Aug 2011 Archive, part b

FTR, I edited the bio for Agent Ally and really hope that it's now better.

Agent Alison has no respect for authority, has a short temper, she is homicidal and amoral and, as such, has no problem killing and maiming, and lives by the motto "life is short, so why the **** not." So, my question is this: what is stopping her from maiming/killing anyone in the PPC? Especially the Flowers, who are disliked by many of the Agents.

And so, I am concerned that, perhaps, she is a bomb waiting to go off...and I don't think we will be waiting long.

I too made a Stu (Who didn't in his past?), yet I managet to create a good character out of it with some work. It's Agent Sergio Turbo, if you want to check him out.

The old Sergio (character) was a detective and amazingly good rally car driver at freaking TEN years old, had nearly perfect aim, could use ant weapon and drive any vehicle, et cetera.

The current Agent is, well, a PPC Agent of an actually reasonable age (18 at the beginning of the spinoff), has a reasdonable aim (still on the good side, but nothing spectacular), and the only exception to "normal" skills is the "fighter pilot" thing, a little bit needed as one of my "patrol" continua is Ace Combat.

So, with a little work, Mimkana can reform and even become an Agent. You already did the most difficul thing, recognizing her as a Sue. The rest will be a piece of cake.

Welcome to the board! Have a sentient and possibly homicidal computer. They're great at parties.

First off: Welcome to the PPC, have a seat and enjoy the insanity.

Second on: I have, in the privacy of my head, created a few Mary Sue type characters. I would be surprised to discover a person with an active imagination who has never imagined a more perfect and popular version of themself.

There is nothing wrong with characters who Kick Ass, even ones who do so in multiple continuums. These characters, while they likely have at least a few traits in common with Mary Sues, are not neccesarily Mary Sues. It is possible for a good writer to create a character who scores highly on Mary Sue tests that is not, in fact, a Mary Sue.

This may help you feel better: http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20051212 At the very least I hope you will find it amusing. (I know I do.)

I've written/imagined at least half a dozen poorly characterized OCs and two author inserts, even after joining the PPC and constantly being told, "MARY SUE = BAD" twice a week.

I just don't publish them. They still feel like friends. And I still feel guilty.

And I still may try to publish one of them (improved, of course).


So even though I'm the least expert Boarder here, I'm going to say that if you love your character and you're willing to go through the painful "whipping into shape with very critical beta" bits, you could still write about her.

Welcome to the Board! Here, have some chocolate, won't you?

And don't worry about the Mary Sue thing, I myself might have created some... questionable characters. But I was young! Inexperienced!

Hence why I'm working on improving my writing skills... if partially to make myself feel better...

Welcome, new friend! Have a keychain!

Well met, rookie! Please enjoy this comforting goose down blanket as a welcoming present.

We love having new people!

As for the whole Mary Sue-ish aspect... there's actually quite a divide in the PPC about what constitutes a well-written Sue. Some of us here do in fact believe that it is entirely possible to write a Mary Sue character who is actually pretty interesting to read about to other people (though some would argue that she stops really being a Sue once you get there). I know one person who once wrote a character with a ton of God-mod Sue powers that she acquired over the course of a fic, but the powers allowed for a very nuanced characterization, and that was for the better.

I guess the optimist in me says that you could probably keep some of the powers, but make her characterization/reaction to said powers interesting. And when all else fails, hey, Sues stop being Sues when their flaws are explored a little further.

Anyhow... Here, have some Shostakovich for the road:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2W8kGdCwmA&playnext=1&list=PL30ADF3BB551A1AF3

And yeah, I think most of us have been there. There's no reason to be ashamed about it. {= ) There's absolutely nothing wrong with a kickass female character who goes on adventures, even with canon characters, provided she doesn't break said characters or the world while she's doing it. As galenfea says, how people react to the character and how easily she attains her goals is a big part of what makes a Sue, far more than what abilities she has.

As for me, I put my old avatar through character boot camp by putting her in the PPC—specifically FicPsych, where she's part of a team and has bosses, and is not allowed to be the center of attention and get her way all the time, and even the good things aren't perfect. Plus, she can only "fix" the canon characters to be as they are in canon; no redeeming the antiheroes on the side. It's done a world of good, I think. ^_^

~Neshomeh

First of all, welcome!

Secondly, I feel your pain. I also created a character who was a much awesomer version of myself when I was younger, and she went on adventures with all my favourite fictional characters. She was the daughter of a fighter pilot (Biggles, if anyone's familiar with the series) and he often took her along on his missions, where she made herself useful as a radio/radar operator, navigator and occasional medic. She was eleven (my age at the time). In years since then of actively hunting out Sues, I have never seen a worse example.

I still write that character. She's still named after me, still speaks numerous languages fluently, still kicks ass and is still a trained pilot and the daughter of a WW2 fighter pilot, so she's still Suish (she regularly scores as a bad Sue in litmus tests). However, I feel that she's made less of a Sue within her context because of the way others react to her. For example, I recently wrote her in a story where she screwed up and miscalculated several situations, got in trouble for her mistakes and attitude and just didn't have everything go her way. Others may disagree, but I think that makes her less of a Sue.

So I'd say that it's certainly fine that you once created a Sue (I'm pretty confident that most people here can say the same) and it's also OK that you won't drop her (I absolutely understand emotional connection to an old character) and that she may not be as Suish as she seems on paper depending on how you write her :)

I'm usually quicker on the uptake. As an apology for my tardiness, I give you a gallon jug of Glistening Oil (your life's not compleat without it!)

Have some Bleeprin, and don't forget to drop your sanity in the bin by the door!

Hello and welcome, dear newcomer! Have this conical hat (made from tin foil and duct tape) and a tea biscuit (it's got cheese in it)!

Hi, have some fudge!

Welcome to the Board! Here, have some chocolate, and enjoy your stay!

Welcome to the boards. :)

Have a glow-in-the-dark hamster! If the sound of his exercise wheel keeps you up all night, you can entertain yourself until you fall asleep by staring at his fur, which is completely non-toxic to both you and the little guy.

Welcome to the PPC! Have a complimentary sentient, and possibly homicidal, A.I.. They're great at parties.

What are some of your fandoms? It's customary to list your active fandoms in your introductory post, but you don't have to if you don't want to. ^_^

Here's an antique pocketwatch.

Welcome, welcome, welcome!

One thing: We don't really bash authors. We bash fics. Authors are people too, you know.

Have a Holy Hand Grenade! (Warning: Do not use near rabbits or lagomorphs of any kind)

You had me worried, popping in on the wiki with nary an introduction.

Well, nice to meet you. As others have probably said, it's not the authors that we find objectionable but their work... many of us too wrote badfic when we were younger, and grew out of it.

The Badness is merely a passing state: a transient phenomenon of immediate ego, inexperience, or laziness. Or all three. Often the ulterior motives badfic authors have are not ill will, but merely obliviousness to their own unfortunate subtexts and trampling of canon.

Of course, if a badfic writer goes on to prove themselves to be a thoroughly unpleasant person, like anybody we'll all probably groan with disdain and move on with our lives.

But nice to meet you!

Have a hat. It is knit of the finest of pelts harvested from Cute Animal Friends. It is guaranteed to keep your ears nice and insulated in the darkest, most soul-shatteringly cold of badfic.

We don't really mistreat authors, but yeah, we find craziness to be appealing. So we make fun of it.

Here, have some Borodin for the road:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FsTVF0Fu5_c

Greetings, new friend. I'm glad our community is interesting to you, and I hope you'll be sticking around for a while.

One thing I would like to bring up about our Wiki: it would be best if the number of links to TV Tropes was limited to very few. There isn't anything wrong with TVT, but we are not that site. We would prefer that our Wiki stand on its own merits as much as possible.

Also, I see you've made another post just above this one. New posts push old ones off the Board into oblivion, so it would have been better to add it onto this thread instead. In the future, just keep in mind that we want to avoid double-posting, please.

Nice to meet you.

I have one problem with your post: We don't treat authors (and they are authors, not "authors") badly, no matter how poor their writing is. We also do not find treating real people badly to be funny.

Just for future reference.

I'm looking for recs for a fairly specific Harry Potter subgenre. Namely, the "Snape is reincarnated, gets another chance at life" AU subgenre. JulyFlame linked me to one excellent one, which pointed in the direction of another, and now I'm sort of wondering if anyone else knows decent ones. For reference, the first one is The Moment It Began, the one I found on my own; decent, but not Awesome, capital A. The one July linked me to was The Apprentice, which is Awesome, capital A-- but also incomplete, at the moment. I suppose I could go search for an LJ comm, or a forum on the Pit, but as that's usually more miss than hit, I was hoping you guys might have a closer idea.

Though I have not, unfortunately, become acquainted with any of Taranea's fandoms, I have found a very amusing angst parody for NCIS fans.

http://www.fanfiction.net/s/6787526/1/

It is called "How You Know I Did Not Write This"

Sample quote:

Tim got ready for bed and his final thought as he lay his head down on his pillow was this:

I'm so glad that I've never been depressed, tried to commit suicide, been accused of murder, been chased by assassins, been kidnapped, tortured, maimed, shot, been nearly killed in a car accident (well, besides the one when I was sixteen), concealed evidence that led to my near mental breakdown, had a real mental breakdown, been coerced into committing crimes, been attacked by anyone, been used in a sordid lovers' quarrel or seen ghosts.

With that final thought, he smiled and went to sleep.

I didn't want to add another thread, so I just stuck it to this one.

Drew and Lucius are awesome together-- you do the "We're friends!" "...with benefits?" "I'm hugging you not punching you, don't push it" banter very well!

Also, the more intermissions you post, the more heartbreaking your introduction is, in retrospect. Seriously. Drew: all the hugs.

So Drew gets antsy at the thought of getting laid, hm? Crazy times are had with that, though I do wonder what would happen if he ran into one of my agents and started... you know... ;) I'm sure crazy times would ensue for all.

Anyway, you're packing a lot of character into Drew, and I definitely suspect there was more that went on between him and Tom than he's letting on right now... ;) Here's hoping that he won't fully... you know.

You've certainly put one hell of a constraint on Agent Drew! I'm looking forward to seeing how this affects his performance on missions and his relationship with Lucius, and whether there's any way to stop or undo the process.

Sorry, I derped up the formatting. It's fixed now.

Your questions are actually a good example of why there is a waiting period between joining the board and asking for permission to write missions. During that time you can read missions others have written. Be sure to also check out some of the badfic the appears in these missions (PPCers that post on LJ often provide links to the badfic). Then you can see what bits of fic are quoted in the missions, which are paraphrased and which bits are left out to make everyone's lives a lot simpler.

The real answer to quetion no 2 is: if you don't know which bits of the badfic to quote, you are not ready yet to write missions.

May I ask how long you've been on the Board? I don't recall seeing you around here much, if any.

Poor, poor Cadmar. He's rapidly becoming my favorite Butt Monkey. Plus, I'm a sucker for gender-bending stories. As for thoughts/predictions: I wonder how Luxury is going to react ;)

Good mission, but poor Cadmar! I really wanna give him... her... whatever... a hug after this fic, I felt so bad for... her (Damn pronouns...)

She (?) certainly is the group's "Butt Monkey" isn't she?

(Yes, I spend a lot of time on TVTropes, what of it?)

I really enjoyed the vacation part, sort of a "Europe Trip" PPC style...

...after all that, Florestan will have to make an appearance in your next interlude. You know, provide some holding material for Maria... Unfortunately I won't be available to do a dual writing session until the 21st. Aside from the fact I'm still traipsing around Siena at the moment (and let's not also forget that the Palio is happening in two days, which is when things will get absolutely insane there), the hotel's internet is really not very good, so we can't co-work on a googledoc with any reliability. So unfortunately, we'll have to wait a bit. Though, I could potentially e-mail you a couple lines to get us started with that. That shouldn't be too tough, I think.

Extremely entertaining mission. Especially the whole trip around Europe part that rounded out the mission.

And wow, some of the things that Sue did... Just wow. I can see why you were all so pissed off about that. Yeah, crazy times are had.

Hm... In the recruitable OC's bit... I've been formulating starting another response center with another group of peeps to cover some of the stuff F&E can't cover but that I really want to cover really badly. So yeah... I think I'll take Cindy if she's not taken by anyone else.

Extremely intertaining mission. :D

I started reading this mission at 12:30, and I just finished it at 5:30. But it was worth it! This is the best mission I've read in a long while. I love the way you made use of Kreacher, that you showed the surviving Dragons to be just as victimized by the bad writing as Cadmar and the canons, and that you put the agents in a nasty situation and made them deal with it. The vacation section was awesome; I love it when agents get to experience the world a bit, even if the parts they explored this time weren't Potterverse-specific.

I have to admit, I got pretty mad at the Sunflower Official while he was chewing everyone out at the end. I know he was justified in doing so, and he definitely made some good points about equipment upkeep and leaving Kreacher un-neuralyzed (not that that was intentional), but I still couldn't help but feel bad for Cadmar, especially knowing he's going to be missing a part of his identity for an unknown length of time. I think Miah was right to call him out a bit at the end.

I'm rambling...Anyway, I just wanted to say that this was a great, funny mission, and I'm glad I read it, even if it swallowed up my whole afternoon!

I loved the mission. Long, but totally worth reading. Your agents' vacation had me laughing out loud. Warning to future readers: Swallow your Mountain Dew before you read. You'll thank me.

So I'm thinking about another grammar issue, specifically Cadmar's gender-bending and how you switched pronouns for him/her afterward. I'm not sure about the proper pronouns for situations like that. Do you go by physical gender, mental gender, or what? Do you just use those awkward third-gender pronouns? You can't use "it"; that just sounds like they're not a person anymore. Sure, gender-bending isn't real-life, but there have to be grammatical conventions for this somewhere.

More awesomeness from you guys! Whee!

Merely reading the summary makes me want to throw up. That kind of story is just disgusting.

This reminds me of the Faramir/Shagrat love story that's sitting in Unclaimed Badfic right now, just because of the degree to which it makes me want to simultaneously laugh, vomit, and sob hysterically.

.........I... what... gurk... That's it. Who wrote that drivel? I wanna blow their computer up.

Okay, first thought: Wait, we're alowed to post links to bad fic?
Second thought:ummmmm okay...
Third thought:O.O
Fourth thought:WHAT THE F---!!!
Fifth thought: If Harry is 16 doesn't that mean he's out of age?

...if anyone wants to spork it, we have to register with this site so we can see the fic. So unfortunately, yeah.

But what you just described I think gives us MORE than a good idea of what we need to expect. I mean, Jesus Christ on a pikestaff, what in the world is all that? That's just...

Excuse me while I go hunt down some Bleeprin...

One good way to tell if the OC's a Mary Sue is to ask what would happen if you took her (or him) out of the story, and if there's a place for her (or him) in the world. Some OCs are like NPCs in a video game: they're the barrista at the coffee shop, and you could replace them with pretty much anyone without it making a difference. Others have to be who they are, but they still fit into the world-- like the murder victim's beloved sister who's secretly the culprit. Tony DiNozzo flirting with the barrista for half a scene doesn't make her a Sue; DiNozzo falling in love with the sister during the case, forgetting all about his other friends, and neglecting his job for her because they're Just That Perfect for each other probably does. (Actually, even that could make for good fic, if you made it about her psychological manipulation of him and made it clear that this was NOT a healthy relationship. But I digress.)

Personally, I think a lot of the fun of shipping canon characters is watching the author try to justify why these two, of all people, are together. Some use their interactions in canon to help that along, others don't.

1) Extremely Out Of Character characters
-this adresses your 'non-canon couple' question: if they can still act in character and get together, yeah. If one of them suddenly acts like he's blind/deaf/really stupid and/or one of them does things that they would never do in the real series, then it's OOC

2) Lack of SPaG: Spelling, Punctuation, and Grammar
-This just makes things hard to read. Plus, it makes us think that the author didn't work hard on their fic, or they don't care about their readers, or they expect us to do the work for them by filling it all in ourselves.

On the subject of OCs.

It is extremely difficult to get a good OC. A Mary Sue is a Mary Sue for several reasons.

#1: how other characters react to her. If the characters ALL love her no matter WHAT she does, and they're all fighting over who gets to escort her to the dance, etc., you can guess it's a Mary Sue.

#2: How does her presence affect the other characters? If she outdoes everyone in their own areas of expertise, always get the right side in an argument, etc. that's a Mary Sue.

#3: Is she perfect in every way? Does she have no flaws? Is she Superman without Kryptonite? She's a Sue.

#4: Is her general story well-written? If an author has no plot and tends to ramble on about what color the trim of her clothes is, you guessed it- it's a Sue.

Look for ways that a fic differs from canon. For instance, if a fic has Legolas as a weepy wimp who can barely raise a bow, let alone actually kill an orc with it, then that's a definite clue that it's a badfic.

If characters are being bashed or random canon events are taken out of context and used to justify the author's view of the character as evil/bad/a slut/etc., then that's another clue.

Shipping two characters who could be a couple doesn't make it a badfic, but there should be reasons for it. If an author has a couple who hate each other in canon and in the fic they're completely devoted to each other with no explanation as to how they resolved their differences, then it's probably a badfic.

The plot needs to make sense and it shouldn't be implausible at any stage. If a character is warped OOC so the plot can proceed, then yes, it's most probably a badfic. Another example is that there's a few fics in the Redwall fandom where a self-insert is dropped into Mossflower to help save Redwall from some imminent crisis, but given that Redwall is a sound, very strong building full of beasts who are trained, skilled warriors, there usually isn't a good reason as to why they'd need an unskilled kid from another world.

Also, if skills are being pulled out of a hat so that the plot can proceed or the characters can be even more awesome, then it's most likely a badfic. Any mention of a character 'just knowing' how to do something makes the fic implausible.

Hope that helps.

One telltale symptom of a bad story in general is if it makes excuses for events happening rather than having events in logical order or displayed as following cause/effect.

Most badfic has a superficial goal, like shipping a pairing or showing a character is AWESOME. They'll make excuses to get to this goal, or ignore basic facts and logic to attain it...

Excuse: "She murdered all of the people who DARED touch her man! It was OK and she didn't get arrested because those girls were evil."

Excuse: "Aragorn only acts the way he does around her because she's SO PRETTY!"

Excuse: "She's faster than Sonic the Hedgehog because she's half hedgehog, half cheetah."

etc. All of these things are excuses that commonly happen in bad fanfic...

A shipping pairing COULD be bad, if it makes shallow excuses for why they're together,("Sora and Riku are a couple because eating a paoupu fruit makes you GAY! And because I say so!") but another story with the same couple can be plausible and well-done if the two characters have real reasons to be together ("Sora and Riku have been through so much together, and after everything is over they discover their bond is deeper than they thought, etc.") that make sense and further them as characters.

Rather than excuses for mush, fluff, or fan-wank.

For the record, just because the pairing isn't plausible doesn't mean it's bad. See crackfic. Part of the appeal there is that it's intentionally so insane you can't help but laugh.

Well, first off, there are many definitions of "bad" fanfic. When choosing a fanfic to do a mission on, I ask myself some of the following questions: Is the plot believable? Do the characters act like they do in the source material? Are there any moments that make me go "Wait, what?"? These, among others, help me in determining whether or not it's mission-worthy.

As for an OC, no, just because there's an OC in the story does not make that character a Mary Sue. It's how the writer handles that character that defines whether or not it's a Sue/Stu. Again, some questions to ask: Does this character make sense within the universe of the story? If it's a setting where there are any kind of powers and/or abilities available, and that character has power/abilities, do those powers make sense for that character to have? Do they overshadow powers possessed by canon characters? Do they upstage canon characters constantly?

And pairings, well, I suppose that's a little more subjective. For example, if the canon source material plays with the fact that a certain pair could be romantically linked-- like say, Catherine and Warrick from CSI --then it's plausible that the pairing could take place. It doesn't make it a badfic.

So, I guess what I'm saying here is this: if it's plausible within the realm and rules of the canon material's universe, and doesn't throw anyone out of character, then no, it isn't a badfic. If if does, however, then you've got some problems. Does that help?

What was the assignment? Is your teacher doing a course on Sue recognition and reform?

Ok, first, formatting. Please, for the love of Yawgmoth, at least indent your paragraphs.

On a scale of 1-10, I'd give her 6.5. Yes, it's bad, and you've got the overbaked description down pat (though, frankly, I think you're tipping your hand with overuse. "Firey crimson" is bad enough for most sues, but "firey crimson blood red" reads like a parody) but Sues often have more than just cascades of adjectives. She doesn't have any titles, skills, or accomplishments, or even any powers beyond self-cleaning feet, mood-ring eyes, and teenage boy metabolism. If you're going for 24-karat Sue, she needs to at least have a power level over 9000 and be able to take Voldemort in a stand-up fight.

“Damnit, I was hoping we'd have porn.”
“A person tied to a chair makes you think of porn?” Zug said.
“Linoleum makes me think of porn.”

Oh, I like Kirill. This was a great mission, really good.

This was a fun read! Good work keeping track of all the various timey-wimey details. I like that you go out of your way to point out what's good about the story—something I think we should all get in the habit of doing more often.

I'm glad you could make a mission out of this, ti was funny. Your agents are hilarious too. Such a silly, silly fic. I can;t really say what my favorite part is, there was a lot of funny moments.

Oh, and I found a couple words repeated ' Two hours later, on Dathomir, the witches of the Singing Mountain clan were tending to tending to their wounded sister. '

Can't wait for more!

Oh, God. You're quickly turning into one of my favorite writers with the PPC right now. It's just... That was too funny. Again, Kiril and Zug play off each other extremely well, and it was just a hilarious mission.

I did get kinda confused with the whole time travel aspect, though. That probably could've been explained a bit better.

But still, fun times are had. And ooh, the Marquis de Sod gets involved. I wonder how THAT'S going to end... ;)

We do not make passive-aggressive attacks against sue authors. Period. But we especially do not do it in a public place like TV Tropes. I am in the process of reverting the edits with said insults, but they shouldn't have been there in the first place.

Also, if you do go and do something like that? Don't then put a link to the wiki on the TV Tropes page. That's just inviting trolls and flames.

The way I see it, the Wiki we have is not so much a encyclopedic wiki as our hub and record for what's been in PPC canon, and what has not... and most of the various canons the PPC has been to, and the various fanfic trends that have been noticed in each. It's supposed to be a resource and a collection of all things PPC.

And following the PPC spirit, if something isn't FUNNY or USEFUL/MEANINGFUL/PRACTICAL (Caps lock for emphasis, not shouting), it probably shouldn't appear in too high a dose there.

When I link things on a page, I link things that I think are meaningful to that page, or things that may have a second meaning that DOES have a page on the wiki. Some of these links might be for fun, but they all are links that a person can use to find out more information about a PPC concept... or can follow to see the punchline of a PPC-spirited joke.

As for editing specific agent pages, the last time I did that, Nesh and I were on an official Wiki-cleanup and archival run, one to put all PPC characters in an index and link their appearances for easy access to more minor characters... or to find out which characters had been made preemptively and never got appearances at all. And even then, the content of the pages was not heavily edited. The way I see it, fixing an obvious spelling error (no ypurs on our wiki, for example) is fine, but linking all of these things the writers of the article didn't intend... what purpose does it serve? Is it funny or useful? As in, substantially more useful Not... really.

Our wiki is not wikipedia or TvTropes. It is an archive of the PPC, and like all PPC materials should follow the spirit of the PPC: one of practicality and light-heartedness. Edits that don't really serve either purpose may just be excessive.

The best solution to an error on an agent page, I think, is to alert the writer of it and chat about it... but that's not really going to work very well because less people add and work on the wiki than have pages there. Too bad. I kind of secretly wish more people would write for the wiki and make cool articles that would add to the good thoughts there.

1/ What about users who don't edit the Wiki, or aren't even with the PPC any more? How are people to know that they're allowed to edit the page for, say, Ella Darcy, but not for Laburnum? I don't update any of my agents any more (because I'm lazy), so why shouldn't someone else do it if they want to? Not to mention the fear that's creeping into people over this sort of rule - I had someone say that I needed to link Lofty Skies from the Wiki. Really? Why do I need to? It's a wiki - the whole point is that anyone can edit it.

2/ 'check that there is, in fact, a non-stub article for the Anduin'. Stubs won't get expanded if no-one links to them. And sometimes a redlink is important - it says 'I know this needs a page, but I don't know enough to do it myself. Someone please fill in the gap!'. Again, it's a wiki - it's about everyone editing and expanding it.

3/ Did I see someone below claiming that a user was blocked from editing for this? Because that's ridiculous. No, every instance of Sunflower Official doesn't need to be linked - but it doesn't actually do any harm. We don't have a budget for blue links (do we?).

In conclusion, I think this is one heck of an overreaction, and I have no idea why people think it's necessary.

hS

I have to admit I got quite cross a while back when someone started altering my Agents' pages without asking, and I know I'm not the only one. And I got called out for redlinking myself way back.

These seem like a decent set of rules to me.

This is completely irrelevant, but I'd just like to say that I really, really want the phrase 'existentialists with staple guns' to become either the name of a band or the name of some kind of crime-fighting team.

Sorry. I'll just go now.

So, I was trying to clean up the Dementor page, when I noticed that I've been blocked from editing... what's this about? I don't really see where I've crossed the line, so to speak...

Well, have you checked the Torchwood lemma on the wiki? There are links there to Torchwood missions. I've just updated the links (Though the second half still leads nowhere).

Stories you may want to check out are:
- Oh god & strawberry lovin'
- Baby Moon's Gift

This hasn't gotten any feedback, so I'll repeat my request for a mission Beta (in advance) and just fill out the rest of my story idea, specifically the investigators.

The Investigators in this story take... three forms, roughly. The first are the old, 1920-1960 breed that went in, shot cultists, took names and stopped the destruction of the world.

The second are the modern breed with Federal connections. With Delta Green itself (in my iteration, fic and possible RPG-wise), there are the official "Vowel Cells", who have plenty of backup to deal with Mythos activity. A and E cells are for kill-ops, where quick, decisive use of assets is important to safeguard humanity. I and O cells are for more delicate ops where the entities and cults are relatively benign or low powered, and the aim is to contain Mythos activity to a controllable area while leaving most of the human initiares alive and free to worship benignly. U and Y cells are the most delicate, where the aim is to actively seek Mythos assistance against much worse abominations (This group has a turnover rate typical of dealing with beings that create a psionic undercurrent as a matter of course). And then there's Majestic-12, which is pretty much like the Men in Black... only creepier, with a Brain-in-a-jar ambassadorial program, Shoggoth defense systems and Yithian outreach and library system.

And then there are the more typical cells in Delta Green, including civilian friendlies. Ten are connected to the Vowels, who use them as assets with plausible deniability. The others, however, do not follow official procedure or have sanction. These are the Lost 10; Some of them are merely considered fools and cowboys, who use just a little too much gunplay and assassination of witnesses in their mission to protect but are otherwise effective. Others, though... the Vowels think that some of these cells are one psychotic break from declaring Exterminatus on the entire planet, killing us all so the mythos doesn't get us first. Mostly the result of Battle fatigue and excessive SAN loss, there have been battles against some of these cells and the feds... sometimes with high body-counts. Executive opinion is that they are bordering on cultdom themselves and are extremely dangerous. One of these cells will be the antagonists in the first part of the story.

Basically, the mythos is inscrutable in it's motives... but sometimes, inscrutable can just as easily mean "Why is it helping us?" as "Why is it hurting us?".

Well, I've rambled again, and I seem to be the king of the empty thread. So here it ends with another quest for feedback and critcism on this little chunk of Mythos fanfic. What does everybody think

Welcome to the PPC! I hope you'll excuse the late welcome (if you even see it), and that you'll enjoy your time here. :D

Here, take some goat milk for the road. *Throws bottles of goat milk at you*

Hello and welcome!

Have a Holy Hand Grenade (Not to be used near rabbits or lagomorphs of any kind)

Hi! Here is an used javelin, used throwing knife, and used throwing ax!

Welcome, delicious friend! Have a Faraday cage to put your sanity in.

Well met, rookie! Please enjoy this oversized novelty thermometer as a welcoming present.

Hi, have some fudge!

It explodes on Saturdays, so eat it quick! :D

Welcome, new friend! Have an unwritten poem!

Welcome to the Board! Here, have some chocolate, and enjoy your stay!

Have some Bleepka, and your two cents.

Have some Glistening Oil. We're happy to have you as part of the Great Work.

Have this cookie. It's made of awesome.

So are you really THE Emily? Because we've had a lot of impostor Emilys around here.

Come hang out in the IRC if you want, we don't bite. Hard.

Also, have an untoaster! It's like a regular toaster, except it turns toast back into bread. There was an accident involving a time machine.

It was a smart move he made, insuring his nuts. Because I'm sure some artist somewhere is dragging out their sttel-tipped boots.

I'm a regular on deviantART. I noticed a few news articles about it this morning while I was checking my messages.

I wonder if he really thinks he can hide now that he has so much attention?

I don't understand the story in the slightest...

I didn't read the whole thing. However, aside from the blatant plagiarism, I noticed that the Suethor was using periods where there should have been commas.

Putting aside all of the other bad signs, it's a bad sign when the author forgets what they named their...magical superswords?

Perhaps this person has been reading too much Legend of Drizzt (Gwengwyvar = Guenhwyvar?). Or maybe they're just silly.

DEFILEMENT! Suffer not the plageriser to live!

Ahem, I mean, WTH was the author thinking?! Plagerising an existing work? Tolkien (God rest him) and C.S Lewis (God rest him)are rolling in their graves! At least, if he or she is quoting or paraphrasing existing works, couldn't the author reference what they were quoting and try to avoid plagerism?

Someone kill this .... before I break out an Exterminatus order on this ... DEFILEMENT!

what is this i don't even...

...sorry, I think my brain just fused a bit there.

I want to see this die. Please, whoever writes the mission, MAKE A VERY LOUD ANNOUNCEMENT WHEN YOU'RE DONE. Because this - needs - to - DIE.

I completely agree. This needs to be sporked.
*inserts more words of loathing here*

This is a level of fail I haven't encountered in some time. I'd spork the hell out of it if I had Permission, but since I don't, I'll just think up some nice canonical ways to kill Narnia Sues.

Mini in the first sentence- Professor Kirk Volunteer.

I'd love to sink my teeth into this one, but at 22K words, I can't swing this alone. Anyone interested in a team-up?

I... I don't even... What the hell was that?! O.e Dear God, maybe it's a good thing that prologue was deleted. Ugh! I'm kind of scared to click the link. I don't want to be scarred too badly. *shudder*

Borrowing elements from another fic doesn't stop it from being a fic of the original work. I think you should remove the goodfic from the equation.

So, it's a badfic of the canon rather than a badfic of a goodfic of a canon.

Well, I think for something like that, it could really be quite subjective and differ from fic to fic. If the goodfic doesn't differ too far from original canon, then you could easily use the real book as the official canon. If the goodfic is sufficiently different from the original (such as having OCs, following the life of a minor character, or being AU itself), then it might be better to use a combination of the goodfic and the original work as canon. It seems like it would be up to the person sporking the fic. I know that some people would say to only use the original work as canon, but I think if a story has earned the title of "goodfic," then the work that was put into it deserves to be protected, especially if another fan decides to muck about with it and completely destroy it. Again, though, it should really be up to the person's discretion.

Has anyone ever sporked a fic like that anyway?

The PPC seems to define a canon as an original published work. I think that a badfic of a goodfic would still be tied to the original canon, although I suppose it would be an alternate version of that canon, like a bookverse versus a movieverse.

However, that's a rather controversial point.

For example, what if someone writes a badfic about another badfic? Are we supposed to spork it as-it-is, or should we pass on the charges already present in the "canon"?

This is a game that happens here on this message board from time to time. You have to participate in the thread when it appears, and then the person who runs the game then adds to the wiki archive-- as a record of the fun taking place HERE on the board.

Participate in the community, and people will play with you.

The wiki is not the hub of our existence. It's merely the index and archive of it.

You're not supposed to edit new entries into the list from the Wiki. It says so on the Things I Am Not Allowed To Do At The PPC main Wiki page (http://ppc.wikia.com/wiki/Things_I_am_not_Allowed_to_Do_at_the_PPC).

It works like this:someone (usually Tawaki) will create a thread here on the boards entitled TIANATDATP Part Whatever Number We're Up To At The Moment. Various boarders will then chip in their various silly entries. After a while, the entries are collected and posted onto the Wiki as a single page. I hope that makes sense.

Worst ...ing thing I have ever seen.

Tell me it is a troll.

I read the first chapter and it was like a better-spelt version of Forbiden Fruit. *headdesk*

Seriously, this is my face right now:

...I can't say I've read the books, but color me intrigued...

Hobb is from a series of books called The Deptford Mice; it's about anthropomorphic rodents, sort of like a very dark Redwall. Hobbers are a group of creatures that worship three evil rat gods, the Raith Sidhe, and Hobb is the worst one. I've never actually read the series myself, so I'm not sure if they show up in The Deptford Mice or the prequel series, the Deptford Histories, or both, but there you are. So, Burnsey and Fox gave the Sue to a bloodthirsty and fuzzy cult.

I couldn't bear to read this at first. Such a high concentration of stupid... But I eventually did. Mr. Nakumura didn't have much income, yet he could pay for Amy's schooling and tae kwon do and gymnastics lessons?!? What. I can't read any more of this. I can only hope that this wench stays true to her promise to not actually alter the plot. But knowing how Mary-Sues work, I have to doubt it.

My face hit my palm at the first "HEYYYYY" and it got worse from there. This is almost physically painful.

I remember vividly one of my first attempts at fanfiction. It involved a poorly written character that was like a clone or sister of Kaiba.

It was bad.

But this thing takes that idea and turns it into a grotesque parade of mockery and carnage. Not even 12 year old me was this bad.

Why would this happen? :
Somebody make it go away please. :

What what whaaaat?

No, seriously. No just no. This can't be. Also, has this person ever had a look at the KaibaCorp building? Tae Kwon Do (whyever that guy taught her anyways) and gymnastics don't prepare you for climbing up there! It's so... argh.

I don't have Permission yet, but I'll have to give this one a look when I do...

"The PPC is unrecognisable to those who knew it in its early days" I sort of took the idea of things being completely different and ran with it. Here's my story. Sorry it's kind of long. (~1700 words) Entry

"You're joking."

"No, I'm not. I don't joke, Tarin, you know that."

"Well, yeah, but-- Really, Mer?" Tarin looked skeptically at her friend, who sighed, and then motioned at the stasis chambers before him.

"Okay, so, in 2012, everyone was going nutso about the supposed apocalypse, right?"

"Right." Tarin remembered that from her history lessons, and had always thought that was stupid. Besides, everyone knew the apocalypse was going to happen in the year 5000. Duh.

"So, a couple agents volunteered to go into stasis in case anything actually happened and they had to rebuild society. Among them was my umpteen-times great grandma. Dad used to take me down here and tell me the story about how she volunteered, and how her partner raised her son after that," Mer said, relishing his captive audience.

"So why didn't they unfreeze her after the apocalypse didn't happen?" Tarin asked, frowning a bit.

"Because the tech was so experimental, all they could do was keep an eye on the agents' vitals and hope for the best," Mer replied, shrugging. "That's why it's a part of Medical now."

Tarin regarded the young woman in the chamber before her with an appraising eye. She didn't look over twenty-five, and was dressed in all brown. "So," she asked, "what was her name?"

"Mal. Her name was Mal."

"Cool. Hey, do you think she can hear us?" Tarin tapped on the glass door, jumping back when a holographic overlay popped up under her fingers.

Mitochondrial genetic access key accepted. Now opening stasis chamber seven, droned a robotic voice. Tarin and Mer exchanged panicked looks and then turned back to the stasis chamber, where the glass door was sliding open. A flash of bright light and a high pitched whine signaled the deactivation of the stasis field, and the chamber's occupant stumbled out, her first breath turning into a sudden cough as she breathed for the first time in a thousand years.

Mer caught Mal as she stumbled over herself, and then gently lowered her to the floor so she could catch her breath. Mal looked up at Mer and Tarin with a bleary-eyed gaze, and then spoke, her voice shaky.

"D-did it work?" she stuttered, raising one shaky hand to her head. "Is ev-everyone okay?"

Tarin and Mer looked at one another. They were so going to get in trouble for this.

Newly-made Agent Rachel Baryn was overjoyed as she made her way down the corridors of PPC HQ to the Portal Room, where she would be teleported to her new partner. "Ooh, this is so *exciting*!" she squealed. "I'm an *Agent* now and I'm going to fight *badfic* and everything's going to be so *fun*..."

"Newbies," an older man said in disgust as he emerged from his RC.

Rachel was filled with righteous indignation as she drew herself up to her full height. "Everyone has to start somewhere! Besides, who are you to condemn me for enthusiasm?"

"Someone who's seen everything, kid," the older Agent said, his voice sounding very tired. "Once you've sporked your first badfic and nearly got killed, all that enthusiasm will be gone."

Rachel folded her arms, mentally writing him off as a disillusioned pessimist. "This *will* be fun. Besides, the PPC's safe as houses now."

The older Agent laughed sardonically. "Safe? Are you joking?"

Rachel was confused. "But it is! With everything Makes-Things has built, there's no danger at all!"

The older Agent shook his head. "That's what they want you to think. Newbies like you get the worst of it- half the newbies get killed or maimed in their first mission. They walk in, fresh out of Basic Training and full of enthusiasm, and then they do everything by the handbook and get killed because it doesn't tell them to duck. Kid, if you want to survive in this place, wise up. You need to keep calm, make sure you know what's happening and always, always know where the Sue is."

Rachel was shaken. "Half the newbies?"

"I might be exaggerating a little," he replied. "This place used to be so much better, before we expanded."

"Really?" Rachel asked, intrigued despite what he'd just told her.

"More dangerous, but," he said. "But they took better care of the newbies. Still, it wasn't like people didn't get hurt, or killed- and it wasn't just the newbies. You heard the stories about Agent Dafydd?"

Rachel nodded instantly. Along with Jay, Acacia, Makes-Things, Laburnum, Foxglove, Trojanhorse, Paddlebrains, Tasmin, Allison, Tawaki, Suicide and a handful of others, the elven Agent had become legendary.

"He got killed when he went into Celebrian."

Rachel let out a squeak at the name of one of the Legendary Badfics.

"They sent four agent pairs into Subjugation. Nobody knows what happened to Cameo, Gunny and Wayne vanished, Rez and Flip went into hiding, Suicide and Diocletian did the same and Supernumerary was the only one to make it out. The PPC isn't safe. Don't make the mistake of thinking it is, or you'll get killed."

"But didn't Dafydd kill himself just to kill the fic?" Rachel asked.

The older man nodded. "And then he got brought back to life. That's why he's legendary. Nobody sporked badfic like him."

Rachel opened her mouth to reply when her watch chimed. She looked down and the message scrolling across its screen informed her that if she didn't get a move on, she'd be late. "Oh! I have to go!"

The older man nodded. "Good luck, kid. Just remember, keep your eyes open. It'll keep you alive."

Rachel nodded and took off at a run, ready to begin her new life.

I have a fun idea, and I began writing it, but holy crap did it get out of control! You seem to be looking for ficlets, but mine just passed two pages and I've only just begun. Ah well, maybe next time.

“You know how it started, don’t you?”

Arvin paused awkwardly, his hand fidgeting with the sonic screwdriver it held. He had been about to sit back down to his desk covered in malfunctioning CADs when the older man had spoken. As much as Arvin would have liked to get back to work, he supposed he owed it to Voctor Kamras to at least stop and hear what he had to say. After all, most of what Arvin knew he owed to Voctor’s careful training, back when a plothole had plucked the young Argivian out of his proper time and place and stranded him in the PPC’s original headquarters. Arvin placed his screwdriver down and leaned against the desk, watching the other technician.

Voctor relaxed as well, straightening his arms a bit before continuing. “You remember when you first arrived in part of the PPC?”

Arvin nodded. “In the museum.”

“Yes, the museum. Back then, that was the whole PPC. And that was where it first happened. The Mysterious Somebody.” Voctor started to smooth his hair away from his forehead, but seemed to think better of it and let his arm drop. “Three agents—very idiotic, susceptible to mind tricks—brought him back from my home continuum. A Sith Lord, lad, can you imagine?”

Saying nothing, Arvin continued to stare over Voctor’s shoulder.

“And all because agents were foolish enough to recruit characters from out of badfics back then! The Mysterious Somebody was the worst thing—the greatest disaster—to ever threaten the PPC. Certainly, there were others, though none as bad as the MS. And they were ALL badfic recruits. It’s amazing how long it took the Flowers to instate our current policy of only recruiting background canons from outside the influence of badfics. The chance is always present that we’ll wind up with Somebody Else just as bad.” Voctor looked up at the ceiling, a bit longingly.

“That is, after all, why we’ve installed all the departments on different worlds now. As you know, we at DoSAT are currently in the former headquarters of the Men in Black, which was disbanded after the existence of aliens became common knowledge to the population of this world. The DMS is, appropriately enough, in a formerly unsettled area of Middle-earth. Crossovers is stationed in Twilight Town in the Kingdom Hearts universe, and Bad Slash is in the old St. Mungo’s, before it was combined with that Muggle hospital. We can accept applicants directly, and simply kill all the characters encountered in any badfic. It’s much safer all around.”

Arvin hung his head. “I know all this already.” After a pause, he added, “Sir.”

“Oh. Yes. Of course, lad!” Voctor chuckled in embarrassment. “I only meant—well, I wanted you to know that I’m proud of you for doing this. You must always be watchful for that next Somebody Else. And you mustn’t trust anyone…not even me.” Voctor gave a small smile, but Arvin didn’t see it.

He couldn’t bring himself to raise his head, to look his long-time tutor in the eye as the Weeds who had been restraining Voctor pulled him to the door and led him away.

In the Great Years, before the death of Bast and the onset of the Urple Tide, a man arose among the PPC named Jared, called the Slayer. And it is told that, tempted by the goddess Luxury, Lady of Lust, he fell upon the maiden Traf and, in madness and love, devoured her. Now when the Gods heard this they were filled with wrath, but the Sub Rosa, who sees all, beseeches them that they send not forth Jay and Acacia to crush his skull and rend his flesh, but that they should prepare three labours for this man, that thereby he might redeem himself. And the Gods thought this good. "For lo," said Constance, Mother of All, "I would not see my child torn to shreds unnecessarily, and besides, it is traditional."

Then it was that the Blossoming One himself appeared to Jared the Slayer. And the first task the Sunflower Official laid before him was this: to retrieve the Three Holy Weapons from the Sues of the Mysterious Somebody – the Canon Cannon, the Book of Fandom, and the Most Holy Hat.

Long and hard Jared sought the Canon Cannon, in the wild places of deep time, until at the last he reached the lair of the foul Piratate. And fierce was their battle and many were the blows, but once only did the Piratate's Glance strike Jared, that he was filled with a lust for all women, and in return he smote her seven times, so that she died. And thus the Slayer returned the Canon Cannon to the PPC.

Now the power of the Canon Cannon is this: that by it men might travel the multiverse at will. And thus it is called the Portal, the Ready Advance. And by its power did Jared search long and hard for the Book of Fandom, in the wild places of deep improbability, until at last he reached the lair of the Slashing Demon. And fierce was their battle and many were the blows, but once only did the Demon's Gaze strike Jared, that he loved rather men than women, and in return he smote it seven times, so that it died. And thus the Slayer returned the Book of Fandom to the PPC.

Now the power of the Book of Fandom is this: that by it men may see the thoughts of their enemies even at a distance. And thus it is called the Words, the Cunning Attentive Device. And by its power did Jared search long and hard for the Most Holy Hat, in the wild places of deep unconsciousness, until at last he reached the lair of the Lego. And fierce was their battle and many were the blows, but only once did the Lego's Lovers strike Jared, that he loved no longer men nor women but became a Misogynistic Pig, and in return he smote him seven times, so that he died. And thus the Slayer returned the Most Holy Hat to the PPC.

Now the power of the Most Holy Hat is this: that by it men may change their form and move in secret. And thus it is called the Disguise Generator, the Disquieting Oracle of Randomly Kinked Sight. And now the Blossoming One appeared again to Jared and said, "You have done well. Hear now your second labour."

And Jared said, "No."

And the Sunflower Official said, "What?"

And Jared said, "That was three weapons, so it was three labours. Do the maths."

And the Sunflower Official said, "Hang on a minute-"

But Jared the Slayer donned the Most Holy Hat and became disguised, and he fired the Canon Cannon and left that place, and he read the Book of Fandom and knew the thoughts of Jay and Acacia, and the Gods could not catch him. And it is said that, if he has not died, he lives still.

Here it is: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1lI82J0EdHETXGsURXkF2LKsGO58JVmiiXuJAcxgFT04/edit?pli=1&hl=en_US

Other challenges: Maybe Tales from the Mirror Universe?

After watching the various characters and factions fighting over it throughout the movie, I took it for granted that the Spanish fleet wanted to find the Fountain for the same reasons. So when they announced they wanted to DESTROY it, it felt like a whole new facet had been added to the conflict (not that it lasted long).

We all knew from the get-go that the Fountain would be destroyed. Everyone going after it wanted something from it and 1) characters simply getting what they want is dull and 2) since Status Quo is God, the fountain couldn't be found, or if found, must be lost or destroyed.

Also, the religious conflict was handled with more tact than you'd expect from your average Hollywood blockbuster. One of the main conflicts is the Catholic Spanish vs the Protestant British- the British get involved because they hear the Spanish are going after it, and they don't want their hated Papist rivals to gain the secret of eternal life.

The Spanish, meanwhile, are still a waxing colonial power, and are working hard to Catholicize the heathen natives of the areas they've annexed. Abstract religious reasons aside, they have very valid political reasons for wanting the Fountain buried and forgotten. If nothing else, it's existence lends credence to beliefs they're in the process of suppressing. (And, let's be honest, the part where it's all human-sacrifice-y would give a lot of people moral qualms.)

As far as the merfolk are concerned, I don't think the Spanish would be inclined to deal with them, or vice-versa. Whether or not they had souls to be saved would be a valid question that the value of conversion would depend upon, and I have serious doubts that the merfolk would take humans at their words on a small matter, let alone a mass religious conversion. Besides, only that one particular mermaid had an interest in the (presumably Protestant) missionary, so on cutting a deal with the Spaniards with the intention of honoring it, it would be Papacy all the way, baby.

Honestly, the only part I was unsatisfied with was the fate of the missionary. But even that I didn't feel cheated by; it's not his story, and leaving that plot thread dangling does preserve some of the sense of mystery that surrounds the merfolk.

...sorry. Nattering. That's just what I think.

I really liked the movie, but I am a huge POTC fan and watch all the movies with pirate-goggles firmly planted on my nose (they are like nostalgia-goggle, only with pirates) so it would have been hard for me not to like this one.

I actually didn't have a problems with the Spaniards' reason for destroying the fountain. For me, it seemed to be pretty much in character, historically speaking, that they would do something like that.

I was more unhappy with Sparrow abandoning Angelica in the end. Unless it was on the rum-smugglers new island so he could be sure she could get rescued, but it didn't say so.

And oh, isn't it a strange time we live in, in which the mermaids of one continuum are more terrifying than the vampires of another?

For one, people doing lots of video games is actually relatively new. A lot of the oldbies worked in fandoms such as Lord of the Rings, Pirates of the Caribbean, Harry Potter, and other fandoms that have had definite badfic explosions. Mario has sort of... always remained a burbling set level of hazy terrible, and the video game division (while not new) didn't actually see so much action until somewhat recently (past 3 years I guess? Though there was some from before that.)

Though as a writer for the DMS: Video Game Division, I actually have been thinking about doing a mario mission for a little bit.

Actually...

this is a weird request, but as you've already admitted it to be badfic on the wiki, I was thinking of picking up your Super Luigi Bros. fic and sporking that. Remember! This isn't an issue of hard feelings or picking on people. Most of us have written bad fic in the past, and it's always good to laugh at ourselves.

(Besides, I promise to make it exciting. I have some funny ideas.)

Would you be OK with that? We usually don't spork fic of people we know, but I figure that if you actually hang around here, I might as well ask you before I go around making fun of it.