One of the main problems I see with this way is that the Howler Paper wouldn't really know what to sound like, the only time that a voice could actually be focused on it is when the activation spell is said, and then would it even be able to hear it at that point?
This bought me on to my second idea and the one I think more likely. The Howler Paper is less of a letter in the way we think of them and more of a middle-man between the sender and the recipient. Instead of writing the message the sender would cast an activation spell of some sort and then say the message to the Howler Paper, perhaps there also being spells of some sort that make it understand what tone the sender wants bits to be in, before casting another spell that let's the Howler Paper know the message is done before then, once again attaching it to an owl who goes to find the recipient. Although the requirement of two spells does make this method a bit more complicated.
Of course if neither of these ways are correct, it could just be a spell that transforms a normal letter into a Howler, but once again how does it know what to sound like?
Assuming there is such a thing as Howler Paper in the Harry Potter continua then I would guess that that would be the sole thing specifically needed to make a Howler, especially if the second method is true. Where one would get it? I would assume shops like Scribbulus Writing Implements in Diagon Alley, or Scrivenshaft's Quill Shop in Hogsmeade. For Agents, I assume the Room of Requirement would be able to provide it.
Whether or not the Agents know how to do it or not could prove funny as they try a load of different ways throughout the fic. I think that in the end it may not necessarily matter if we know how they ended up doing it, seeing as the end result is known to be canonical so long as it seems that what they did would seem to be canon and would work with what resources canon gives us.
I hope this makes sense, sorry for any and all grammatical mistakes I've made along the way
Storme Hawk -
Merit by
on 2014-02-04 17:45:00 UTC
Link to this
Well as a Harry Potter fan,I love the idea! Good one!
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Thanks by
on 2014-02-04 16:52:00 UTC
Link to this
I actually thought that the idea of agents copying sections of canon on to pieces of paper and wrapping them around a bullet was a good bonding experience for the characters. I also think that the same could apply to arrowheads, knives,what have you.
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Hm, bullets don't work that way. by
on 2014-02-04 18:00:00 UTC
Link to this
If you wrap a piece of paper around a bullet, it's going to get shredded by the feeding mechanism or as the bullet goes through the barrel, and the remains burned by the hot gases that do the "propel the bullet out of the gun" part.
Then, those remains can clog the gun and make it jam.
A better idea would be to write the snippets of canon on very thin strips and put them into the tip of hollow point bullets (using wax or glue or something along the lines of those to close the hole)... but sicne the "hole" on hollow points tend to still be quite small I don't know how well it would work. -
Engrave author names on the actual bullets? (nm) by
on 2014-02-04 18:33:00 UTC
Link to this
- Eheheheh. by on 2014-02-05 06:01:00 UTC Link to this
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Bolter rounds by
on 2014-02-05 05:36:00 UTC
Link to this
It seems to remind me of the rounds used by Space Marines against Daemons.
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That would work. (nm) by
on 2014-02-04 22:07:00 UTC
Link to this
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Thanks by
on 2014-02-04 16:51:00 UTC
Link to this
I actually thought that the idea of agents copying sections of canon on to pieces of paper and wrapping them around a bullet was a good bonding experience for the characters. I also think that the same could apply to arrowheads, kniv
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Hang on, hang on, we DO have things like this. by
on 2014-02-04 10:05:00 UTC
Link to this
I don't know if everybody knows of them, but they were very popular with Laburnum and Foxglove and their friends Stormsong and Skyfire, especially for dealing with author-wraiths.
Essentially, they got a plaster cast of Brian Jacques' signature, and Makes-Things then moulded it onto slingshot pellets for them - for a quick burst of canon. Just launch the signature-infused pellets at your target, and wham! All the power of a book/DVD/etc, no need to get close enough to risk possession!
And one other Agent - Fritz Sorgebrunnen - took the signature idea to slight extremes and got his aluminium baseball bat covered in the signatures of a dozen or so authors/show creators/what have you.
I'm sure you could modify the idea to be used with bullets. Just one thing - I wouldn't suggest the canon "burning" them to death, because if the bullet's embedded in them that could be a slow and agonising way to go, and the PPC doesn't condone torturing. -
Plus that sounds less useful than just real bullets. :P by
on 2014-02-04 15:20:00 UTC
Link to this
I'd somehow forgotten about Fritz and his bat though! I miss Joe's spinoff.
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We have bullets that cause incredible pain in Sues. by
on 2014-02-03 22:52:00 UTC
Link to this
They're called bullets. Besides, there's a slew of fandoms for which they would be useless since guns are not a thing in them.
However, the idea is not entirely without merit; I can see an agent of Japanese origin (or Japanophilic bent) having a strip of canonical script for use as ofuda. These are the strips of paper with writing on them used all the damn time in Japanese exorcisms; you inscribe the canon words on some paper (wood, cloth and metal are also apparently acceptable), recite nine words, and throw it at the possession victim while bellowing "akuryō taisan", which I believe is Japanese for "evil spirit begone" or some such thing. In circumstances where time is of the essence, such a thing would definitely be quicker and safer than trying to hit an angry wraith-powered canon with a copy of The Hobbit or whatever. -
Pretty sure it HAS to be a copy of canon work to, well, work (nm by
on 2014-02-03 22:58:00 UTC
Link to this
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Still works for literary canons. by
on 2014-02-03 23:27:00 UTC
Link to this
Unless you're suggesting that they'd have to be the entire series, which we know not to be the case because nobody carries around the entire boxed set/full book series of Harry Potter. Is there some sort of critical mass of canon or something? If so, how do comic books work?
Besides, I quite like the image of a brace of agents sat in a ring of candles diligently copying out key quotes from their canon of choice onto thin strips of paper. It could be a really good way to show character development without any dialogue, a major moment of bonding between the two agents conducted in respectful, meditative silence... yeah, that'd be cool.
It's almost a shame I can't write it with Wobbles and the Notary. =] -
Hm, perhaps I misunderstood. by
on 2014-02-03 23:28:00 UTC
Link to this
Apologies for that, I'm basically out on my feet. I'm pretty sure it has to be like a book or a movie or something as opposed to say, a strip of paper with a quote written on it. That sounds like a really cool take on it though!
(BTW, the wiki page for one of your agents raised as many questions for me as it answered. May I e-mail you?) -
I'm not 100% sure either, but... by
on 2014-02-03 23:46:00 UTC
Link to this
I haven't seen anything to directly contradict it and I've been going through the wiki for a while now. It's too cool an image for me to pass up. Besides, all that "the power of Insert Name Here compels you" stuff gets a little old. I'll have to dig out my copy of Mauss's A General History Of Magic for some interesting African rites and see how they can be applied (since, in the words of Umberto Eco, "magic is just the other person's religion").
((Of course. It's harry heath ninety-nine at that email service Hotmail has. [=)) -
Well now I'm annoyed I didn't come up with it. by
on 2014-02-03 23:50:00 UTC
Link to this
Seriously though, sounds good. And I'll send that e-mail soon.
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Why not just use a regular bullet? (nm) by
on 2014-02-03 20:15:00 UTC
Link to this
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So there's this sue... by
on 2014-02-04 12:45:00 UTC
Link to this
I know she's a Sue. Long platinum blonde hair, purple eyes, a body to die for. Tragic backstory, a fluctuating temperament that can range from sweet, to bitingly sarcastic, to bratty annoying wench. She's almost stupidly strong, loved by her people and the male hero in question.
The catch is, that she's pretty well-written. I mean she's still a sue to be sure, she has those sue qualities and later on in the story the writing starts to slip along with some of my suspension of disbelief (the Suethor in question does have a habit of pulling plot twists out of her ass). Moreover its completely predictable but still...
Her characters mesh into cannon almost seamlessly. Her Sue's personality draws heavily from her tragic backstory and it all seems to be very well thought out. The male hero in question is actually pretty close to being in character and their dynamic has a sense of realism to it that I'm not used to seeing in most OC stories.
I should have every reason to like this character and take the chance to appreciate a well-written Sue but the thing is...I can't. I guess it's just me and my attitude of "A Sue will always be a Sue"
(Sad I know.)
What do you guys think? Can a well written Mary Sue be a likable Sue or is she forever hindered as a character because of her role as pure wish fulfillment on part of the author? -
Hijacking the thread... by
on 2014-02-05 04:29:00 UTC
Link to this
...with an actual badfic!
So I found a bad Assassin's Creed II self-insert here:
https://www.fanfiction.net/s/10005861/2/Sucked-into-Assassins-Creed-2
Aside from numerous crimes against the space bar and general bad formatting ideas (seriously, the author puts stuff in Italian and then provides a parenthesized English translation instead of, you know, footnoting the translation so it doesn't get in the way of the narrative flow), I encountered this conversation soon after a pair of Sues get warped to their destination:
"E quello che sembra essere il problema? (And what seems to be the problem?)"A male voice asks.
"Il mio amico, ha una ferita alla testa. (My friend has a head injury.)"Becca responds.
"You seem to have trouble responding in Italiano. You are Americano, no?"The male voice responds.
For those of you uninitiated in the Assassin's Creed continuum, these two Sues have just been warped to Italy in friggin' 1470.
If I have to tell the PPC why this fic completely fails at world history, then I'm going to have a conniption. -
Aside from that.... by
on 2014-02-05 09:13:00 UTC
Link to this
The answer the girl gave is actually way more correct than the question.
The right question would be "Qual'è il problema?", while in the answer the only correction I would make is to remove the comma.
And... Wow. The US didn't exist until, what, three or four centuries AFTER 1470? Hell, nobody even KNEW that there was a whole continent there until more than thwenty years later! -
Well, no one in Europe. by
on 2014-02-07 20:42:00 UTC
Link to this
At least, no one in the bits of Europe that European history cares about. Vikings found North America in 10th century AD, and there have also been mummies discovered in Egypt that contained New World plants, suggesting that trade existed between the Americas and the Mediterranean area even before the Age of Discovery.
Still doesn't excuse the presence of the US in 1470 though. That part's patent bs. -
Wait, you mean a majority of the Italian has bad grammar? by
on 2014-02-05 12:58:00 UTC
Link to this
Ouch... God help you if you should look through the rest of the fic, then, 'cause Italian shows up quite a bit in there. She also capitalizes the hell out of some of the words as if it were a Frank Miller comic or something like that, and lord Jesus does that get annoying.
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Of course the grammar's going to be wrong. by
on 2014-02-05 18:26:00 UTC
Link to this
Chances are the author's using Google-translated modern Italian; medieval Italian is really rather different, not least because of all the dialects knocking around at the time. It's like the difference between Harry Potter and The Canterbury Tales.
No, I don't have a life, how did you guess? -
You mean Renaissance Italian. by
on 2014-02-05 19:28:00 UTC
Link to this
The point still remains the same, but it's hard to call the setting of the game "Medieval Italy" when friggin' Leonardo da Vinci is a major character.
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Eh, haven't played any of the series. by
on 2014-02-05 19:39:00 UTC
Link to this
Somebody else mentioned 1470 and I went off that. Mea culpa.
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Maybe she should try German? by
on 2014-02-05 13:35:00 UTC
Link to this
After all, all German nouns are capitalised.
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The problem is... by
on 2014-02-05 13:55:00 UTC
Link to this
...that Assassin's Creed has never gotten anywhere near Germany yet. So the Sue would need to contrive an excuse to get close to Germany.
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Holy Roman Empire? (nm) by
on 2014-02-05 17:31:00 UTC
Link to this
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So why do you call her a Mary-Sue? by
on 2014-02-04 13:04:00 UTC
Link to this
You've said that her personality is consistent with her backstory, and that she doesn't drive the canons (one 'n', by the way) OOC; that her dynamic with the 'male hero' (I'm assuming a canonical protagonist?) is realistic; you've implied, though not stated, that she doesn't have powers, abilities, or other elements explicitly contrary to canon.
So why do you call her a Mary-Sue? That's not a label that should be applied lightly - otherwise we just feed into the people who occasionally post essays about how we just call every female OC a Mary-Sue, and that's sexist. Which it would be, if that were what we did.
The only things you've listed to justify applying the label are:
-Her appearance (pretty).
-A tragic backstory.
-A fluctuating personality - but you attribute that to her backstory, so that can't be included.
-Physical(?) strength.
-Loved by her people (one assumes she's a ruler or related to one)
-Loved by a hero.
So, er... that'd be Eowyn, then.
Yes, it's sexist that every female character in fiction seems to be unbelievably good-looking - but it's not in any way specific to this character. Take that away, and what have you got? A beloved warrior-princess/queen with a sad history. That's really not a Mary-Sue you're describing.
In summary: OC =/= Mary-Sue. Self-insert =/= Mary-Sue. 1D character who throws the canon out of whack to serve her own ends == Mary-Sue.
hS -
Well shit... by
on 2014-02-04 14:28:00 UTC
Link to this
You've got a really good point actually. Calling her an outright Mary Sue wouldn't be fair. More like she's walking a tightrope. She actually does have powers that don't exist at all in canon proper. Moreover, she was able to take down a creature that all the other characters in canon proper still haven't been able to fully overcome with all of their strength combined. Honestly its debatable if her initial existence (her and her tribe) violates canon outright because the author does make crafty use of a, ah...loophole in canon. I suppose you could write it off as a speculative AU so no harm done there.
Yeah the characterizations seem to be the author's strong point. The only thing that really bothered me was the lack of consistency between some of her actions and her personality way down the road in the fic. For instance from the first few chapters you get the feel that this is the sort of person who's excellent at short term, on the spot thinking, but doesn't have the patience or temperance for long term strategy, and she doesn't. Mostly she leaves all that work to her brother, but in the recent chapter she'd been revealed as the mastermind behind everything? Once again, a bit of a stretch.
I didn't mean to apply the label lightly and I should've provided more context for my descriptions in my previous post in order to avoid giving that impression. There's actually a lot of ridiculously strong and beautiful and well rounded female characters with tragic pasts in original fiction that I love. Like Shana from Shakugan no Shana. I honestly don't believe that an OC from an orginal work of fiction can be a Mary Sue, per se, because it's their world and their story. They are a part of canon.
OC's in fanfiction however, I've always been wary of. Not every OC in fanfic are Mary Sues. In fact I've seen a few that are quite the contrary and that have made me genuinely care about them. (I know this one in FMA fandom that's literally a girl after my own heart.)
Perhaps though, I've had it wrong about this character. She has some suspicious traits to her but calling her a Mary Sue might be a mistake because although she's not the most smartly written OC I've seen, I don't think she's one dimensional either. -
Symptoms by
on 2014-02-05 03:12:00 UTC
Link to this
Judging by your description, I agree that this character is certainly irritating, maybe even overpowered, but I also think you may be mixing up the symptoms of Suehood and the essence of an actual Mary Sue. In my mind, a Sue is defined more by her impact on the canon plot and characters than by her physical appearance or even, to some extend, her abilities. If this 'Sue' fits seemlessly into the canon, and does not warp the plot, effortlessly gain influence or affection, or throw the characters OOC, than she isn't the kind of Mary Sue the PPC normally deals with.
The truth is, many people do have fluctuating personalities, especially if they have experienced trauma in the past. It may be an infuriating characteristic in a character- especially in an OC, which seem to be held to much harsher standards- but it is not necessarily an instant-Sueifer.
Many Sues have purple eyes, but is Suehood defined solely by eye color? Or uncommon hair, for that matter.
This is just a thought, and depending on the severity of her non-canon powers, she may actually be a Mary Sue. That's up to you as the reader to decide. -
Er, language, please. (nm) by
on 2014-02-04 14:37:00 UTC
Link to this
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According to PPC's policy... by
on 2014-02-04 12:55:00 UTC
Link to this
A well-written 'Sue' is not a Sue.
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Not sure if this is too OT, but... by
on 2014-02-05 08:19:00 UTC
Link to this
...does anyone here feel like sharing background wallpapers?
Personally, I can't get enough of them, especially those related to fandoms and such. If anyone has some stuff they want to share, feel free to dump it here.
I'll start with a few of my favourites:
Pokémon: Xerneas
StarCraft: Terran Battlecruiser
Legend of Zelda: Master Sword
Shingeki no Kyojin/Attack on Titan: Stationary Guard
Problem Sleuth: Sepulchritude -
Never been too into wallpapers, but . . . by
on 2014-02-08 02:30:00 UTC
Link to this
I like these guys. They're very minimalist wallpapers of all the Pokémon.
http://pldh.net/gallery/the493
http://pldh.net/gallery/unovacollection
http://pldh.net/gallery/xyarchives
A few years back, I also had a Haunted Mansion wallpaper I liked: the pattern from the actual wallpaper of the rides. There are a whole bunch of those available.
https://www.google.com/search?q=haunted+mansion+wallpaper&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=b5b1UpOeIcGyrgHnjYGYBg&sqi=2&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAQ&biw=1042&bih=670 - Here's my current one. =] by on 2014-02-05 17:48:00 UTC Link to this
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Not too OT by
on 2014-02-05 15:11:00 UTC
Link to this
I like some of those. Xerneas is gorgeous and the Master Sword is classic.
Now for one of my own: WeLcOmE tO tHe DaRk CaRnIvAl BrO :o)
-Phobos, honk HONK honk HONK
All right, all right. Something way less creepy: Democracy!
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The second chapter of Blank Sprite is up! by
on 2014-02-05 21:42:00 UTC
Link to this
http://rc1587.wordpress.com/2014/02/05/blank-sprite-mission-record-02/
Sergio and Nikki get involved in car chases and much more as they try to locate the missing canon characters. However, this is still only the beginning... -
I got to read this at last, by
on 2014-02-10 11:52:00 UTC
Link to this
and I didn’t take any notes. So, either I was too tired to spot any errors, or all the nitpicking is already done :-)
I liked Nicky’s reaction to being in a live action world. Not knowing her home continuum, I had never realized that she is a big-eyed anime character.
Apparently something more sinister than Mary Sues is at work here. Are “they” the maleficent force behind the Mary Sue factories, or did “they” just buy a special offer of Defectives to do the dirty work? Going off topic (or maybe not?) I never quite understood the economic reasoning for Mary Sue factories. Do they sell Mary Sues to writers who are too lazy to make up their own original character? Or do the factories create all these Mary Sues just for the fun of being evil?
I’m looking forward to the next chapter.
HG -
The Mary Sue Factories tie into previous continuity. by
on 2014-02-11 02:55:00 UTC
Link to this
It's been a while since I got to talk about continuity, so I'm happy I have finally been given another chance to. (rubs hands together gleefully)
The Mary Sue Factories were originally created by the Mysterious Somebody, formerly a Jedi Agent named Triad. Starting from his recruitment out of a badfic and assignment in the DAVD, he eventually took over Headquarters using Force-powered mind control on most of the Flowers in HQ, as well as any Agents who found out about his existence. He also installed the Bracket Fungus as the satellite Head of the Department of Internal Security, which covered all of the problems that today fall under the spectrum of the Security Departments, and after ordering the death of the Evermind, he installed the Bindweed as an additional satellite in the now-defunct Deputy for Infrastructure. To get more to the point before I summarize the entire Reorganization, the Mysterious Somebody created the Mary Sue factories as a way of consolidating his power further. Initially, he only made one, codenamed FGenMS01, in order to increase the PPC's workflow for the dual reasons of additional profit(where the profit would actually come from was never sufficiently addressed, though it was implied to be connected to the killing of Sues) and to keep the PPC's individual members active enough to allow him to remain hidden.
After the Reorganization, however, the Mysterious Somebody was exiled, along with all of HQ's Flowers that had supported him, and as a means of revenge, he set up a number of new Factories, planning to use the Mary Sues they created as an invasion force to retake Headquarters. The Mary Sue Factories had never been linked to the authors of badfics, but originally they had been released into the multiverse at random, acting as Mary Sues would if they had formed in the wild. From the Mysterious Somebody's exile onward, the Mary Sue Factories took on a role as a combination between the DMSEAR and a quasi-military force. Each Flower who was exiled with him was set up as the leader of a Mary Sue Factory, of which there were at least eleven, counting FGenMS01, which was the original, the largest, and headed by the Mysterious Somebody himself. The Factories created a massive number of Mary Sues, and an even larger number of Defectives, which were incomplete Sues that acted as staff members to keep the Factories running rather than as warriors or saboteurs. The actual invasion was preluded by several of the Factory's Sues being sent into Headquarters itself by a specialized Factory and masquerading as Agents or minor Flowers. These Sues, the aforementioned saboteurs, were usually detected and killed by the Department of Internal Operations, but since hunting and destroying what would have been seen by all around them as PPC employees would have been understandably controversial, the DIO kept its activities secret and only ever employed a handful of Agents at a time.
During the Crashing Down event, the J.R.R. Tolkien generator was stopped, leading to severely decreased shield power(it's a long story, involving why the DIS isn't around any more, and would require its own post), and the Mysterious Somebody took advantage of this to launch his assault, but was killed in the attack, along with his Flower lieutenants(save the Gladiolus, who defected from his defection and now serves as the Head of the DBS's Bad Het Division) and the Dassie Hyrax clones he had been using as a replacement for the Defectives(again, it's a long story, less long than the previous long story but unrelated to it), and the Mary Sue Factories were left leaderless and deprived of FGenMS01, which had been destroyed in the ensuing battle. The surviving Flowers, who had been Factory Administrators under the Mysterious Somebody but were without command after the destruction of the previous hierarchy, were reorganized into the League of Mary Sue Factories by the Yarrow, formerly the Factory Administrator of FGenMS08. The Yarrow's activities between Crashing Down and late 2008 are largely unknown, but at some point, one of the Factories snuck in a pair of macrovirus-infected Mary Sues, leading to an outbreak in HQ, in which the macroviruses smashed large amounts of PPC equipment, weakening the shields. The Yarrow, who had staged the epidemic, then sent in an army of Sues to wipe out the weakened PPC, planning to use Headquarters to spread the League's influence throughout the multiverse. Despite being aided by defectors from the DES, the Yarrow was killed when it decided to involve itself in the invasion directly, and once the Mary Sue invasion had ended, the entire League was thrown into disarray. The Yarrow was the last Flower among them who was any good as a leader, and the next candidates were its lieutenants, the weak-willed Forget-Me-Not and the vicious but shortsighted Venomous Tentacula. The Tentacula won the power struggle, killing the Forget-me-Not in the effort, but it was incapable of keeping the League together, and several Factories began acting outside of its rule.
The Yarrow had, during the reign of the Mysterious Somebody, been experimenting with certain components that allowed for more powerful and accurate Mary Sue duplicates to be produced from his factory, and tested out the new methods on a series of minor canon characters during his time as head of the LMSF, including Elethwen Eithriel, a Tolkien Elf who lived in Rivendell and had been one of the Elves attending the movieverse Council of Elrond. Elethwen Eithriel's duplicate, who was named Lilith Wyldenbrooke, had originally been intended to take her place in the Lord of the Rings continuum and serve as a sleeper agent for later affairs, but the Yarrow was killed before his plan could be carried out, and once the Tentacula took over the League and the Factory went separatist, Elethwen Eithriel escaped, took on the name Eledhwen Elerossiel to keep the LMSF from tracking her, and informed the PPC of said plan, leading to an attack on FGenMS08 that destroyed most of the duplicates. Lilith, however, survived the attack and took over FGenMS08, renaming it "Happily Ever After Ltd." She began to rally other Factories to her cause, forming an organized faction of separatists that opposed the Tentacula's rule. The pro-Lilith faction also developed whimsical names for their factories for unknown reasons, probably related to Lilith's Suvian sense of aesthetics.
Lilith's faction took an active role quickly, attacking OFUs and developing a Vambiolaria Bomb as part of a quest to develop military superiority over the pro-Tentacula faction(Vambiolaria is a disease created several years ago during the run of the Hogwarts Fanfiction Academy. Simply speaking, it coverts any dominant characters in its region of influence into Mary Sues, and its only known cure involves a very rare non-canon plant that grows on the grounds of HFA). Lilith was later killed during an attack on the International Academy of Hetalia Fanfiction, which may or may not have led to a refragmentation of her faction, and since then, the activities of the Mary Sue Factories have remained unknown. Presumably, the Tentacula remains in charge of at least its original post, FGenMS11, but Blank Sprite is the first time the League has been brought up in any capacity since 2011.
So, yeah, that's how all that happened. How the Mary Sue Factories started, what they do, and when they've done it. I probably got carried away and provided information beyond the boundaries of your question, but continuity is fun for me. -
Actually... by
on 2014-02-13 19:18:00 UTC
Link to this
... It's funny to think that...
[SPOILERS]
actual Mary Sue Factories aren't involved in Blank Sprite at all.
[END OF SPOILERS]
But I guess this big discussion brought out some interesting and necessary stuff, so it's still good. -
Thank you for this comprehensive essay. by
on 2014-02-12 09:09:00 UTC
Link to this
So, in a much shorter version, economics are not applicable to Mary Sue factories. The Yarrow and the Venomous Tentacula did and do it for Revenge on the PPC, not to get money. I’m not sure about Lilith’s motives – someday I will read IAHF, although Hetalia isn’t my fandom :-) – but she may not even need one, because Sues just do what Sues always do.
The Mysterious Somebody himself did it for power, because an increasing number of Sues meant an increasing number of agents who all obeyed his commands. How the original FGenMS01 contributed to keeping the agents not only busy, but also paid, would still be a mystery, if Huinesoron had not given us an answer at last.
HG -
We don't actually know much about the Yarrow. by
on 2014-02-12 15:59:00 UTC
Link to this
Which is a shame, because I've always found him kind of interesting. He managed not only to keep the Factories together after losses that would have destroyed any other faction in fiction, but managed to rebuild them and restructure their mission statement into a form that made the new League a long-standing, credible threat. He was a harsh and controlling leader, but he'd have to be to keep a staff that consists almost entirely of Mary Sues in check, since the Mary Sue in its natural state is a solitary and disorderly creature. Once the League shifted to new management after his death, problems started cropping up almost immediately. Plus, he had plenty of plans that we never got to see through, and they seemed from what I saw to be more complex than the standard. I know he had some sort of long-term agenda that was interrupted by his untimely death, more likely than not involving Lilith's stock of canon character duplicates. I'm interested in seeing how that would have turned out, but we were never given enough details to extrapolate before the Tentacula took over and botched the scheme.
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In fact... by
on 2014-02-13 01:59:00 UTC
Link to this
...Was the Yarrow's ultimate fate ever actually written anywhere? It's all over the wiki that Harlan incinerated him then got killed by a Dandelion bodyguard, but that wasn't in any parts of the 2008 Invasion RP I remember reading, nor in followup writings.
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Part of the Mary Sue Invasion RP is missing. by
on 2014-02-13 03:57:00 UTC
Link to this
Two Google Docs, one denoting the very beginning and one denoting part of the conflict within HQ's halls, are inaccessible. Apparently, anyone reading needed permission from the docs' compiler to access them, and whoever that was left the PPC before making the compilations public. Those two also happen to be the only two accounts in which the Yarrow appears in a direct, active role, as well as the as-of-yet only appearance of the enigmatic Pipe-Weed Flower, so we cannot yet confirm or deny anything regarding events in that period. The conflict with the Davros Sue at The Tomb of the Unknown PPC Agent is still alive somewhere, since I distinctly remember reading that part, so it's not all gone, but at least some important scenes are lost.
I talked to Neshomeh about this a while ago when I'd been planning on using the Mary Sue Invasion for some more appearance links, and she said that she was working on the issue, and had been in contact with someone who had access to the restricted Google Docs, but I have no idea how that is going.
Believe me, if the original wording is ambiguous or contains the phrase "No one could possibly survive that." I would like little better than to reveal that the Yarrow had escaped the assault when it went pear-shaped and has been working on his master plan out somewhere in the multiverse, after spending a while post-Invasion inactive to deal with some temporary setbacks, but considering the speed that the League of Mary Sue Factories changed leaves after the Invasion and the wiki pages that you mentioned, he's probably unambiguously toast. -
The problem is there's no evidence the scene happened atm. by
on 2014-02-13 04:00:00 UTC
Link to this
If you'll forgive the chatspeak due to lack of space. :P The Yarrow is definitely treated as dead and I wasn't saying it as a "hey, maybe he's alive" thing - I'd just really like to find some kind of actual source indicating that it actually happened as opposed to just getting tossed on the wiki.
(I'm also rather certain neither of those docs include the scene in question.) -
Of course! The Yarrow was really killed by an ATM! by
on 2014-02-13 04:35:00 UTC
Link to this
Maybe the ATM and the Sufficiently Advanced Vending Machine get together every once in a while and talk about their respective triumphs.
Ha ha, okay, sorry, I had to get that ridiculous mental image out before it caused any trouble.
What we really need is to get the entire Invasion all in one place so that we can sort it chronologically and for important events to make a better reference source. Right now on the wiki, there are seven Google Docs on its page, none in chronological order and all inaccessible(out of that list, I think the second is most likely to include the scene we're looking for, because most of the others deal with the paths of individual Agent teams, but I can't be sure), but I know that in at least one place there is some remaining, because I read about the Davros Sue off of it. I tried to find that spot again, but I couldn't. I don't even know where to look.
Do you know a good way to contact Neshomeh and ask how the project of retranscribing the Invasion is going? That would probably be the easiest solution here. I'd use the e-mail address she listed on the wiki, but I've tried to contact her with questions on it before and she's never responded. It might not be an operational e-mail address any more. -
>:( by
on 2014-02-13 04:37:00 UTC
Link to this
Anyway, I think the GDocs are held by JulyFlame, who gave me access to the first one when I just sent a request, but yeah, next I hear from Neshomeh (since I've been talking to her anyway) I'll ask her.
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Er... 'Triad'? by
on 2014-02-11 09:15:00 UTC
Link to this
I'd be... interested to know where that came from, given that I thought I'd written him as an insane Dark Jedi clone of Joruus C'baoth who never told anyone in HQ any name whatsoever.
(The very short version: the MS created both the original Factory, and PPC Biotechnology/engineering Inc., to garner funds for the PPC. Since BioInc sells canon products to the multiverse, it is entirely possible the Factory Sues were designed as procurement agents. Since the best way to procure resources is to be ludicrously overpowered - like the Sues the PPC had previously encountered - he designed them to be Sues. The fact that this fed back into increased work for the PPC - and thus increased loyalty to the management - was something of a bonus.)
hS -
IÂ’m so glad I asked. by
on 2014-02-12 09:11:00 UTC
Link to this
This had bothered me ever since the Evermind found out that most of the PPC’s income came from PPC Bioengineering Inc. and from FGenMS01: how could a Mary Sue factory make money?
So, all this money actually came from PPC Bioengineering Inc., because the factory sold or lent its products to PPC Bioengineering Inc., but the assassins mistook the procurement agents for ordinary Mary Sues, the Sue slaying increased and the Mysterious Somebody just let it continue to gain more power.
I like stories where not everything has been planned in advance and the outcome is not what the initiators had intended, although it benefits them for some time (until it backfires).
HG -
There's probably a bunch of profitable uses for Suvians. by
on 2014-02-12 09:32:00 UTC
Link to this
With the powers Suvians can call upon, you could loan them out as mercenaries, security, use them as procurement agents like hS said, assassins, muscle for protection rackets... there's tonnes of ways to make money when the whole multiverse is at your fingertips and you have legions of henchmen that are by their very nature absurdly overpowered.
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Suddenly, two of my long-standing plotbunnies come together. by
on 2014-02-12 13:41:00 UTC
Link to this
I hadn't thought of the Mary Sue Factories being used as mercenary security and defense forces before. And I know for a fact that a few of the Factories named in IAHF have never been seen anywhere else... Hmm... Yeeees. This fills a couple of holes that I've been wondering about for a long time.
Thank you, Ekyl. Now some of my sidestory-planned character actions will not be motivated by what is, to them, complete nonsense. I was getting worried about that. -
I've considered writing a League thing on and off before. by
on 2014-02-12 15:35:00 UTC
Link to this
So thinking about this kinda thing already came naturally to me, plus just considering human nature. You've got a bunch of insanely powerful henchmen you can create in droves, lots of people would first think to toss those henchmen at whomever their enemies are/whomever is willing to pay to use those abilities in combat.
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The SO says he went by Triad before taking over. by
on 2014-02-11 18:37:00 UTC
Link to this
I can take that out if it's no longer the case though.
(Since he was a Joruus C'baoth clone, was his "real" name technically Joruuus? :P) -
Where? I have no idea what you're referencing. (nm) by
on 2014-02-12 09:05:00 UTC
Link to this
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Outhra linked it. Reorg, Chapter 10. by
on 2014-02-12 09:29:00 UTC
Link to this
In fact, allow me to quote Reorg directly here.
"But why him?" Nyx insisted. "Surely you did a background check or something – why did you put Joruus C'baoth in charge of the PPC?"
He never gave a name, the SO replied, sounding a little vague. Official records - well, they list him as Agent Triad, but I have a feeling that was more the Marquis' insistence that something get written down than an actual name he used. Since he took over, we've only ever referred to him as the Mysterious Somebody. He shrugged his leaves. It's not like we talk to him in person - that's what the Nightshade is for.
As for the "that" I offered to remove, that was the mention of the MS's "official" name being Triad on the wiki. -
Even if he doesn't go by it now, by
on 2014-02-11 22:29:00 UTC
Link to this
It's what he was called in the past, so it's still important personal information that the wiki page should cover.
You know, this is making me wonder what the Flowers under his command called him amongst themselves during the years that he was the leader of the PPC exiles running the Mary Sue Factories. Calling him "the Mysterious Somebody" when he isn't mysterious to them any more would have been odd, especially since "the Mysterious Somebody" is kind of a silly title. They might have called him "Triad", but knowing the Mysterious Somebody, he'd hit them with Force lightning if he caught them doing that, so it wouldn't be the best of habits to get into. He seemed to enjoy having people call him "our master" and related terms, so maybe he insisted that his fellow exiles refer to him as such. There might be a few Flowers who wouldn't like speaking so subserviently, but they could always have just appended sarcastic extensions when he wasn't around, like "our glorious ruler" or "our indomitable leader". Those italics would probably be reversed, since these are Flowers, but you get the point. -
I think that's hS's call. by
on 2014-02-11 22:32:00 UTC
Link to this
People seemed to stop calling the MS the MS and start calling him C'baoth pretty quickly once he was revealed, but it seemed to me that in the years afterward it started being less a name and more a title the legend grew around.
The reason I said I could get rid of the Triad thing if hS wanted is, quite simply, when we saw Lofty Skies nowhere did that name ever come up, and hS just reacted as if that had never been his name at all. I think we should see what he says so the whole thing gets straightened out before going off into wild tangents and conjectures. -
I was only wondering. by
on 2014-02-11 22:54:00 UTC
Link to this
I wasn't trying to impose. Besides, he's dead now, so what the proto-League of Mary Sue Factories called him won't really matter any more, unless people start writing flashbacks to the Factories in the 2000-2006 period for whatever reason.
Well, the heads of the PPC would have had to call him something before he adopted the Mysterious Somebody title in the eighth chapter of Lofty Skies. If he never gave a name, there'd need to at least be a designation that they'd use when referring to him. He had a position in the DAVD's administration, so he wasn't exactly an anonymous figure that wouldn't require a name, since at least the Big Thorn would have needed to call him something, and they couldn't have just called him "that white-robed Jedi guy", because there would probably have been at least three of those. -
Seemed more like none of them had any idea who he was. by
on 2014-02-11 22:56:00 UTC
Link to this
Now sure, it's possible (probable?) a lot of time skipping was going on in those chapters, but the vibe I got from how Flowers reacted to him and such was sort of a "who is this guy?" thing. Plus, you know, the whole "he was using the Force to mind control everybody" thing.
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Double-er... by
on 2014-02-11 16:00:00 UTC
Link to this
You called him Triad yourself, during Chapter 10 of the Reorganisation, and it says his name in big bold letters on his wiki page. Granted, the original chapter says that he was only referred to as Triad in official capacity, and that it was a name assigned to him rather than given, so that's why you might have been remembering that he never told anyone his name. It could have just been a codename that he adopted before he decided that he liked being called "the Mysterious Somebody" better, but either way, it was the closest thing to a pre-ascension name that I could find.
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Okay, fair enough. by
on 2014-02-12 09:13:00 UTC
Link to this
Takes some of the mystery out of him, but apparently I put it there. Given that the SO doesn't know his name in Lofty Skies, though, I'm going to guess that the 'official records' in question are buried pretty deep - and, possibly, post-date his assumption of power.
In fact, Chapter 10 probably needs reworking - it conflicts with Lofty Skies, and I prefer the latter version. Since people apparently noticed the name, though, I'll keep it in.
('Triad' is a private joke of his, of course: he's the third version of Jorus C'baoth, after the original and the clone)
hS, off to rewrite (and fix that blasted coding) -
Is that the coding... by
on 2014-02-12 13:45:00 UTC
Link to this
That underlines everything and/or turns it bright red when text is selected? If it isn't, do you know why the PPC Histories do that? It can sometimes get a little distracting.
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That's the one. by
on 2014-02-12 14:49:00 UTC
Link to this
It's because I have link-type HTML used to identify chapter heads, but never closed it (because for some reason I didn't think it needed it). I've now closed them all for Reorg, and will look into the others.
hS -
While we're talking about things that the MS was in, by
on 2014-02-14 01:24:00 UTC
Link to this
Is there or was there a plan for Shades of Black and Red, or the Arthurverse in general? It seemed like a potentially interesting AU, but nothing much really happened in it before the stories within it just stopped, and the wiki articles on everyone there are only a few sentences long each. I would have liked to see some more details on how that world is going to turn out.
Maybe it will show up at some point during that multiversal crossover event you occasionally bring up, or it will end up like the Sundering universe and become open for other people to continue. Most of the major players in the Arthurverse were solely your creations, though, so I'm not entirely sure how the latter would work, given PPC character-use protocol...
Also, on a tangentially related note, when I was looking through the Shades of Black and Red section again to get the URL for that link, sometimes the underlining code showed up when I lifted my mouse to another tab or scrolled down. You might not have closed all of the tags. -
Mm, sort of. by
on 2014-02-14 09:20:00 UTC
Link to this
There is a plot for SoBaR - or Reorg 2A, as it was known back when CD was simply 'Reorg 2' - but I don't know if I'll ever write it. The heart of it is Jay and Acy's plan to take out the MS by, well, blowing him up (there was a discussion a long time ago about whether generic surface is brittle under explosive conditions). Then there's... grief, it's been a long time... er, Dafydd and co trying to break Ontic out, Connie and Aella trying to bring down the Factory, Blue and company providing a view on what normal life is like during the event, and Lou and Morgan - meddling.
But there's no particular plan to continue it. I suspect the ultimate outcome would be a new Head of the PPC - probably the Sub Rosa, I'm a big fan - and likely a shift in organisational policy. I can see the SR deciding that all these troubles come from being too aggressive, and that from now on, PPC Agents will use stealth, not force, to take out badfics.
Of course, neither is there a plan not to continue it. I'll maybe get round to it? I honestly don't know.
hS -
I suspect my quoting Reorg happened after this rewrite. by
on 2014-02-12 09:36:00 UTC
Link to this
If so, sorry, disregard me going in and fetching the quote upthread. :P That whole Triad thing always did bug me - think I asked you about it myself once. Glad it all fits in somehow.
(You know, I don't know how I only just got this, but was the MS himself the "secret project" of C'baoth's Anya and Josephine talk about forgetting to deal with/not catching in the beginning of Lofty Skies? Seems to've been the implication but I wondered if I was just looking too hard. Link here because I've somehow never figured out how to code links on this Board: http://ppchistory.webs.com/Skies1.htm) -
Coding links. by
on 2014-02-12 21:27:00 UTC
Link to this
It goes like this: "text that would show over the link", except with all of those quotation marks removed. I probably put in more quotation marks than I needed to there, but I didn't want to partially activate the HTML and turn some crucial section invisible.
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Yes, he is. by
on 2014-02-12 14:54:00 UTC
Link to this
The MS's origin is a secret project of (a badfic version of) Joruus C'baoth to clone himself. Nyx, as seen in Reorg, doesn't know this - in the scene under discussion, she thinks he is C'baoth, and is rather baffled to find out he looks nothing like him.
I forget whether she ever finds out; I think the narrative calls him by name in CD, but I may be wrong about that.
hS -
...Can't believe I missed that opening by
on 2014-02-12 21:23:00 UTC
Link to this
That is, the chance to be all Obi-Wan and point out he was indeed C'baoth... from a certain point of view. :P
(out of idle curiosity, why C'baoth?) -
Two reasons. by
on 2014-02-13 12:22:00 UTC
Link to this
We (actually, probably I) needed a character who:
-Could control people's minds - and not just puppet them, but actually make them want to do what he said.
-Have that influence suddenly removed, and just as suddenly restored.
Oh, and:
-Existed prior to 1998.
The only thing that sprang to mind was the various scenes in the Thrawn Trilogy where C'baoth does exactly that (re: mind control). The existence of the ysalamiri made him perfect. Wait, did I use 'miris? I know he deliberately shut down to avoid being noticed by a Jedi canon...
hS -
Ysalamiri got used in Reorg, yeah. by
on 2014-02-13 17:44:00 UTC
Link to this
Unless you were asking something else?
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CD uses both names. by
on 2014-02-12 15:30:00 UTC
Link to this
The PPC just started calling him C'baoth after his reveal though, and I'm pretty sure "Triad" is never used by anybody at any point in the three stories. Nobody ever really bothered looking into his backstory though.
(Also, doesn't what he does to the Poppy go against what he says in CD about how he can't directly mind control Flowers?) -
Re: I suspect my quoting Reorg happened after this rewrite. by
on 2014-02-12 14:00:00 UTC
Link to this
I was wondering why your quote didn't match my memory of that scene. I hadn't recalled the Marquis being mentioned there at all.
Perhaps now that Huinesoron is rewriting the Reorganisation, he'll include that section on the Mary Sues initially being used as procurement agents somewhere in the revised version, answering the question of how the Factories bring the PPC money for future readers. Plus, it'll give me official basis to post that information on the wiki, solving the problem on two fronts. -
I'll put it in. :P (nm) by
on 2014-02-12 15:29:00 UTC
Link to this
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Maybe. by
on 2014-02-12 14:58:00 UTC
Link to this
I'm not sure whether it'd fit in; the sections dealing with the Factory as a PPC installation are pretty brief. Although... hmm. I probably could expand on the summary the Evermind reads at the end of Chapter 1.
Actually, I'll probably rejig it along the way: as it stands, BioInc is listed as a separate income source to the Factory. Hmmmm...
hS -
Works either way, but could do. by
on 2014-02-12 15:33:00 UTC
Link to this
At the least, yeah, it'd finally make sense to have a bit of info in the story as to how creating reality-warping abominations is making money for the PPC. :P
(Did the PPC really need it though? As you've said the organisation really has no overhead since they can just steal or fabricate everything, unless that was less of an option in the old days and so doing the work was more expensive.) -
Ah, good, I was left plenty of nitpicks. by
on 2014-02-06 05:23:00 UTC
Link to this
"None of the windows was facing towards the two Agents" That should be "were", not "was", since there had been multiple windows.
"[I can’t open the portal directly from the console, either,] Corolla added, [I’m afraid there’s a plothole near you.]" The comma after "added" should be a period.
"Ben, do you think we’re going to get back the car still in one piece?" The words "the" and "back" should be switched, and the word "still" may not be needed. It's not grammatically incorrect to include it, but it's a little awkward.
"it’s the tech that isn’t working. Also, calling a taxi would’ve took more time," Again, not strictly grammatically incorrect, but swapping "that" and "tech" would make the phrasing a little less awkward. What is grammatically incorrect is the use of "took" instead of "taken", though I'll admit the misuse of "took" does occasionally occur in spoken English. Sergio hasn't shown proclivity to use dialect, though, so I'm pretty sure it's just a grammar mixup.
"we’re on an highway," That should be "a highway".
"changed lane to let a Porsche go past, “see? He’s doing at least two hundred," There should be a period after "past", not a comma, and "see" should be capitalized.
"A different art style doesn’t change who you are, though," Sergio said, "or who I am, for that matters." The last word should be "matter", unless the meaning would be synonymous with "because that matters", which would be a bit strange in that sentence.
“I would’ve asked to the dock workers, but this place looks pretty empty,” That should either be "asked" or "talked to".
"Sergio explained, “besides, the container was to be loaded today," "Explained" should be followed by a period, and "besides" should be capitalized.
“I think I have an idea,” Nikki said, “the CAD should be able to find Madoka and Sakura". "Said" should be followed by a period, and "the" should be capitalized.
“I hope this isn’t going to become another six-”
[Bestest Shipping Co. container holding character Madoka Kaname. Uncanon. Suggested action: Open container and liberate the canon character.]
“Sometimes I have the weird feeling these things are mocking me,” Nikki deadpanned.
“Only sometimes?” Sergio asked while stopping the car next to a black container, “this one?” Other than the period-capitalization replacement again(for "container," and "this" this time), I think there might be a step missing here, unless Nikki's CAD states its readings out loud, and even then it's a bit of an issue. Nikki is about to say "six-hour search", sees the reading, stops after "six" because she sees the CAD readout, and then Sergio suddenly knows which crate has Madoka in it? If it was just a readout, she'd need to tell him and indicate which crate the CAD had been scanning when the readout came up, and if it was read out loud, which is atypical and a little impractical for CADs but within the realm of possibility, she'd at least need to nudge him and point or something. Sergio's shown no signs of being telepathic, and the readout didn't exactly say specifics to the level of "in the little brownish-gray one, second from the left of the north wall" that would have led him to just be able to pick it out.
"Yes. Let’s get her out, I don’t think it’s very comfortable in there." That should be two sentences, divided by what is currently a comma. If you would prefer it stay in one sentence, you can substitute with a semicolon. There's another comma splice at "We were lucky, ours is on the ground," which can be fixed by either making that into two short sentences or rewording the phrase as "We're lucky that ours is on the ground." Using a semicolon in that case would create a mid-sentence tense confusion.
"Sergio muttered as he inspected the padlock keeping the container locked." A little redundancy here. A suggested rephrase might be "Sergio muttered as he inspected the container's securely fastened padlock." I was going to say "sealed padlock" to spare a word and keep a little more ambiguity, but I'm not sure if closing a lock can be referred to as "sealing" it.
"[Hm, I wonder where Sakura is.]" This should be "[Hm. I wonder where Sakura is?]", since periods at the end of questions tend to usually evoke disinterest or at the least a flat tone of voice.
"I know who you are,” Madoka interrupted him, “you’re Sergio Turbo and Nikki Cherryflower from the PPC, right?" Capitalize "You're", and replace the comma after "him" with a period.
"Sergio continued, “until we catch the one who kidnapped you and Sakura" Capitalize "until", and replace the comma after "continued" with a period.
"Corolla confirmed, [I'm afraid" That comma should be replaced with a period.
Sergio said, "In the meanwhile" Comma-period switch again, and you should replace the word "meanwhile" with "meantime". Alternatively, you could delete "In the" and just leave the "Meanwhile", but that doesn't work quite as well in this context.
"Nikki agreed, “If they" Comma-period switch again
"Both of you,” Madoka said" Comma-period switch again.
"… We are being shipped by canons?" That first "a" shouldn't be italicized.
"but none of them was this suicidal" The "was" here should be "had been".
"habits, that would be the Goddess of Hope due to the fact that she was everywhere and everywhen. Well, she used to." The "that" should be an "it", there should be a comma after "Hope", and "used to" should be followed by "be". Also, though this might be personal preference, it might look better if "due to the fact" was replaced with "since". It's more concise.
"barely wide enough as the car" "Enough" should be followed by a comma.
"conceded, “but for" Follow "conceded" with a period, and capitalize "but".
“Those things are Porsche Cayenne Turbos, they’ve got sport suspensions and twice the horsepower we have!” Another comma splice here. Replace that comma with either a semicolon, a period, or most appropriately in this case, an exclamation mark.
"Nikki cast a worried glance behind." It looks as though there's a word missing here, probably either "her" or "them".
"I’m going to take care of them,” Nikki said while getting up from her seat," The second comma should definitely be replaced with a period, and since there are two separate thoughts being punctuated, the first comma could be replaced as well, but that one could be considered correct either way for different reasons. I'd prefer switching it out, though.
"At the joint between the two there were" Add a comma after "two".
"summoned four Barret Shoot projectiles" According to the Lyrical Nanoha wiki, the attack is called Shoot Barrett in English.
"went way off too due to Sergio" Add a comma after "too". Personally, I'd replace "too" with "as well", since "too" seems to me more of a conversational word than a descriptive or active word, but that's mostly just my stylistic choice.
"knocking it out of the chase too" My stylistic preferences from earlier would suggest that you delete the "too" here, making "chase" the last word in the sentence.
"mirror, “how did you do that?" Replace the comma after "mirror" with a period, and capitalize "how".
"over the guardrail as the car chase had a nasty effect on her stomach." To get the simple issue out of the way, there should be a comma after "guardrail". For the second, you might need to rephrase that second part. It's not bad, it's just that, due to an odd mix of definitions and helping verbs, using "had" there would make the grammatically correct phrase in that instance "car chase had had a nasty effect on her stomach", and putting two "had"s next to each other isn't very aesthetically pleasing, at least not to me.
"We’ll try,” Sergio said as he got up and walked towards Nikki and Madoka, “how do you feel?" There should be a period after "Madoka", the "how" should be capitalized, and "How do you feel?" should be followed with an indicator like "he asked the girls." so it's clear that he isn't still talking to Corolla.
Now that those are dealt with, I quite liked this. You don't need to know any of the continua involved to enjoy mysterious and seemingly impossible abductions, magical girls shooting energy blasts from the top of a moving vehicle, and the shipping preferences of omniscient deities. The car chase action scene could have stood to be more dynamic, since at times it didn't feel quite as exciting as a car chase by rights should, but I loved the way you established everything. Not only the setup for the story elements themselves, but how you gave just enough information to show what was going on and why without it seeming like exposition. The only time it seemed a little exposition-y was when Sergio and Nikki were talking about speed limits, but when I looked at that scene again after having read the rest of the chapter, I realized that it was a way of explaining the sort of conditions that would be necessary for a road to contain a high-speed chase, so that passes as well. That said, if this is going to involve enough Madoka Magica material to be considered a "crossover", I might need to get to watching more of the series. I'm going to need to find that Youtube channel that hosted the full season again. -
I already got most of those nitpicks by
on 2014-02-06 06:12:00 UTC
Link to this
If you saw my post, you'd see that I gave a blanket mention to the period-comma substitutions. However, I won't begrudge you spelling out each of those instances.
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I wanted to make sure that none were missed. (nm) by
on 2014-02-06 07:03:00 UTC
Link to this
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When's Chapter 3 coming out? by
on 2014-02-06 00:39:00 UTC
Link to this
You've done quite the job with Blank Sprite. Even having no knowledge of the Cobra 11 fandom, I did not get lost. Nice work.
A few nitpicks:
Excuse me, I have the last document you requested,” a voice behind them said.
Sergio turned around and recognized the woman as Suzanne König, the chief’s secretary. “The one with the list of their shipments? That was fast, thank you very much.”
Sergio took a quick glance at the document while the secretary walked away. “Well, isn’t that odd. There’s only one shipment on this list, and it’s still at Cologne’s docks. It’s going to be loaded on the ship today.”
In that passage, adding a paragraph break after "secretary" and deleting the break before "Sergio" might make it clearer that Agent Turbo said the "The one with the list" line:
Excuse me, I have the last document you requested,” a voice behind them said.
Sergio turned around and recognized the woman as Suzanne König, the chief’s secretary. [paragraph break]
“The one with the list of their shipments? That was fast, thank you very much.” Sergio took a quick glance at the document while the secretary walked away. “Well, isn’t that odd? There’s only one shipment on this list, and it’s still at Cologne’s docks. It’s going to be loaded on the ship today.”
Also, a few SPaG errors:
The specialized projectile made of wax and powdered iron, despide disintegrating on impact... That should be "despite."
[Then I’m surprised you aren’t going any faster,] Corolla said, [Isn’t that car a BMW?] Should be a period, not a comma, after "said."
This line has a similar problem: [Question: How do we find our container?] Corolla sent out from the RC, [Should we look for a pink and sparkly one?] That should be a period after "RC."
In fact, this type of period-comma substitution happens quite a lot in this story. Please allow me to explain the difference between those lines and this one, where the comma is merited: “A different art style doesn’t change who you are, though,” Sergio said, “or who I am, for that matters.”
In the first two lines, there are two separate sentences separated by the "[character] said" tag. In the third, it's still one continuous sentence; the tag simply went into a space in the sentence. (Without the tag, it would have read, "A different art style doesn't change who you are though, or who I am, for that matter.")
One more thing: you might want to consider hyphenating "less than eager" in the last sentence of the mission.
That said, however, good work overall. I'll be awaiting Chapter 3.
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What would happen... by
on 2014-02-05 21:52:00 UTC
Link to this
If an exorcism was attempted on a character that turned out to be a replacement?
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Exorcise gone wrong by
on 2014-02-06 20:51:00 UTC
Link to this
The Original Series didn't expand much on what happened when Jay (I think) said she accidentally invoked George Lucas during an exorcism for a different fandom. All they said was that they needed some Detanglers to clear it up.
So, if I were to yell 'Riordan' when I meant to say 'Rowling'... Would that somehow spawn a Percy Jackson/Harry Potter crossover? Actually... Riordan wrote the Kane Chronicles (same world as PJ, but still...) and mystery novels for adults, as well as the first 39 Clues book. If an author has written multiple series and you invoke them accidentally, would that create a massive crossover outbreak or what?
...This is what happens when I overthink things. Pie, anybody? -
It was Agent Dead. by
on 2014-02-07 05:49:00 UTC
Link to this
And specifically, she said that a Sailor Moon character that she exorcized in George Lucas's name was turned into a "half-Ewok, half-Jedi". That's a very odd phrasing, since Jedi do not share a single distinctive appearance or body type, but Dead is clearly not at home in either the Star Wars or Sailor Moon continua. This is particularly clear when she says that she wasn't even aware who the creator of Sailor Moon was, which raises the question of why she was exorcizing a Sailor Moon character in the first place.
I have a theory of what happened and why, though. When an exorcism is performed, the influence of the original canon flows into a character when the name of the continuum's creator is invoked, forcing the Sue-wraith out of the body. The process is essentially powered by the canon reasserting itself on the infected characters through the exorcism and returning them back to their standard settings, like rebooting a computer after running an antivirus to get rid of malware.
Thus, it's possible that the invocation of a different creator tried to force the canon of an incompatible author, in this case George Lucas, into the form of the unnamed Sailor Moon character, and the reset didn't take. There were no standard settings for magical girls in anything that George Lucas has ever made, so the canon just fit the closest parallel with the incompatible command. The "being magic" manifested in Jedi characteristics, like Force abilities and mystical weaponry, and the "being cute" manifested as Ewok traits. By that logic, invoking Riordan in the Harry Potter universe would replace the wizard in question's Potterverse magic with Kane Chronicles magic, since the House of Life wizards are the closest analogue to the Potterverse wizards that Rick Riordan has written. The Sue-wraith would either vacate as normal or be destroyed by the shift, but the DIC and/or Medical would need to come in to sort out the problem, since nobody wants to see Lucius Malfoy with the ability to summon giant energy constructs. Nobody. -
Blunt force trauma and an annoyed Replacement!Sue. :P (nm) by
on 2014-02-06 00:32:00 UTC
Link to this
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Frankly, not much. by
on 2014-02-05 22:03:00 UTC
Link to this
You can read my take on it here.
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Claiming this one. by
on 2014-02-06 03:01:00 UTC
Link to this
"The Royalmaiden's Journey" - K+ rated.
When Arnuriel is sent to follow the Black Riders, she has no idea what kind of journey is waiting for her. She sets off with the Fellowship of the Ring for an adventure of a lifetime. Legolas/OC.
I haven't yet applied for permission, but here's hoping I'll get there! -
In similar vein... by
on 2014-02-06 10:23:00 UTC
Link to this
Consider this me claiming "Suicidal Nightmare". Not only is this fic an appalling waste of effort (insofar as there was any put in), but Celestia is a platonic Lust Object (Worship Object? idk) for one of my agents.
Yup, you guessed it, she's one of the Notary's. =] -
Oh, lovely. by
on 2014-02-06 18:46:00 UTC
Link to this
A gorefic. I'm going to take on one of those soon, but not yet. However, I have to say this: This is one of the weakest gorefics I have seen in a long time. It's not scary, it's not disgusting, it's just silly. The story tries way too hard and fails gloriously. I am not often one to laugh at this kind of story, as I often take it very seriously, but come on! Rarity passing out from the stench of Luna's three month old corpse? Shining Armor sliting his throat because he failed to protect the Princess? Celestia hanging her innards on the ceiling? That's over the top, cheesy nonsense that shows how one should not do gore. Have fun taking this one on.
Now, you want some horrific stuff? How about 120 Days of Blueblood, or Momma Fluttershy, or even... *gulp*...Pinkie Pie the filly molester. In case it was not clear by my use of horrific, lat me make this clear: THOSE STORIES ARE NSFW! DO NOT READ IF YOU ARE EASILY DISTURBED. OR HUMAN. -
Gorefics? by
on 2014-02-06 20:47:00 UTC
Link to this
I know they're all infamous for a reason... but have you read Cupcakes? Rainbow Factory? Cherilee's Garden?
I read Cupcakes in the middle of the day, maybe an hour after lunchtime. I almost puked, got really freaked out, and had nightmares for three days in a row. Maybe I've just got a weak stomach, but dear God, I'm not brave enough to try to finish that one. And you wouldn't catch me near any of the other ones.
Pinkie Pie the... filly... molester...? I don't even want to know. (Which is my way of saying "I am morbidly interested, please tell me so I might overdose on bleeprin.") -
Cupcakes and Rainbow Factory have both been sporked. by
on 2014-02-07 03:14:00 UTC
Link to this
Check out the list of Killed Badfic on the wikia if you want to find the missions.
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Y'all are -adorable- by
on 2014-02-07 00:36:00 UTC
Link to this
Thinking that the mere fact that people do not have the sex we think they ought to have is galling. So cute. =]
On a less facetious note, stuff like this does not squick me. The only stuff that does is noncon. If you have to look that up... you don't have to look it up. Trust me. Your life is better that way.
Also, I'm not sure Equestria even -has- ceiling fans, so, y'know. =] -
Good Luck with it. by
on 2014-02-06 04:25:00 UTC
Link to this
I looked at claiming that one when I got my permission.
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Thank you! (nm) by
on 2014-02-06 20:10:00 UTC
Link to this
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We have a problem. A huge problem. by
on 2014-02-06 22:09:00 UTC
Link to this
PPC: The Lost Tales is gone. Every spin-off that had been attached to it, which by my count includes almost all of the important older ones that survived the horrible website crashes in the past, is shut down. Every time I try to go on the site, I get the same page, saying that the site no longer exists and asking for all references to that site to be removed. I know that the shutdown happened sometime between Monday and now, since the last time I checked the site was Monday evening, but I don't know what caused it, and more importantly, I have no idea how to get any of the stories back. Did anyone save any backups of the Lost Tales? Does anyone have any idea how to fix this?
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Okay, so... by
on 2014-02-11 14:56:00 UTC
Link to this
I've been informed that a certain page, Teena and Wyldehorse's first mission, was found to be in violation of Tripod's terms of service. I don't know how yet—I've asked, and of course I'm going to go over the TOS myself—but in the meantime, they asked me to take down the page, so I did. The rest of the site should be accessible again, though, and hopefully I'll be able to put "Captured by the Breeze" back soon. If not, I guess it'll have to go on Gdocs. Bleh. Could be worse, but bleh.
~Neshomeh -
Thanks for working on that! by
on 2014-02-13 04:34:00 UTC
Link to this
Sorry it happened at such a bad time.
I guess I'm not entirely surprised Teena and Wylde's stuff was the cause? When I was researching their minis, I was a little surprised by their spin-off. Compared to other TOS-era stuff, it has a lot more swearing, and the second mission has some pretty overt sexual stuff (from the badfic, but still).
(If anyone's wanting to read the first mission while it's down, it's still available on WayBack! Love that site so hard! http://web.archive.org/web/20050213180527/http://www.angelfire.com/anime2/linkfarm/PPC/Report1.html ) -
Yeah, but... by
on 2014-02-13 16:30:00 UTC
Link to this
If swearing or mature content was the reason, why wouldn't the second mission have been flagged instead of the first? Anyway, Tripod's TOS doesn't actually prohibit mature content. They acknowledge that it exists and advise their members to exercise caution, but they disclaim responsibility for it. Things that are prohibited include illegal activities and actively harmful content... none of which apply here. There's always the dubious claim of copyright infringement, but if that was really an issue, I should've been banned ages ago.
Tripod was no help, either; the rep I talked to told me it happened in a routine screening by their automated system, and he had no idea as to the specific (alleged) violation. He told me to get in touch if it happens again so they can take a closer look, so I'll put the page back up in a couple weeks or so and we'll see what happens.
(I think Teena and Wylde postdate TOS a little bit, by the way. If I remember right, they're more 2004-2005. I should make notes of these things.)
~Neshomeh -
Right. Didn't mean to sound like a censorship apologist. by
on 2014-02-14 02:21:00 UTC
Link to this
And it seems I'm mixing up my PPC eras! I have a pipe dream of making a page on the wiki that just lists every published PPC story in chronological order. I'm not sure it's worth even my time, though. Maybe after I retire.
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The problem is most don't have an established chron. order. (nm) by
on 2014-02-18 06:41:00 UTC
Link to this
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You might be surprised. by
on 2014-02-18 19:43:00 UTC
Link to this
I've been looking through the old LJ character journals lately. A lot of them reference events in their characters' respective mission reports, as well as events role-played by Boarders at the time. Even without dates for the missions (the journal entries have them, of course), it's possible to construct a relative timeline based on the order each character's story occurs, and fitting things in around the spots where the different authors' characters interact.
The same can be done with more modern spin-offs. The work of Miah, Caddy-Shack, Tray-Gnome, Guvnor of Space, Pretzel, Herr Wozzeck and Neshomeh (and Luxury) are all linked through a set of co-writes. (Neshomeh is further linked to Phobos, Tungsten Monk, Artic Blade, Inkling, Tomato and Sedri through hers. Sedri brings in Trojanhorse, who links to July, insanegrrl and Cassie (and Luxury again). July links to Makari.
Going back to Neshomeh, (Did I just start a new paragraph during a parenthetical? I think I did.) her usage of the older FicPsych personnel allows us to add parts of the spin-offs of Nenya Quende, Spud Avec, Nathonea and Jay and Acacia! Nathonea connects with Kaitlyn, Calista and Tawaki, as well as with the rest of Nenya's stuff, which connects to Vemi, Bjam and Miss Cam. Vemi connects to Huinesoron's Dafydd+Selene spin-off, which connects Rath and Kippur; Kippur brings in Hellga, Leto Haven and Artemis. Kippur also connects to Elvea Aure and her co-authors and to Godforsaken and Lantarmiel. Elvea's spin-off links to Chak and the Oracle at Delphi. (By the way, we've wound up right back at the old LJ journals, where this post started.) We hit the original series earlier, which connects to Rosie and Araeph (and Luxury again).
Luxury really gets around! We already saw her connected with the spin-offs of Trojie, Caddy and Jay and Acacia. She's also linked to those of Poor Cynic, Sergio Turbo and Nin Brandt in the That Series series. All of those spin-offs connect to even more . . .
Also, since we hit Dafydd, Tawaki, Artic Blade and Leto Haven, we can also connect everyone who participated in the 2009 Memorial Party, the Borg Assimilation Crisis and the group exorcisms of Arda and Narnia. But I think this post has gone on long enough!
So, uh, hey everybody: How many degrees ofKevin BaconOriginal Series is your spin-off? -
Still better than Webs were for me. by
on 2014-02-13 20:21:00 UTC
Link to this
They took my entire site down three times in the space of a few months, sent the same stock reply every time I emailed them immediately after, and were eventually able to say nothing better than 'Someone else [their service provider?] told us to take it down, maybe it has swearing in it'. Which it doesn't, though they even suggested that 'WTF' counts (hence a certain arbitrary decision by Legal). Eventually I got fed up and moved it all to GDocs.
At least Tripod are pretending to help.
hS -
The site's accessible (nm) by
on 2014-02-11 16:00:00 UTC
Link to this
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I'm on it. by
on 2014-02-06 23:52:00 UTC
Link to this
I don't know how much I can do this weekend, since I'm away from home and basically won't be available from tomorrow afternoon until Tuesday, but I DO have backups of all the content that was on the site. Don't panic.
~Neshomeh -
(sighs in relief) by
on 2014-02-07 00:04:00 UTC
Link to this
Oh, good. At least we know now that everything that was deleted can be back online once we find somewhere to put it.
Do you have any idea what happened to PPC: The Lost Tales? It's not exactly typical for everything on a site to suddenly get deleted at once. -
I don't know much yet. by
on 2014-02-07 00:07:00 UTC
Link to this
I've contacted Tripod about the matter, but I won't know anything for sure until I hear back from them. However, it seems that my account may have been locked due to "suspected abuse."
I'll keep you guys informed if at all possible, but this is basically one of the worst possible times for something like this to happen.
~Neshomeh - Oh snap. Damage control! by on 2014-02-06 22:37:00 UTC Link to this
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Here's what I've found. by
on 2014-02-06 23:35:00 UTC
Link to this
According to the wiki, this was as of September the stories stored on PPC: The Lost Tales that weren't duplicated anywhere else:
The twenty-first TOS mission, The Dark Elf
The JAAKSONS spin-off
The first All-Purpose Department spin-off
All but one of Diocletian and Suicide's missions
The SIELU spin-off
The A/V Department spin-off
The Dee and Milask spin-off, one of the first to cross over with TOS
The Teena and Wyldehorse spin-off
The Kazra and Rich spin-off
The Kwennyfer and Jane spin-off
The Aerilyn and Zera spin-off
The Amy and Brent spin-off
Most of those are important, or at least historical, though I'll admit this is the first I've heard of the last four. If we can recover the previously Lost Tales-hosted content, we should find some other more stable place to put everything in case this happens again.
I distinctly remember other records that had been stored on The Lost Tales as well, including several RP logs and Techno-Dann's character backstories, but I can't recall any individual details regarding those. -
Someone needs to message Neshomah. (nm) by
on 2014-02-06 22:59:00 UTC
Link to this
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Someone needs to message Neshomeh. by
on 2014-02-06 23:00:00 UTC
Link to this
After all, she worked on that site, right? Maybe she has a solution.
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SPaG and Usage Bugbears by
on 2014-02-07 02:09:00 UTC
Link to this
I've known people to get into heated debates about various aspects of canon and the intricacies of authorial intent. And on the internet, I pretty much expect it. But outside of a classroom or a gathering of English professors, the PPC is the only place I know of where a verbal kerfufflel can break out over the use of 'alright' versus 'all right.'
Going along those lines, what are some areas of misuse related to the English language that get you all in a tizzy? Here are some of mine (Please keep all debates that might ensue civil):
-- 'Unique' means 'one of its kind.' Therefore something cannot be 'very unique.'
-- 'Begs the question' does not mean 'raises the question.' It is a type of logical fallacy where a statement is assumed to be true using only the statement itself as evidence.
-- Punctuation specifically tied to dialogue goes inside of the quotation marks.
-- Single sentence paragraphs should only be used with dialogue or to connote an extremely important/dramatic event.
-- And pretty much anything in this video. -
Ooh, interesting question. by
on 2014-02-10 10:22:00 UTC
Link to this
1) Grammar that doesn't make sense. Example: Present Perfect Tense being in the same time frame as the Past Tense. My English tuition teacher told us that if we ever got to ride on a time machine, "go and smack whoever who invented that."
2) Grammar (at least in the past). While my English has improved by a significant amount, I usually speak broken English, and as a result, I used to screw up in Grammar. A lot.
3) Vocabulary taken from other languages. Example: confetti/coriandoli. ??????? I'm confused over that. So now I just avoid using "confetti".
~Autumn -
Since "other languages" took on a life of its own... by
on 2014-02-12 02:06:00 UTC
Link to this
Allow me to get back to your original point: "Vocabulary taken from other languages. Example: confetti/coriandoli. ??????? I'm confused over that. So now I just avoid using "confetti"."
Granted, in a language like ours, where we take words wholesale from foreign languages, one would hope that whoever shanghaied the word from its native language is calling upon its services to accomplish the linguistical task that it is used to doing in its native language. More often than not, such is the case. (For example, faux pas is used aright; it is French for "false step".)
But alas, our bastard language doesn't usually treat its captives so nicely, but instead impresses tasks utterly foreign to them upon these helpless words:
* A Latin verb (ignoramus, "we do not know") is slaving away as a noun meaning "dullard";
* two Chinese words meaning "work" and "together" (工合) are now yoked together to bear the meaning "enthusiastic" (gung-ho);
* and an Italian word meaning "small sweets" (confetti) has been relegated to evoke the image of small pieces of colored paper.
What should a good Anglophone do when he discovers that a word has been pressed into such unfair labor?
If the enslavement is recent, education might be the key to ensuring the word's eventual liberation before the masses continue the poor word's impressment. In this wise, much can be learned from the efforts to keep an extra "e" from muscling its way between the "g" and "m" in "judgment."
But what of words whose servitude has gone on for eons, with multitudes of people calling on it to bear a load that it was not meant to bear? We can either
*continue to call on the services of the word, content in the knowledge that it has since gotten used to its new task; or
* try to blaze a new trail, calling upon the correct word for the job, be it foreign (e.g., using "coriandoli" where everyone else uses "confetti") or Anglo-Saxon (though such a word usually does not exist in a lot of cases--for if it did, why would the foreign word have been pressed into service in the first place?)--albeit at the risk of being billed as pedants.
As for me, I follow the first path (whether for better or for worse, we can disagree). It is the path of least resistance, and sometimes, we may find that the "mistreated" word was actually not so mistreated after all. From Wikipedia:
Confetti is small pieces or streamers of paper, mylar, or metallic material which are usually thrown at parades and celebrations, especially weddings (and game shows, following the end of a milestone or the occasion of a big win). The origins are from the Latin confectum, with confetti the plural of Italian confetto, small sweet. Modern paper confetti traces back to symbolic rituals of tossing grains and sweets during special occasions, traditional for numerous cultures throughout history as an ancient custom dating back to pagan times, but adapted from sweets and grains to paper through the centuries.
(emphasis mine)
You see: we are using the correct word, since our modern usage of paper hearkens back to a time when people literally used "confetti"! -
"Vocabulary taken from other languages." by
on 2014-02-10 11:15:00 UTC
Link to this
That (a nice Old English word) could (yep, 'can' appears to be Germanic too) be (on a roll! Also Germanic)
difficult(uh-oh, looks like Latin or French) hard (phew!). Many (Germanic!) of (ditto) our (okay, this is getting silly) words (oh for heaven's sake) are ([Grumble])apparently(ha! 'Apparent' is French)seemingly('seem' is distinctly Norse, not Old English) known (Germanic) to (well, the preposition is Germanic) be (covered before) not (Germanic, by several chances) from (Old English) other (Old English)languages(French!) tongues (Old English).
So that kind of failed to prove my point. Er... kangaroo banyan lieutenant bonbon!
hS -
Heh. by
on 2014-02-11 09:14:00 UTC
Link to this
That was may not be a really good point after all.
Wow.
I knew quite a lot of English words were derived from Old English (It's Old English, after all.) but still...wow. I never knew English was inspired by French or Germanic Languages, for one.
*scurries off to do some Googling*
~Autumn -
Well... by
on 2014-02-11 11:17:00 UTC
Link to this
... 'English' (and particularly 'Old English') means 'the language of the Angles', who were a bunch of rowdy German immigrants who came over here and took our
jober, lives and entire country. (Technically they were one of a few groups of such Germans - the Saxons and the Jutes were also involved; they're also why we're commonly called 'Anglo-Saxon'). So I consider 'English' to be a Germanic tongue, and anything from any other language to be foreign.
The thing is... English comes from England (duh), which is a bit of a mess in terms of invasions. Ignoring the very early stuff, we have:
-The original Britons, who are the principle ancestors of the modern Welsh.
-The Roman invaders, who brought Latin (and later Vulgar Latin ~= Italian) as a language of commerce and government. This is why Welsh, as a language, has a bunch of Latin words - they adopted them back when the Welsh were the British, under Roman rule across the whole island.
-The Angles, Saxons, and assorted other Germans. They (attempted to) completely displace[d] the Britons (and leftover Romans - this was after the Empire collapsed), so 'Old English' - a Germanic language - came in pretty much intact. The Britons got largely driven back to Wales. But, of course, a bunch of words hung around - they always do.
-The Vikings, speaking Old Norse, did a fair amount of invading - at one point they actually ruled all of England except a tiny marshy island, but the Saxon kings came back from that one (somehow). But there's a lot of Viking vocab in English.
-The Normans, in 1066, conquered England, setting themselves up as the ruling elite. They brought Latin (as a formal language) and French with them - which is why the Saxon 'cow' becomes the French 'beef' when it goes to the Lord's table. (As a single example of this, in terms of the nobility: 'King' is Anglo-Saxon; 'Earl' is Norse; 'Count' is French)
--So by this point, the language is more accurately called Anglo-Norman. That's what I tried to demonstrate, but picked a sentence without many French-derived words in it.
And finally:
-The British Empire wreaked merry mayhem with the language. Owning a quarter of the world - plus the current United States, though not at the same time - meant a lot of exposure to new words. That's not just place-specific words (banyan, kangaroo - though we use 'kangaroo court', come to think of it), but a bunch of 'common' words, too: this page gives me words such as 'bungalow', 'loot', and 'shampoo' as Indian (Hindi/Urdu) in origin.
And, as wobbles has pointed out, we've also done our share of adopting words from other languages 'just because'. 'Robot' made its way into English in the same manner that 'sandwich' showed up in French - it comes from the first language to describe it.
(For a really fun time: try and determine the exact moment when each 'invader' suddenly becomes the hero of England's national story. The vile Roman invaders led directly to King Arthur, who fought the filthy Saxon barbarians who later produced the noble King Harald who got shot by the bloodthirsty Normans at Hastings... it's good fun!)
hS -
"The robot has a pistol!" contains two Czech words. =] (nm) by
on 2014-02-11 09:33:00 UTC
Link to this
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I ws actually interested by
on 2014-02-12 02:09:00 UTC
Link to this
when I first learned that "robot" was a Czech word. Now you're telling me that "pistol" is, too?
*looks it up*
You're right! From Dictionary.com:
Origin:
1560–70; pistole pitschal, pitschole, petsole píšt’ala literally, pipe, fife, whistle (presumably a slang term for a type of light harquebus employed during the Hussite wars), akin to pištět to squeak, peep -
was* (nm) by
on 2014-02-12 02:09:00 UTC
Link to this
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I wish I had time to discuss this. by
on 2014-02-07 17:58:00 UTC
Link to this
Alas, I do not... but I can leave you with this entertaining and useful link, which covers a lot of what we may have to say:
Common Errors in English Usage by Paul Brians.
~Neshomeh -
Potentially a regional thing... by
on 2014-02-07 02:36:00 UTC
Link to this
But a lot of people I know use 'Now in a minute' to describe something they are going to do in a minute.
Also, out of curiousity (and the amount of times I use it) is it OK, Ok, ok or okay to say that you're alright (or is it all right :P) -
All (or Oll) I know is... by
on 2014-02-07 08:59:00 UTC
Link to this
... it's alwrong to say ohkae. ;)
hS -
You're having a lot of fun with these al(word)s, aren't you? (nm by
on 2014-02-07 14:17:00 UTC
Link to this
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All ways. by
on 2014-02-07 15:13:00 UTC
Link to this
Of course, it is alone (hey, there's another one! Is there a connection between 'all one' and 'alone'?) to me whether you alenjoy me making althese puns. ;)
hS -
Both the first and the last work. by
on 2014-02-07 02:57:00 UTC
Link to this
The first is an abbreviation, but would be acceptable in non-formal contexts. The word "okay" is the original, and can be used any time that one would want to state that they are unharmed. The word "ok" sounds like the work of a confused person who assumed "ox" was plural, and "Ok" seems like he just put it at the beginning of a sentence.
"Robert, have you seen my musk ox?"
"Ok, you say? Why, there's one ok over there by the fence, Leopold, but I am afraid that I cannot see any others from here."
"What? Robert, I've only ever had one ox."
"Yes, and I quite suppose you've also had one socks and one blocks, you silly man."
"Robert, you are as dumb as rocks."
I've always hated the not-words "guesstimate" and "irregardless". Neither of those are real words, and yet people insist on saying them around me. I will probably be able to come up with more not-words later, but I'm not in a mood that I'd relish ruining right now. -
Also, I hate it when people say "decapitated head". by
on 2014-02-08 02:24:00 UTC
Link to this
Decapitation is the separation of a head from its body. You cannot separate a head from a head. The correct term would be "severed head".
Sorry if this seems like it just comes out of nowhere; I just saw "decapitated head" on a random TVTropes page and remembered how much I dislike the term. -
Irregardless? by
on 2014-02-07 07:59:00 UTC
Link to this
What is that even supposed to mean? o.O
To be honest, there aren't many things that irritate me when it comes to English, but mostly because I don't have as much contact with it as I'd like.
On the other hand, in my own language, there is a word that translated directly to 'namely', yet people use it to explain things based on facts or what's currently considered a fact (i.e.: You can't move faster than light. Namely, if something could move as fast as light, its mass would border on infinity). I haven't seen similar misuse in English language yet. -
Heh heh by
on 2014-02-10 04:52:00 UTC
Link to this
It's one of those words that negate something negative, which doesn't necessarily entail the positive opposite - if something isn't illegal it does not mean it is legal; it can be in the grey area.
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Some notes on OK and Okay. by
on 2014-02-07 03:58:00 UTC
Link to this
'OK' is actually the original version, with 'okay' emerging as a phonetic spelling later on. According to a very quick bit of internet research I did, OK is actually the more commonly used word (particularly in business writing). I prefer 'okay,' but either version is fine.
Good point with 'irregardless'. Definitely not a word I'm a fan of. -
It appears I was misinformed, then. by
on 2014-02-07 04:54:00 UTC
Link to this
If the two-capital-letter form "OK" was the original, I wonder what it originally stood for, if it stood for anything.
...
Thirty seconds later, I have discovered an entire Wikipedia article on the uncertain origins of OK. I love it when the Internet surpasses my expectations like this. I was expecting to have to wait considerably longer and find much less specific information, but I probably shouldn't be surprised, considering how many people have probably wondered the same thing in the past. -
I have another one. by
on 2014-02-07 22:56:00 UTC
Link to this
“OK” was first used by Friedrich Wilhelm von Steuben, inspector general of the Continental Army during the American Revolutionary War, when he signed letters and orders written by his secretaries or translators. It was meant to endorse what was written there, because “oll korrekt” is the German phonetic spelling of what Germans hear when Americans say “all correct”. But I don’t have any other source than “My father told me so about 1960”.
The suggestion that “OK” was meant to be the abbreviation of “Oberkommando”, as quoted in the Wikipedia article, doesn’t sound plausible. The secretary/translator would probably have written “High Command” and General Steuben’s title and other applicable phrases before Steuben signed the document.
HG -
0 Killed by
on 2014-02-07 08:07:00 UTC
Link to this
The version that I heard is that it started being used in some war (can't remember which) as short form of "0 Killed", when zero is read as 'oh', so, according to that story, OK started as "Everything's fine, no one's dead".
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Hold on, I just realised somthing. by
on 2014-02-07 07:53:00 UTC
Link to this
OK may have came from Oll Korrect.
Oll Korrect is a misspelling of All Correct.
All Correct is a synonym for All Right.
We were talking about All Right all along!
...I'm a little tired, if you can't tell. Imma sleep now.
Zzzzzzzz... -
*alright * alcorrect. :P :) (nm) by
on 2014-02-07 12:42:00 UTC
Link to this
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Hm... by
on 2014-02-07 11:32:00 UTC
Link to this
...why not have a period of time where the writers of the PPC have to take over from the Agents and vice versa? Like, the Agents have to deal with reading from ff.net and our own problems in life (e.g., college, taxes) and we have to go into the fics? Could be interesting.
Speaking of which, I might claim a fic soon. O_O~Kitty
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Agents by
on 2014-02-08 05:33:00 UTC
Link to this
I am curious to know how it would work for those of us with no agents to speak of. Mostly I am mostly talking about myself since I probably won't have an agent for a long time coming.
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Nah. (nm) by
on 2014-02-07 21:13:00 UTC
Link to this
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Most of us would probably be terrible at the Agents' jobs. by
on 2014-02-07 20:17:00 UTC
Link to this
They are usually specifically written to be capable of dealing with the problems inherent to traveling between worlds repairing the injuries to reality, whether that's simply in their personality or whether they're part of an advanced species or have access to magic or some such, while the Boarders, being normal humans who have no experience hunting down and killing super-powerful creatures, blowing up planets, or untangling timelines, would be considerable less able to deal with the Agents' problems, especially if it's a sudden switch that leaves them replaced with the characters they write. I'm not saying that everyone would be absolutely incompetent, and in fact there may be a few of us who could do their jobs decently or even well if they were lucky enough to land in positions where they could best use their existing skills, but there would be many that wouldn't or couldn't be acclimated to the job, and our performance as plot protectors would suffer for it.
Plus, keep in mind that PPC Boarders who have any Agents tend to make at least two or three of them. If the writers and Agents swap places, not only would we be less capable of dealing with the job, but the number of PPC employees would drop by at least half. Considering that the PPC is already constantly understaffed, that would definitely not be a good thing, especially since practically nobody writes for Infrastructure or Security any more. SeaTurtle would be all alone in the Intel offices, and Huinesoron would be the only person working on Building Maintenance while also running double-duty with DOGA. And who would be the Department of External Security? All of its employees seen so far are either free-to-use or haven't yet been defined, but without them, the nebulous threats on HQ that the DES Agents spend so much time fighting that they are barely even shown would have full freedom in HQ, and all that could stop them would be a small contingent of Internet people who are still getting a handle on their new duties.
I realize that this is a very cynical interpretation. For a bit of levity, feel free to imagine the flip side of this, with the Agents being sent to Earth and having to live "normal" lives. Think of all of the elves that would suddenly need to learn how to drive cars to keep from getting fired from their new jobs, or the numerous anthropomorphic or otherwise humanized animals walking around the grocery store buying food while deliberately not making eye contact with the dozens of people who are staring at the strange creature in their midst and wondering if they should call security. -
Boarders as Agents is getting more interesting by the second by
on 2014-02-07 22:06:00 UTC
Link to this
...I'm a bit more fascinated by tossing the agents into RL--possibly even preferably our own RL. Dawn would probably alienate a large number of my friends within days. The Elves...would awkward it up. I don't even really want to know how a Klingon would deal with being a TA in a class of fourth graders--although you never know, he might be surprisingly good at it...apart from that, I'm blanking, but it sounds pretty amusing.
~DF -
Best-behaved fourth graders ever ;) (nm) by
on 2014-02-08 13:00:00 UTC
Link to this
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Are you suggesting... by
on 2014-02-08 00:48:00 UTC
Link to this
...that we can turn this into an RP or something?
I'm in. -
(To be honest, I was thinking more of drabbles or a oneshot) (nm by
on 2014-02-09 02:35:00 UTC
Link to this
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Could we not? Or make it smaller scale? by
on 2014-02-08 05:06:00 UTC
Link to this
We already had the Blackout drag everyone into it one way or another last year, and if we start doing shenanigans like this over and over - especially stuff on the level of "all the Boarders are agents and all the agents are stuck on World One" - we have 2009 all over again.
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I have an idea. by
on 2014-02-09 02:19:00 UTC
Link to this
What if it wasn't everyone who ended up in the Boarders' RLs trying to figure things out (and vice versa)--what if it's just that there's a particular plothole or two in HQ that a couple of agents happen to walk into? That way, whoever wants to write these stories can do so--but it wouldn't involve everyone. The plotholes could even only be active for one or two days, and they could be in somewhat out-of-the-way places to begin with. Most of HQ need never even hear about it--it could just be one of those rumors that someone complains to the Multiverse Monitor about, or not even that.
Thoughts? Because this really seems like an awesome opportunity for character development (and shenanigans), but you're right about the large-scale aspect (and wow, the Blackout was already last year...) Would this make it small-scale enough?
~DF -
Or just make it an out-of-continuity thing. by
on 2014-02-08 06:50:00 UTC
Link to this
Sorta like a side story, just done for kicks. We could write posts about how agents (re)adjust to life in World One and how us as Boarders struggle with the concept of actually making the PPC work.
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That's what I was thinking from the beginning. by
on 2014-02-08 15:19:00 UTC
Link to this
There would be far too many unlikely scenarios that would need to all line up to make a Boarder-Agent switch possible, and besides, such a switch would probably kick off the Swansong crisis all over again times a few hundred if we keep said switch in-continuity. If we make it a non-canon AU, though, we wouldn't necessarily need to explain why the switch happened, since it wouldn't have repercussions aside from the ones within the RP, and the consequences could be explored, if people want to do so, but they wouldn't be made part of the official PPC canon on account of the entire scenario being out-of-continuity. It wouldn't be an Emergency; it would just be for fun.
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I still think it's a bit much. (nm) by
on 2014-02-08 15:16:00 UTC
Link to this
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Would this be with our Board personas, or our actual selves? by
on 2014-02-08 02:31:00 UTC
Link to this
Because if I can play as the competent, spider-robot-building version of Outhra I allude to in some Board posts, I'm in, but if it would have to be my IRL self who speaks primarily in awkward pauses, social confusion, and inadvertently-conversation-dominating monologues, I would probably be too embarrassed to get involved in the RP.
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Heh. by
on 2014-02-07 20:35:00 UTC
Link to this
Yeah, I think I'd be spread thin over DMS, DIC, DMSE&R, the Multiverse Monitor, and DOI, and that's just for the characters I've actually written complete things for. Factoring the mentioned characters, I'd also have to do Medical, DoSAT, A/V, and the Cafeteria. Phew.
But I could totally do the Cluedo thing. I think.
That being said, a good question would be, if you were in the PPC, where would you serve? I mean, realistically speaking, that is. I'm good at drawing, editing, and making snarky comments, so I'd probably be in DTE. Or maybe writing for the Monitor like I kinda do already.
Conversely, I can imagine Christianne and Eledhwen fitting right into the culture of Wellesley. Both have had experience with World One-styled college education and Christianne is a raging feminist and fandom-collector, so... -
Re: Heh. by
on 2014-02-07 23:37:00 UTC
Link to this
I have Agents in the DMS and DIC, plus Dr Kindheart, Caroline (DoSAT), and Anne, who due to reasons I can't remember if I've explained yet is simultaneously in DoSAT, Intelligence, and probably in a bunch of other departments in small roles.
Out of my Agents... I don't think most of them would do very well in high school. I don't think any of them are from anything like a World 1 background or education.
I can see myself doing well in Intelligence. I quite like making extremely detailed explanations of Why Bad Thing Is Bad. so that'd work all right. -
So I type in "Wellesley"... by
on 2014-02-07 22:08:00 UTC
Link to this
...and find out that you guys have a funny statue of a man sleepwalking in the snow wearing just his underpants.
somebody please put a coat on the poor thing and give him some hot chocolate, I feel bad for it
I wish my campus would do fun things like this, but no, it's just rain, power outages, cruddy lab equipment, and construction. At least there's a huge telescope a few hours from here. -
Oh, you heard of Joe, then? by
on 2014-02-07 22:16:00 UTC
Link to this
Otherwise known as That Statue, the Naked Guy, and Creeper.
He's at the heart of a fierce debate about art versus triggers right now, which the mainstream press hasn't done justice to. Both sides have their good points, yet all everyone else seems to care about is "OMG A NAKED MAN STATUE AT A WOMEN'S COLLEGE!!1!1 HOW SCANDALOUSSS!1!!1!", which is really irritating.
I'm with you on the put a coat on the dude thing. Problem is, every time someone does so, said coat/scarf/hat mysteriously vanishes within a couple of hours...
We have two telescopes. One of them is antique. They're both in a very nice observatory behind the Science Centre. -
His name is Joe? (nm) by
on 2014-02-08 15:08:00 UTC
Link to this
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Facebook and Twitter call him Joe. (nm) by
on 2014-02-08 17:32:00 UTC
Link to this
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So his name is Joe... by
on 2014-02-08 20:19:00 UTC
Link to this
...he hangs around on campus, and he's probably very, very cold?
I HAVE NO REGRETS -
Well.. by
on 2014-02-07 20:34:00 UTC
Link to this
That would be so funny.
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Newcomer. by
on 2014-02-08 03:11:00 UTC
Link to this
Hi, I'm Kelly and well, I'm new to the PPC.
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Read the stuff?: Yes.
Preferred Continua: Homestuck/Hussieverse (includes SB&HJ and Problem Sleuth), Doctor Who, The Hunger Games, Puella Magi Madoka Magica, Star Trek, Yume Nikki, Starcraft (if there are even any StarCraft badfics for sporking), Vocaloid, Wreck-it Ralph (I -sometimes- MST some of those cliché 'Vanellope's Long Lost Sister' fanfics.), Nintendoverse (Mostly The Legend of Zelda and Metroid), Kagerou Project
Fandoms: Homestuck/Hussieverse, Puella Magi Madoka Magica, Yume Nikki, Mass Effect, Starcraft, Accel World, Vocaloid, Doctor Who, Star Trek, Half-Life (Sub-continuum: Portal), World of Warcraft, Dragon Age, Touhou Project, Wreck-it Ralph, Nasuverse Visual-Novels/Manga, Kagerou Project
Where did you find the PPC?: When I was searching for 'Mary Sue OCs' on Google. And then I just clicked the link.
Favorite Agents: Desdendelle, Jay and Acacia.
Stuff I do for fun: Pixeling/spriting and making games on Ace VX.
I'm so happy to see all of you! (And can I get Agent permission now?) -
Hello by
on 2014-02-18 21:29:00 UTC
Link to this
Well,have a box set of Scrubs.It should calm you down after badfic. It works for me!
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Welcome! by
on 2014-02-10 10:01:00 UTC
Link to this
Hello, have a bar of Bleepolate and a torch that shines ultra-urple light.
No, I don't think you can get Permission right now, as we need to get to know you first. Additionally, you must have a few of your Agents' profiles and an excerpt from a mission ready to present. Also, you may also not be granted the Permission on your first request as some of our Permission Givers may find significant areas for you to improve on your Agents. Hope this answer helps! ;)
Enjoy the PPC!
~Autumn -
*waves* by
on 2014-02-10 03:09:00 UTC
Link to this
Hello and greetings!
I gift to you now a lined Infinite Notebook, featuring, as always, urple covers and wilver binding. Welcome to the Board!
-Aila -
Hey there! by
on 2014-02-09 08:46:00 UTC
Link to this
Welcome! Have a PPC mug of infinite [insert your favorite drink here]!
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Hello! by
on 2014-02-09 04:34:00 UTC
Link to this
*notices Accel World in the list*
Oh...my...God! Another Accel World fan! Finally! Do you watch the anime, or do you read the manga? If you only read the manga, don't spoil anything for me; I only watched the anime on Hulu. Man, that is an epic series, don't you think? Pity that there aren't any new episodes out yet. I wonder when the next season's ... coming ... out ...
*notices the blank stares all around SOH176*
Ahem.
Uh...
Enough fanboying. Yeah.
Uh, either way, I really liked that anime.
As for Star Trek, what particular series do you like? I'm partial to Voyager, myself.
And could you please give the URLs to any of your Wreck-it Ralph MSTs? I have not had the (mis)fortune of running across a Wreck-it Ralph Sue (then again, I never looked for them).
As for your newbie gift...
*rummages through bag of holding*
Aha!
Here, have a Porygon! Assuming that the Flowers let you use it in missions, it can come in handy for wrecking a god-moding Accel World Sue. -
Hello! by
on 2014-02-09 03:47:00 UTC
Link to this
Hey! A Touhou Fan!
I'm not the only one anymore, I suppose.
Here, have a Dodger. Use it, and a urple light will surround you, temporality blinding enemies (and you). -
Re: Newcomer. by
on 2014-02-09 02:16:00 UTC
Link to this
Hi, have some fudge!
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Welcome! by
on 2014-02-08 21:14:00 UTC
Link to this
Go Star Trek and Wreck-It-Ralph! *High Fives*
Here, have some hilari-tea, guaranteed to make you laugh through even the worst fic, a pair of stainless steel chopsticks that double as knitting needles (or weapons,) and a shiny rock! -
Nice to meet you! by
on 2014-02-08 14:56:00 UTC
Link to this
I see we share some of the same fandoms. Please accept my gifts of a potato cannon, a basket of potatoes, and an Official Fanfiction University of Doctor Who sweatshirt.
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Welcome! by
on 2014-02-08 12:16:00 UTC
Link to this
Have a Kyubey and a weapon of your choice to kill the alien furball from hell with.
*coughs* Anyways, happy to see another Madoka Magica fan here! -
Welcome. by
on 2014-02-08 12:04:00 UTC
Link to this
Oh, apparently I have a fan. Heh heh. Here, have a cup of Grand Jasmine Mao Feng tea - just don't let the leaves eat you.
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Greetings and bienvenue! by
on 2014-02-08 04:46:00 UTC
Link to this
Hooray! We have several shared fandoms! To celebrate two of them, have a Gust Jar and a Warhammer of Zillyhoo!
You'll need a while before you can request Permission, but there isn't any restriction on when you can put up your character ideas here to see what people think about them. I'd recommend not making new threads for each proposed idea, though, since that sort of thing quickly fills up the front page. If you were wanting to show us in the next few days or so, you could put the information in a new post on this thread, as a response to your initial post, and people would see it. -
Well, agent permission comes with time... by
on 2014-02-08 03:21:00 UTC
Link to this
...but in the meantime, we still love newbies! So come on in, take your shoes off, leave your sanity at the door, and come on in!
And wait, is that another Puella Magi Madoka Magica/Mass Effect/Hunger Games fan I see there? Then come on in, we've got cookie!
As a welcome gift, have some music by Louis Andriessen: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oaATmagbYsw
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Just found a Self-Insert x Cybrid!King Candy fic. by
on 2014-02-08 03:43:00 UTC
Link to this
http://thequeenofsugarrush.deviantart.com/art/Do-you-still-love-me-376495528
Uhh...yeah.
And apparently, the writer is a kinda rabid King Candy fangirl that calls Vanellope fans 'butthurt' (in other words, she's a Vanellope hater) and hates Sylveon. Both of 'em, with a burning passion. Don't believe me? Look at het deviantART gallery. -
We already have three other badfic threads on the front page by
on 2014-02-08 05:00:00 UTC
Link to this
I'm not sure whether you're familiar with the protocol, since you did only join up less than two hours ago, but since the Board can only hold twenty-five threads at a time before the older ones start getting bumped off of the front page and people stop checking them, Boarders usually put any badfics that they find onto a single thread to save space. That designated badfic thread then stays around for a while, is replied to by other Boarders after said Boarders find new badfics to report, and is usually replaced soon after the previous one is pushed onto the second page. Due to what I'm pretty sure was a series of misunderstandings, one person posted two badfic threads right next to each other on the same day at the same time that another one was still around, which is currently causing a surplus, and this new badfic thread only adds to that.
It's an honest mistake, but in the future, try to make sure that before you create a thread for a new topic, there isn't one that's already on the front page that your new post could fit into.
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Anyone watched the Sochi Olympic Opening Ceremonies? by
on 2014-02-08 04:38:00 UTC
Link to this
It was no Beijing, to be sure, but it was awesome in its own way. What did you think of the Ceremonies? What was your favorite moment?
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I didn't watch all of it- by
on 2014-02-10 03:16:00 UTC
Link to this
-(I've spent the past week obsessively reading The Dresden Files and that night was no exception), but what I did watch was really very lovely, although the fact that my brother called me over at only the best parts may have helped.
But I think they'd been watching Doctor Who when they designed those headdresses that the women with the name-signs for each country were wearing. They looked rather like some of the Big Stupid Collars the High Council of Gallifrey wears.
-Aila -
While it wasn't as extravagant as Beijing... by
on 2014-02-08 15:05:00 UTC
Link to this
It was lovely. Although the error with the rings was a bit awkward (I've heard there are T-shirts)
I really like how they incorporated the history of Russia. And the performance was beautiful, though not quite on Beijing's level. I think my favorite moment was the video with the Russian alphabet.
And I loved the music that played in the background when each country was introduced. I think it was a remix of classical music by Russian composers.
My personal favorite opening ceremony was the 2012 Summer Olympics.
What did you think of the outfits for each country.
The USA's were adorable and slightly dorky. They were adorkable. -
"Adorable and slightly dorky"? by
on 2014-02-09 04:46:00 UTC
Link to this
Are you being euphemistic? The second I saw the design in the local news, I thought they were ugly. That design looks more "patchwork quilt" than "Olympian's Opening-Ceremonies garb."
But yeah, the music was good. -
Agreed enthusiastically. by
on 2014-02-09 07:26:00 UTC
Link to this
They look like somebody's drunk grandma got a hold on some old flags and knitted them together. It just so happened that woman's grandkid was in charge of making the Olympic uniforms, so bullied them untill they promaced to make this patriotic Christmas abomination the official uniform for the United States. But that's just my opinion.
I sadly missed most of the opening, but what I saw was fantastic. I did notice some 'inspiration' from other Olympics. (If the English can raise a city, so can we!) However, it showcased Russian history and culture very well, and some of the visuals were breathtaking. A great start to a (hopefully) great Olympics. -
That's a bit harsh, hm? by
on 2014-02-09 08:35:00 UTC
Link to this
I wouldn't describe the American uniforms that way, but I agree that they look rather garish.
Now the Canadian coat, on the other hand... I'd wear that if I had the money. -
I didn't watch much of it... by
on 2014-02-08 05:56:00 UTC
Link to this
...But it's hard to imagine that it contained a better moment than when dozens of Russian policemen took the stage to sing Daft Punk's "Get Lucky" on worldwide television. I have absolutely no idea what led the Russian Olympic planning committee to whatever deranged but ultimately genius decisions were responsible for that moment, but they were all worth it.
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Newb Can Haz Question? by
on 2014-02-08 05:03:00 UTC
Link to this
First:
I have read and agree to the Constitution and FAQ (how the heck do you manage to agree with an FAQ?! There's nothing to agree to! :P), although the former was common sense anyways, and even if I didn't agree, it's in my nature to do that stuff anyways. XP
Fandoms? Well, I'd say, but I'm undercover at the moment. I told my fandoms I had things to do when the truth was that I simply didn't feel like socializing anymore (and frankly, I still don't, but I felt the question was important enough to me to break my internet silence to ask). I'm a terribly paranoid person, and also one that tries not to hurt anyone's feelings (well, until they do something incredibly stupid or tries to hurt someone else- then you meet my rude side. XD).
TVTropes Has Directed Me Here. :3
What else I do for fun? Not much. Fandoming is pretty much all I do, either physically or in my mind. It's just sometimes I get tired of dealing with the fans- it's not them, it really is ME. I have some kind of disorder, so I socialize for a while, then get really paranoid and retreat. I'm in the latter, but this question has been bugging me for nearly a decade.
Gender pronoun: Have fun- I'm genderfrak, so nyeh. *pllt*
What I wanted to ask was this. Why do I want to ask you guys? Because you're professional badfic sporkers, and I wanted your take on this:
I was involved in a small uproar about 8 years ago on fanficition dot net wherein an author (thankfully not me, as I wasn't posting to the site at the time) posted ONE badfic out of misjudgment. Normally, he was a good author, but for some reason, his brain shut down on this one. Needless to say, he was sporked. It wasn't the sporking, but one single comment that set him off: basically, one sporker in particular treated him as a child, saying that she was glad he wanted to write for a particular fandom. I agreed that the comment was out of line, because I mean, WTH? What purpose did it serve?
Anyways, he goes off, that attracts ants (in retrospect, that was a reference and not an insult; just wanted to put that out there before I got MYSELF sporked :3) that tell him he just wants mindless good reviews, when I know him and know that's not the case- there were others that sporked him before that that he didn't retaliate against. He would have just admitted that it was a badfic, and maybe taken it down if she hadn't made that comment. What made me want to ask was he did indeed use the "It's fanFICTION!" argument, to which I burst out laughing for reasons I can't exactly explain.
So, I was wondering: How you do guys feel about sporking authors (and authoresses- I don't care for political correctness, but technical term correctness, I'm a stickler about) that are otherwise good but make one slip-up?
Although let me disclaim in advance: Upon rereading his most prolific work, that... yeah. That one turned out to be major suckage as well, but all his one shots were of quality, at least. That one appeared to be another error in judgment, one that scarily continued on for about 2 years... I have no idea what happened to that man's sanity for that work. Yee. Unless the point was to with hold sanity, that sounds like something he'd do... but the badfic in question was serious, and an actually honest lapse in judgment.
TL;DR: What about when good authors go bad? How do you feel about sporking then? And my bigger concern was with the senseless comment: I've done my share of sporking as well, and I can get very... uh... "condescending" when I need to, but even I felt that "I'm glad you want to write for such-and-such" was just way too far. I don't know what it is, but... what do you guys think of that? -
Salutations! by
on 2014-02-20 02:01:00 UTC
Link to this
I don't have anything to say about your question that hasn't been answered by everyone else, so I'm just going to say hi! Here are your presents:
1) A fluffy white bunny (I suggest you never take it off its chain leash; it has great big teeth.)
2) One can of urple spray paint
And 3) A giant donut with chocolate sprinkles
Welcome to the Board! -
Salutations! by
on 2014-02-20 02:00:00 UTC
Link to this
I don't have anything to say about your question that hasn't been answered by everyone else, so I'm just going to say hi! Here are your presents:
1) A fluffy white bunny (I suggest you never take it off its chain leash; it has great big teeth.)
2) One can of urple spray paint
And 3) A giant donut with chocolate sprinkles
Welcome to the Board! -
Oh geez by
on 2014-02-20 02:04:00 UTC
Link to this
I have no idea how I managed to post like ten of the same message... Stupid phone. Next time, I'm waiting until I have computer access to post. Ugh. Sorry.
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The mobile devices are rising up against us! by
on 2014-02-20 21:02:00 UTC
Link to this
One attack is an error. Two attacks is a coincidence. If there are three or more...
It's a plan.
As the first two victims of the attempts by the mobile devices to overrun the Board with duplicate posts, we must be ever vigilant. Should our watch slip, an innocent newbie posting a new thread could inadvertently push every other thread off of the front page, replacing every thread with the same post, repeated over and over and over. Forever. -
Hi newbie! by
on 2014-02-08 21:30:00 UTC
Link to this
Because newbie is completely neutral. :D
First, your stuffs! You can have a muffin tin (slightly less melee damage than a frying pan,) one massive bag of almond bark, and a nifty space pen. (Guaranteed to look exactly like a regular pen except that you use it on things like Star Trek PADDs.)
As for your question, I'm going to throw in my two cents despite the fact that I don't actually have permission here. (Combination of school and the fact that I have trouble doing any fanfic longer than about a thousand words...)
Here's the thing: people aren't the best judges of their own work, mostly because their brains autocorrect a lot of their stuff to what they meant to say. When you find an author who does decent shorts, it's possible that the ideas that they had just didn't sustain a multi-chapter fic, that they grew too attached to an idea that didn't fully make sense, or simply that they don't have a good sense of timing yet and don't know when to end their stuff. On the other hand, they may have been trying too hard to drive up readership with a multi-chapter fic, or had a beta for the short ones... the list goes on and on. I can't quite make a judgement not having seen the actual fic.
My advice for dealing with that is to do what you appear to be suggesting: leave constructive criticism like "I liked x fic better than this one, I feel you kept character Y in character very well there. In this fic they were kind of OOC."
If the fic really sucks, feel free to spork it elsewhere, like here, so that those of us who are interested can learn where things went wrong, but don't tell them or link back: that cuts down on drama. :D -
Good question. by
on 2014-02-08 20:15:00 UTC
Link to this
Personally, I think that when we select badfics to spork, we should consider the general quality of the author's work. If they appear to have produced multiple good works and a single spork-worthy story, giving the author constructive criticism should be our first response.
It could be the lack of beta-readers, it could just be how the idea somehow didn't translate too well on paper (word processor?), or it could just be a really off day for them. Regardless, telling the author-- any author in fact-- what we enjoyed about the story and what we feel could have been better executed should be the first course of action.
On the other hand, if said author continues to churn out some ridiculous and unintentionally silly fics and actively ignores polite constructive criticism, then I believe it is permissible to spork a story.
Just like Kittythekatty said below me, we're not here to bully authors into giving up writing, nor are we the fandom police. We're here to make light out of the very best of the very worst.
Oh, and welcome to the Board! We hope you enjoy your stay here. -
Hello by
on 2014-02-08 14:53:00 UTC
Link to this
Nice to meet you. To answer your prompt, I would have to say we all make mistakes. We all, at one point post a badfic. Good or Bad author, we should n't be rude to them.
I guess, at the PPC we deal with the fic, we don't bully the author.
I admit, I do get frustrated when tryinv to deal with someone who is unreasonable. But I guess, you treat the author as you would want to be treated. -
Glad for the feedback by
on 2014-02-08 22:10:00 UTC
Link to this
See, all you guys said everything I was thinking. It didn't make sense to me that he posts just one bad story (and actually, the one I was referring to was a short- the terrible multichap in question went unsporked :P)/. And naturally, the person's friends all came to save her when he called her out on the comment. *eyeroll* Well, I found the validation I was looking for, so yay. I'd never questioned anyone about it, and I'm not sure why it just never left my mind. I guess because I don't take kindly to such comments myself, especially since reviews are supposed to be for the story, not the author.
Actually, the longer badfic (I was thinking of "magnum opus" before when I said "most prolific") wasn't really bad, just... manic. It seemed like he was a 4 year old on an experimental playground with no safety protocol. That's part of the reason why I don't think that one was serious- it wasn't his usual style. The writing wasn't the problem- the execution was fine. It was the fast, dangerous, aggressive plot. The thing was literally insane. During that time, his shorts were of usual style and quality, another thing that leads me to believe that one was just "hey, let's see what I'm capable of with no restraints". And hey, it was acclaimed, so I guess he still did something right.
But the one in question was clearly a slip up, which was what irked me- all that over the one single piece of suck he accidentally posted? I could have understood "this story is bad; here's what's wrong with it" but being talked to like a misbehaved tot for no reason? Urgh. I'll do it to someone already acting like a child (whinging, throwing a tantrum, etc), but I never do it without proper provocation.
And thanks for the welcome. :3 -
Re: Glad for the feedback by
on 2014-02-09 02:15:00 UTC
Link to this
That sounds like he was experimenting with a different writing style.
And welcome, have some fudge!
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I have this idea by
on 2014-02-08 16:37:00 UTC
Link to this
to be short and sweet, I want to make a fantasy web comic at some point in my life (maybe in about ten years).
what I want to do with the comic is fairly simple; its basically a fantasy world with modern day tech, government, entertainment, and a few other things but I can't remember what the right words are.
My problem is this, I've been buying some RPG monster guide books (the series being Pathfinder) to help with the monster creation but now i'm worrying if I might be plagiarizing the book accidentally. Like if I see something interesting in the book and I think its something that's been apart of the monster forever and so I use for the monster in my comic. Unfortunately, now I find out this is something the company came up with so now I'm being called a plagiarist without even knowing I was. So should I stop using the books and find a different way of getting the info I need.
I thought that maybe someone here could help me out. If I didn't word something right or if you just don't get what I'm trying to ask, please tell me so I can be more specific and explain more because I really could use some help here.
P.S. if you would also like to know more about the comic, again, please ask :) -
From what I know by
on 2014-02-08 17:29:00 UTC
Link to this
You don't have to worry. So long as the whole monster isn't ripped word for word out of one of the books you should be fine.
ADVANCE WARNING: TVTROPES LINK AHEAD
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/OurDwarvesAreAllTheSame
just look at how many different things use the exact same base model for a dwarf for instance.
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It is my sad duty to inform you... by
on 2014-02-08 23:21:00 UTC
Link to this
https://www.fanfiction.net/s/9945397/1/Darkness-Rising
No squick or world entanglement, just an über-powerful, über-evil, über-telepathic Tenth Walker Sue who yanks Legolas OOC like a hungry mutant koala yanks the brains out of a baboon. I have a sneaking suspicion it may be a parody. I truly, fervently hope it is a parody.
(Forgive my sorry attempts at similes. It's been a long day.) -
Well.. by
on 2014-02-18 20:37:00 UTC
Link to this
Kill it with fire. NOW! Let the sod burn.
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Quoth the Hedgehog: Nevermore. by
on 2014-02-11 05:25:00 UTC
Link to this
Good God man, that's terrible! And the author's other stories aren't much better.
The Emperor Protects! -
/whispers by
on 2014-02-09 00:44:00 UTC
Link to this
There are a loooooot of badfic reporting threads on this front page already. Perhaps you could stick it there next time?
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Will do next time. Sorry. (nm) by
on 2014-02-09 12:33:00 UTC
Link to this
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I've been listening to Welcome to Night Vale all day, so: by
on 2014-02-09 00:43:00 UTC
Link to this
Every day is a new start. Except for those days where your internal sense of time is disrupted by a loud and irritating console [BEEEEEEP.]
Welcome to Headquarters.
The Cafeteria’s new stringent food-providing standards have produced foodstuffs that are significantly less Glitter-drenched than previously before, although many Agents are claiming that the meatloaf is still wobbling suspiciously. Said Agents then proceeded to stab viciously at their meatloaf. It is not known at this time if they are functioning under a mass delusion.
The Time Lords of HQ have announced that they have created a Continuity Council to monitor their home continuum, that of the most mysterious and paradoxical land of Who. They are also very empathically not attempting to take over the PPC. The Dalek Council founded in opposition have offered no similar assurances, although they seem to be sporting new Daleks.
Upstairs have reminded us that the Auditoriums are not to be approached for any reason whatsoever, and most certainly have nothing to do with the sudden appearance of a decrepit beige photocopier that is suspiciously bigger on the inside. DoSAT has apprehended said photocopier for repairs. They say half of the accoutrements inside the photocopier have been put in place with Silly String. A word of advice: never glue your transportation devices together with Silly String. Or Serious String, for that matter.
Now, a look at our community calendar:
On Sunday, there will be a performance by A Troupe by Any Other Name of Shakespeare’s Othello, set in a busy seaside town in Telmar. As is usual by the members of this mysterious Shakespeare troupe, the casting is never revealed until the end of the show. However, there are rumours that Technician Neo Webber is playing Othello and that Cafeteria Worker Nerys Carpenter is playing Desdemona. Neither have confirmed nor denyed this, though we hear that Multiverse Monitor reporters have been distracted by Glitter in their attempts to procure interviews, enabling the two to get away.
On Monday, the Bleepka Bar will be offering a discount on all cocktails with names originating in the Discworld continuum. That means the Wizzard Blizzard and the Teething Luggage are being distributed at half-price, although both come with warnings of extreme amnesia and indigestion.
On Tuesday, there will be Ypurs strolling down the halls to the Mongoose Shelter. Please take caution and do not disturb them. Do not adopt the Ypurs. Do not touch them. Do not look at them. Do not even think of them.
On Wednesday, Agents Jacques Bonnefoy and Luxury will be staging a musical number involving coconut bras, a cardboard cutout of former Agent Dafydd Illian, and a boar’s head. The location of this musical number is unknown, and Agents are advised to take caution when wandering the dangerous and reality-bending halls of HQ, for fear of being press-ganged into participation.
On Thursday, the Cluedo Circuit at Rudi’s Pub moves into its annual championship round. Dalek Agent Omicron is facing off Agent Wobbles of the infamous children’s TV show. The betting pool currently contains a Winterwood minigun, a flask of Logic Water, and several dried pieces of lint.
On Friday, there will be Punctuation Rain near the lifts Upstairs. Do not attempt to contact Upstairs on Friday, although I highly suspect they do not want you contacting them any other day of the week as well. It is all too possible that they have scheduled the Punctuation Rain outside their lifts for this very reason.
On Saturday, Joel Whitegrass will present his exhibition of Extremely Lifelike Statues that are Definitely Not Petrified Mary Sues. Bring sunglasses and lemming repellent.
We have just received news that an Extremely Lifelike Statue that is Definitely Not a Petrified Mary Sue has appeared outside the Lobby, frozen in a glomping position – for reference, a glomp is a movement where a predator seeks to pounce upon its prey, but not necessarily in a hostile manner – while dressed in nothing but cellophane and chewed-up bubblegum. Passerby have called it various things, from ‘disgusting’ to ‘hilarious’. Any attempts to clothe the Sue have resulted in the clothes magically disappearing.
The intrepid and dashing Scientist Carlos is looking into this mass hallucination of mobile meat at the Cafeteria. He has commandeered the victims and is examining their brainwaves. I cannot help but marvel at his skills and his extremely well-coiffed hair. It is even better-styled than an Elf’s, but do not tell the Elves I said that.
What is it, Assistant Levi?
Threatening messages from the Elvish Agents? I am dreadfully sorry, but have any of you seen Scientist Carlos’s hair? No? Perhaps you will see the error of your ways. Now, a word from the sponsors.
Sometimes you stare into the darkness of the void, and the darkness stares back at you and whispers about the end of all days. Other times it tells you your socks are unlaundered. And sometimes it asks you if your hands are moist because you are harbouring thoughts towards a most irresistible fellow named Michael Cassio.
Love, intrigue, sex, and death. Isn’t that the stuff of most films and stories nowadays? No wonder Suvians are so fascinated with messing things up so that they can have love and sex, but not necessarily death. Unless, you know, the hackneyed sliver of cold, dead halibut that they call a ‘plot’ calls for it.
This message is brought to you by A Troupe by Any Other Name.
I hear, listeners, that there is a petition already being passed through the Agents to remove the tasteless Extremely Lifelike Statue outside the Lobby, on the grounds that it is tasteless and triggers bad memories of past missions, which most Agents try to repress through repeated dosages of Bleeprin. Naturally, those who have not signed the petition have taken to calling the Extremely Lifelike Statue ‘Greg’ and are taking selfies with it.
Scientist Carlos has told me (quite privately, and I was very flustered about the entire encounter) that the Agents that he is studying have all consumed the same thing prior to seeing their meatloaf move. Water. Yes, Water. The one with a capital W that sparkles and slips and drips unceasingly into the glittering void?
Upstairs has issued a warning to stay well away from Water at all costs, as it is apparently bringing back awful flashbacks of Slorp for those who consume it. It may also be connected to the unsettling feeling one receives upon witnessing the Extremely Lifelike Statue outside the Lobby.
That, Carlos says, is just the Aura of Smooth. It is remarkable that Whitegrass would be so accurate in his portrayal of an Extremely Lifelike Statue that is Definitely Not a Petrified Mary Sue that he would even preserve the Aura of Smooth that the Sue would have possessed before –
What’s that? The statue moved? Are the Extremely Lifelike Statues actually Weeping Angels? Carlos is getting concerned. I must go to him. Here, have the weather.
(The Weather: Television by You Won’t)
Crisis averted, folks. Looks like the Extremely Lifelike Statues were indeed Petrified Mary Sues, and have therefore been quarantined to be disposed of. Preferably with mallets and grenades. Mr Whitegrass has been taken in by some DIA Agents in suits and sunglasses for questioning. However, the Extremely Lifelike Statues did not, in fact, move at all; turns out the people who were suffering under the influence of Water had seen the Extremely Lifelike Statue and merely hallucinated it to be moving. Needless to say, that statue has since then been set on fire, blown apart, and sliced into tiny pieces. Never irk an extremely high Agent.
Sometimes the very reality of our existence is called into question. Are we truly here? Is here actually here? Is this Generic Surface, this concrit, these varying shades of grey with flamethrower char marks truly the reality that we call home, or are we all victims of a mass hallucination even deeper and more insidious than that of Water? What if, in another version of World One, we were all figments of someone’s – or someones’ – hyperactive imagination? But then again, that holds true for so many realities, so many alternate worlds. What is fictional in one is so very true in another, and even if we tried to look for every single continuum out there, we’d die trying. We’d be lost in the infinite expanse that is creative thought.
Stay tuned for the Lord of the Rings theme on the kazoo and birdcalls.
Good night, HQ. Good night.
((Notes: This may or may not be a Thing. I have no clue. I just needed to get this plotbunny out of the way. I don't think I caught Cecil's voice very clearly, but I'm not done with the WTNV series just yet.
Headquarters Community Radio. Possibly a reboot of the original PPC Radio hosted by Guilty Cin?)) -
*excited gasp* AWESOME. by
on 2014-02-10 03:59:00 UTC
Link to this
That was my reaction to seeing this post, and my emotions haven't changed one bit. This is perfect, both on the PPC side and the Night Vale side. It's a little scary how well they fit together, and you totally have Cecil's voice. You even included a Carlos!
(Also, what episode are you on? Have you gotten to Tamika Flynn yet? She is basically the definition of Crowning Moment of Awesome. As is this thing. No, make that Thing. It's definitely a Thing.)
-Aila -
This is so cool! by
on 2014-02-09 19:20:00 UTC
Link to this
I've been listening to a lot of WTNV in the last couple of weeks as well (discovered the podcast very recently) and I think you captured it brilliantly.
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Better if recorded. (nm) by
on 2014-02-09 12:14:00 UTC
Link to this
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If someone else does it, sure. by
on 2014-02-09 16:26:00 UTC
Link to this
I, on the other hand, sound like a possessed child when recorded, and I wouldn't be sure if that was a good thing in this case.,
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I am so beyond tempted to try... by
on 2014-02-09 18:05:00 UTC
Link to this
...but I sound nothing like Cecil. In fact, my voice is about as high-pitched as his is low (no, no, I don't break glass when I talk!) On the other hand, that may not be an issue? If nothing else, this is the HQ version...
But apart from that, I have homework I must attend to at the moment, so I suppose that will remain the obstacle for now...
~DF -
I, for the record, have made no attempt to sound like Cecil. (nm by
on 2014-02-09 20:26:00 UTC
Link to this
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Ekyl's working on it already. by
on 2014-02-09 18:06:00 UTC
Link to this
So basically the two of us are doing Multiverse Monitor and this. How delightfully journalistic. :'D
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Might or might not have a finished take in your inbox. (nm) by
on 2014-02-15 01:24:00 UTC
Link to this
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Indeed :D by
on 2014-02-09 18:11:00 UTC
Link to this
We should call you the Journalistic Two, or something...nah, that doesn't sound cool enough. The Journalistic Duo? The Journalists Two? The Newsmasters?? I'm not even sure. Something, though...
~DF -
Newsmasters sounds like a Time Lord name. by
on 2014-02-09 18:15:00 UTC
Link to this
We could be the Watchdogs. Or the Citizen Kanes.
It's funny since I don't profess to be hugely into journalism as a career. I just really like it within the bounds of the PPC. -
Check your e-mail. Also that could work for some segments. (nm) by
on 2014-02-09 16:28:00 UTC
Link to this
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...agreed. Maybe for the Word From Our Sponsor section. (nm) by
on 2014-02-09 18:07:00 UTC
Link to this
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Really cool! by
on 2014-02-09 08:55:00 UTC
Link to this
I really like this. Perhaps you should back it up somewhere else before it's pushed off the page. Would be a shame to see this lost.
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The search function will find it again eventually. by
on 2014-02-09 18:02:00 UTC
Link to this
In the meantime, I posted it to Tumblr.
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How lovely! by
on 2014-02-09 05:10:00 UTC
Link to this
I'm a fan of WtNV myself, and highly appreciate this lovely little excerpt.
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I don't even know which part of this made me laugh most. by
on 2014-02-09 02:28:00 UTC
Link to this
Probably the Time Lords empathically--you may have meant 'emphatically'?--not attempting to take over the PPC, Jacques and Luxury's musical, and the mention of Wobbles. Mainly, it was just all fantastic.
Personally, I think you caught Cecil's voice extremely clearly, considering that I started reading it in his voice (mentally) partway through. On the other hand, I'm only about halfway through the series myself, so you never know. I do love Cecil defending Carlos' hair, though; that was also fantastic.
As to whether or not this is a Thing...well, I look forward to finding out.
~DF -
This is awesome. Please do more. by
on 2014-02-09 02:25:00 UTC
Link to this
The best part about this is that it meshes so well with the PPC's brand of humour. Job well done! I especially like the references to the Notary's TARDIS and Wobbles squaring off against Omicron.
I'd better start listening to Welcome to Night Vale, everyone tells me it's really good... I hear things about glow clouds and dog parks and stuff.
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Concerning the future of the Multiverse Monitor! by
on 2014-02-09 14:32:00 UTC
Link to this
Howdy folks. As most of you know, in the early-mid part of last year there was an attempt to bring back the old Multiverse Monitor; this was... moderately successful. Sure, the Monitor is established as a thing again, but as actual issues go we turned out two and then everybody dropped off the face of the earth. With a total dryup of available staff and content, the whole thing went kaput.
That was, as they say, rather a downer. So recently I've been talking to Lily Winterwood about options for getting that whole thing back on its feet, and well hey, there was quite a bit of Boarder enthusiasm for it in the past so we figured we should poll the community and see what they think for making HQ's newsletter more of a presence. The way I see it, we have at least three options:
First, we just get right back to putting out monthly issues like in April and May, same general format and idea. This is simple on the face of it, but comes with a number of problems that would need to be addressed: first, we need a reliably active base of staff to actually put together stories and content every month, as well as someone who knows photoshop and design stuff well enough to assemble the final version for those times Lily is unavailable. This isn't necessarily permanent staff, people can rotate in and out as they have time to contribute, but we need to have at least a few people who will be reliably active and involved. We also need to tackle the issue (heh!) of lack of content; most months, not a lot happens on the Board and not a lot new gets published very often, so if we stick just to meta news we're going to run dry again - to counteract this, I'm open to any suggestions on recurring features people might have, and also on uneventful months I'm considering making up stories that would be newsworthy in-setting and giving them an appropriately journalistic treatment. Would people be okay with this? This is the trickiest option because of the need for active staff on hand (not terribly many, but this isn't a two-person job) and a source of content, but I feel it'd be the most fun and do a lot for worldbuilding stuff.
The second option is that we only actually make a whole issue when some major event happens, be it an Emergency, a big RP or story, some kind of milestone... you get the gist. Like how the first 2013 issue was pretty much all about the Blackout. Content would go on and the assumption would be there that in-setting the Monitor is still putting out issues every month, but what we're seeing under this option are essentially highlights. We'd still need a core of staffers willing to put together content for the issues when we make them, but it's less of a sink than the first option.
Thirdly is the simplest option: we axe the actually-compiling-issues part of Monitor stuff and ramp up a focus on writing stories featuring the Monitor staff, make their presence felt more in RPs and such, etc. I've been planning to write Monitor stories anyway, and of course that stuff's pretty much fair game anyhow, so that part of the option can really combine with either of the other two, but if people feel the MM's just more trouble than it's worth then there's this to fall back on.
It's possible (probable?) I've left some possibilities out or failed to consider others, but these seem the most doable off the top of my head. Still, most of these choices won't work out without the community's involvement, so I thought I'd see what people thought worth pursuing and if anybody's still willing to help out. Look forwards to hearing from all of you. :P -
I can help with Ps (nm) by
on 2014-02-16 06:09:00 UTC
Link to this
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Ps? (nm) by
on 2014-02-16 06:10:00 UTC
Link to this
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Hazarding a guess to say 'photoshop'. (nm) by
on 2014-02-17 08:11:00 UTC
Link to this
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Probably. by
on 2014-02-17 08:13:00 UTC
Link to this
All right, so it's looking like we're leaning towards "publish actual issues only for big events and stuff, leave it assumed issues are coming out the rest of the time too". Do we have anybody up for pitching in on the actual content front? We have a few people up for doing photoshop but articles have to be written, news to be found, etc. as well.
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Well, Time Lord Continuity Council. by
on 2014-02-17 08:22:00 UTC
Link to this
That's newsworthy.
Maybe a feature on PTSD on missions? Because I just wrote a mission where Christianne's backstory comes into play again when she gets triggered by something the Sue does.
Hmm. Maybe some more reviews, a mention or two of the Extremely Lifelike Statues, and... anyone else got newsworthy things? -
That was more put out to the thread as a whole. by
on 2014-02-17 08:24:00 UTC
Link to this
Except for Al's Waiter and yourself we don't really have a lot of people actually stepping up willing and able to help with the actual content, which is why I asked. We can probably fill up an issue with stuff like that though, yeah, and maybe work up a fictional news item or two; it probably wouldn't be laid out too differently from the past few issues we did.
(Speaking of the ELSes, will we be doing those radio things bimonthly like WTNV?) -
(jumps up and down in seat) by
on 2014-02-17 16:14:00 UTC
Link to this
I can help! I could write articles, or advertisements, and I had an idea for "Charlie's Dalek Advice Column" that I think could be pretty funny at least as a one-shot. I mean, I have a lot of things I need to do IRL, but I could definitely help somehow. I wouldn't be able to help with formatting or Photoshopping, though, because I'm no good with that, and technically I still don't have Permission, so I would need to have everythng reviewed by the editors first, but I don't think those are too problematic, especially the former.
Oh, and Herr Wozzeck recruited a character in a District 9 mission and assigned him to the Multiverse Monitor! I could use his identity as a pen name, like the pen names people used on the last two! I'll have to ask Herr Wozzeck if he had any plans for Johnathan. I'd link the mission, but the wiki is acting all wonky for some reason and saying that loops are happening, whatever that means, and I didn't have the link to the mission saved. -
I'm also happy to contribute from time to time. by
on 2014-02-17 21:57:00 UTC
Link to this
Not entirely sure exactly what--I can do gossip and complaints and so on pretty easily, and could probably do some sort of interview or report at times? Whatever's around, really, I suppose.
I'd say I could help with Photoshop as well, but I don't know it extremely well, and it seems like something I'd end up without the time to do. I'm quite happy to write fluffy and not-so-fluffy articles and so on, though. At the very least, I could contribute the text for some ads, I think.
~DF -
Sounds good. by
on 2014-02-19 01:25:00 UTC
Link to this
It sounds like we're going to work on an issue for the Continuity Council thing, so give me your e-mail and I'll cut you in. What I'm probably going to do is send it to everybody who's said they're interested in this thread.
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Oh, sure. by
on 2014-02-19 02:29:00 UTC
Link to this
dawnfire360@gmail.com. It'll also be on the previous MM gdocs.
Mind you, the next week (and probably some time after that as well) is going to be very busy for me. I'm on Reading Week, which basically means a week with no classes wherein students with a lot of work supposedly have time to catch up. So...this is me, trying to catch up with two essays and the same number of oral presentations. Good luck to me, huh?
Heh. Well. Continuity Council issue, here we come!
(Although, speaking of that, it may mean I have a timeline to fiddle around with. Unless the official founding date is a little later in the year, that is...oh well. I'll figure it out. Worst comes to worst, I'll...condense something? Change it so the Council gets a Citrine Theorist a little bit after it's been founded? Hm...things to think about.)
~DF -
When is it supposed to be founded? Thought it was January? by
on 2014-02-19 04:31:00 UTC
Link to this
It's not actually that big a deal, either way. We can label the issue as being for the month the CC was founded - that's part of what makes the option we're going with so flexible.
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I *really* hope not. by
on 2014-02-19 13:30:00 UTC
Link to this
That would completely mess up the Reader's timeline. Well, unless she's a *really* late addition to the Council, which I suppose is also possible...
Hm. Actually, beyond slightly messing with my plans for Kozar and his previous partner (I'd been thinking they'd be partnered for longer), this may work out. But the Reader will probably still be a slightly later addition, unless the Council just took a really long time to get organized, which is already kind of what happened...
Ah well. Enough story plans for one morning--at least, enough thinking aloud about them. Ta for listening.
~DF -
As a semi-regular contributor... by
on 2014-02-14 08:33:00 UTC
Link to this
...with a whopping two contributions to the Monitor in the past, I suggest that we follow the third option and only publish when something big happens. It's just better in terms of Real Life: that way, we only need to contribute stuff on an occasional business. Deadlines are my worst enemy.
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That's option two. Option 3 is no issues. by
on 2014-02-14 08:34:00 UTC
Link to this
Yeah though, I'm noticing a trend of nobody really being able/willing to pitch in except Al's Waiter so as much as I'd like to do 1 or 2 and think it's doable with a couple active people, suddenly not sure how feasible it is. :P
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Derp. by
on 2014-02-14 17:54:00 UTC
Link to this
Right. Option two. Got it.
The thing is, I'm up to my neck in lab reports, so I can't contribute as regularly as I'd like to. Sorry 'bout that. -
MM Design by
on 2014-02-10 18:00:00 UTC
Link to this
I've been trained in design (that's where I had disappeared to after my MSTing days.) And if the output is PDF, I can typeset it like a magazine. I'm well versed in the bulk of Adobe programs (Ps, Ai, Id, Fl, Dw, Acrobat).
I'm not in fandoms much lately but I do love to typeset. (Wow, that sounded so nerdy. lol)
Give me a shout if you want my help. :)
Al's Waiter
(PS, we should have Ch 5 of Fellowship of the Urn out soon enough) -
Well hello there! by
on 2014-02-11 00:04:00 UTC
Link to this
Looks like Lily's already said her piece, and I for one would love to have you aboard! You two can alternate or you can take over if Lily gets too overwhelmed, we can probably hash that out later. If you've got an e-mail I could talk this stuff over with you too.
(With somebody on design stuff, either 1 or 2 are much more feasible if we can get some people actively willing and able to do writing, too. So yay!) - Ze email by on 2014-02-11 04:52:00 UTC Link to this
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Awesome, we'll be in touch. (nm) by
on 2014-02-11 08:22:00 UTC
Link to this
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You and I could alternate in the whole typesetting thing. by
on 2014-02-10 20:44:00 UTC
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I've been outputting it as PDFs, so yeah.
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Oh! Actually, I have a related question for you. by
on 2014-02-10 18:28:00 UTC
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Right about when I joined the Board, back in 2003, I have vague memories of the first incarnation of the Multiverse Monitor (this being the third). It was an out-of-continuity newsletter-type-thing which included, among other things, a Plotbunny Adoption Centre.
In my admittedly-vague memories, I'm inclined to think you were somehow involved. Do you have any idea what I'm talking about, and if so, do you remember any more details?
hS -
Your vague memory serves you right by
on 2014-02-11 04:26:00 UTC
Link to this
I was involved with it. I wrote kinda like editorials in related to writing, fandom related topics, rants and I think I did a Thanksgiving special. It was titled 'Elf Corner'.
I still have the text for those on one of my websites. I had six written:
What's Love Got to Do With It?
Happy Turkey Day
Harry Potter: The Book that Leavened
The Parent Lack
Tinfoil: Not Just for Cooking
The Christmas Commercial
That enough detail for you? -
Fantastic! by
on 2014-02-11 13:09:00 UTC
Link to this
(You may imagine that in a Ninth Doctor voice if you choose)
Thank you very much! After all this time, I was beginning to think I'd invented the whole thing.
For my own reference, the editorials AW is referring to are here. They appear to date the original MM to the end of 2003, based on the following:
-The site implies the editorials were originally written for the MM.
-The MM is said to have 'died after only a few weeks'.
-The second-to-last editorial is clearly dated to Thanksgiving, while the first dates to sometime in the Christmas shopping period. This suggests dates in October-November 2003, because...
-The header suggests that at least one editorial may postdate the MM.
-The front page dates the final editorial to Feb 15, 2004.
-That is significantly outside the 'few weeks' suggested by the other text, and thus appears to be the only post-MM editorial.
If someone wants to update the Wiki page, which I think already briefly mentions this version, that would be brilliant.
hS -
"A few weeks" by
on 2014-02-11 16:25:00 UTC
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As apposed to a year or so, it lasted a few weeks. Six editorials for six issues is not very many, though they may have got a few out before I did the editorials. I don't honestly recall. I also seem to remember the last issue took a lot to get out. *shrug*
I have a vague recollection of doing a few things more than just that for the MM, but I don't remember what. I've started getting old and the internet ten years ago seems so far away. Memory isn't what it used to be.
~AW~ -
Fair enough. by
on 2014-02-11 17:02:00 UTC
Link to this
Although... wait, you've somehow managed to forget what must have been the most important act of your life - one might even say the pinnacle, nay, the culmination of your very existence - the act of taking part in the creation of the glorious[Citation needed] Multiverse Monitor? Inconceivable!
hS -
Ha! by
on 2014-02-11 19:56:00 UTC
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You have no idea how many big projects I've been a part of in different fandoms. Lord of the Rings/Msting/PPC (I group them because they were during the same time) was just the second phase of my internet/fandom life.
I used to be net famous!
I kinda miss that some days.
~AW~ -
Hmmm... by
on 2014-02-10 10:10:00 UTC
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I've loved reading all the MM and personally, I would go for Option 1. But seeing that it needs a rather big amount of effort to compile one issue, I'd say, go for Option 2. Like Lily said below, you could publish an issue of the establishment of the Time Lord Continuity Council. I'd love to read that. :)
~Autumn -
If it helps... by
on 2014-02-10 10:12:00 UTC
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A bit down the thread I broke down how much effort it would probably need to compile issues. In short: not that massive, but I need people who are willing to be actively involved issue after issue or we're dead in the water.
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Oh! by
on 2014-02-11 08:59:00 UTC
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Then I think Option 2 would be better then.
Heh heh, I'd actually love to be involved, but I have no Permission, or time, or patience,(mostly) no hardworking-ness to work on it. :( I'm really very lazy.
Heh.
Heh.
I'm still crossing my fingers on that Time Lord Continuity Council issue though!
~Autumn -
I'd love to help... by
on 2014-02-10 07:33:00 UTC
Link to this
...but I don't think I can. I don't know Photoshop (I can work with GIMP a little, but I'm not a design mage in any way), and I don't think I could write for the MM, seeing as I don't have permission (not that I'm complaining).
I'd still love to help though.
I generally love the idea though. -
I'm not sure if writing articles requires permission. (nm) by
on 2014-02-10 08:36:00 UTC
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If it doesn't... by
on 2014-02-10 23:01:00 UTC
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We should probably have someone designated for those without Permission to run ideas past. It would be sort of similar to how someone without Permission can write a PPC story if they cowrite with someone who does so that the person who does have Permission can catch their mistakes and address or correct problems if necessary. We still need that sort of watch, but it could be altered to fit the Multiverse Monitor's format. One associated editor, separate from your editor-in-chief position, could make sure that the submitted articles make sense, are well-written, fit the Monitor's style, and the like, so that people without Permission wouldn't have to hunt down people who do to cowrite with and the Multiverse Monitor can have a unique solution to the issue more specific to its function.
What no I'm not saying this because I'm planning on writing a few articles in the future and would like to streamline the process what are you talking about. -
I was thinking on doing that, but good idea. by
on 2014-02-10 23:41:00 UTC
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My thought had been I already have experience both as a PPCer and journalist so all that would just come with the territory of me checking everybody's stuff to make sure it's good, but if anyone's interested in stepping up and doing that, they can feel free.
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*extends general support to the ideas* by
on 2014-02-10 04:13:00 UTC
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I haven't Permission, nor am I likely to get it anytime in the near future, so I probably won't be of any use, but I definitely support the rejuvenation of the MM.
-Aila -
We could also . . . by
on 2014-02-10 03:10:00 UTC
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. . . just compile entries from various people over time, and put them together when there are enough. That way the timing isn't so demanding. We could still do dedicated issues for big events.
The drawback is that the span of time between stories might not make sense in a single monthly issue, but I don't think we need to be that strict, anyway. Perhaps these versions are digests that collect articles from past years' MMs, being red by agents in the future? -
What if... by
on 2014-02-09 18:02:00 UTC
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...the MM got huge issues (that is, the regular size) after newsworthy events, or else a set number of times per year, and became more of a newsletter in other months? As in, it could have one or two articles, plus ads and the rumors/complaints/etc sections--or, y'know, it could be something completely different?
...it occurs to me that I'm actually kind of suggesting that the Multiverse Monitor gets some sort of sub-publication, wherein it becomes more of, well, a rumor mill or tabloid...more than it already is, I mean. It could run brief interviews with new agents, report on the rarely-seen weather of HQ, and talk about upcoming (or ancient) attractions in New Caledonia...I don't know. Feel free to either develop or ignore this, I'm not entirely sure of this idea--especially as-is. Mainly, what I'm trying to suggest is that the MM gets both its full-size issues and a smaller, more limited edition...hm.
What do you think? Is there anything to this, or did I just ramble for two paragraphs without coming up with anything useful? (If it's the latter, I won't be offended; it's a half-baked idea, and I know it! Just wanted to get it out there in case there's something helpful in it...)
~DF -
Hm... by
on 2014-02-09 18:05:00 UTC
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I don't like the idea of altering the nature of the in-continuity MM. But a possibility is doing smaller releases out of continuity except for when events merit making the full one - the understanding would be the full issue is still what's being made and read by the PPC agents, but what we see is different. That's pretty much all that seems to be forming though...
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Ooh, yes. by
on 2014-02-09 18:09:00 UTC
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It could even reference the articles we aren't seeing (specifically in the comments sections, although also possibly in interviews or articles)...it could work! And that way, once we've got, say, a limit of four or five pieces (articles, interviews, ads or a series of ads, comments section(s)), it could be published...with the understanding that the 'real' issue contains more.
It could work...
~DF -
Let's see what others think, because I'm still unsure. by
on 2014-02-09 18:11:00 UTC
Link to this
Once we have an idea of what shape this is all taking we can put heads together and figure out what the heck.
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Sounds good. (nm) by
on 2014-02-09 18:12:00 UTC
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You know I'm all for just releasing things after newsworthy by
on 2014-02-09 16:15:00 UTC
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The establishment of the Time Lord Continuity Council, for instance, is newsworthy and I've been meaning to do something about it.
However, given my style for extreme attention to detail I am not certain if I will have the time to do layout, design, and/or writing all the time, so I am also definitely supportive of the third option.
Regularly monthly options seems tiring on my end. College does that to you, and I'm looking at a writing position on my college's satirical news show, so I wouldn't have much time for MM anyway if I get in. -
We could always divide responsibilities a bit. by
on 2014-02-09 16:21:00 UTC
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Which is to say, you don't really need to take over on everything, we can always hash out organisational stuff for a given issue and I can deal with directing writing and such while leaving layout to you or whomever's around for the times you're not available. I might have a harder time with that now I work for my paper again and am trying to get schooling started back up, but as long as we can get some people actually present and not flaking out it's doable.
Totally get where you're coming from though, which is why I've presented the options as we talked about them in the e-mail. :P -
Well, if we do actual issues, by
on 2014-02-09 16:25:00 UTC
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Then I would be in charge of layout and design while you direct the writing. I mean, we might as well play to our strengths since everyone here is a decent writer to some degree.
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Pretty much what I said, yeah. :P by
on 2014-02-09 16:27:00 UTC
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My point being like you could take mostly a backseat until that point and I can direct people for actually putting together stories, if it'd work better for you that way. And if all else fails, we can release issues as gdocs until you're available to do design, then update with the laid-out version.
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If we time it right, by
on 2014-02-09 16:30:00 UTC
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We might be able to make this sync with the production cycle of the Wellesley College TV show thing that I'm applying to. Provided, of course, that I do get in.
They put out an episode every two weeks, and the first week is more writer intensive than the second, so... -
Interesting! by
on 2014-02-09 16:31:00 UTC
Link to this
Let's see how much support this gets from other Boarders, but I'd be interested in hashing that out once there's more an idea of which way the wind is blowing.
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Hm... by
on 2014-02-09 15:51:00 UTC
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What if we made it a bi-monthly thing instead of a monthly thing? It would be a lot of work to make it happen on a monthly basis, and I think if we spaced it across two months that would be easier on everyone. But I don't know. If push comes to shove, the third option doesn't sound too bad, and it could actually help to flesh out the PPC's universe a bit.
Either way, I would love the Monitor to return, so whatever it takes to bring it back would be awesome! -
All three would flesh out the universe. :P by
on 2014-02-09 16:01:00 UTC
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In theory, doing it as a monthly thing isn't that much extra work. We need people on hand and need to figure out a) what to do about content and b) some kind of organised plan to tackle the issue, but my school's paper puts together issues with a similar amount of content every week, and some of the more active people can take on multiple things (I'll probably be doing so). Bi-monthly is /doable/, but my worry is at that point it gets a bit too easy to lose track or forget about - monthly seems to hit that sweet zone of not so often there's no time to get content but not so rarely people drift off.
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True that. by
on 2014-02-09 16:31:00 UTC
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Yeah, that's a good point. I just worry that the opposite would be true--that a month becomes too much work for everyone--but I guess that's also true that it would be easier to forget stuff.
No matter what, I'll go with whatever you guys go with, but I'd like to see a semi-regular Monitor again. -
Looking at the layout of the two issues that got made... by
on 2014-02-09 16:54:00 UTC
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What it comes out to is a bunch of briefing sections (news, sports, gossip, feedback, want ads, etc.), a few ads to send in, Canon of the Month, Location of the Month, and one to three cover stories, plus the review I added as of the second issue. The briefs are stuff anybody can add to easily, which just leaves a few people who need to be around to cover the features and cover stories plus any editorials, which aren't typically all that lengthy anyway. That means, except for the layout and design, we don't actually have that intensive a schedule or demand on/for staff - we need writers who are going to stick around, who'll get their stuff done, and who won't get burnt out doing it month after month (keep in mind a 500-word article can be churned out over the course of a day pretty easily if you can make some time). I bet a sufficiently dedicated team of maybe five could do it. I suspect we'd still have to have a lot of "fictional" stories, but hey, they'd be just as real as the meta stuff in-universe so who gives a hoot.