Jul 2010 Archive, part a

...They are many, and it would only leave to further harm--even forest-death, maybe."

I think leave should be lead in that sentence.

Other than that, I haven't found anything to comment on. This is really good. I was only disappointed that there wasn't more of it.

...except that I can't find a thing about it that I'd change. Not so much as a typo.

Sure, once it gets longer and there are more plot points and characters to worry about, you'll need a second set of eyes. But right now, it looks just fine to me. The writing style is good, too; formal, but not jarring.

I felt horribly sorry for your elf, though. Almost like I didn't want the story to go on, and have him see the things we've done to the forest. And I'm not even a huge environmentalist or anything.

We said Wednesday the 7th, arriving at 11.34ish. Just to clarify, is the overnight issue/sofa offer still valid? 'Cause it's gonna be a lot cheaper for me that way than otherwise.

(Also, yes, week-long Gathering for you guys. :D Awesome.)

If it is, then barring any problems we'll both arrive on the 11:34 train. Is the station a good meeting point?

In case we run out of stuff to do, I'll print off some fics for dramatic readings (anyone got a videophone or similar recording device?) and bring my Discworld quizbook - "The Wyrdest Link", if you're familiar with it.

Imagine, for an instant, that a storyline is just that - literally a line, stretching through some meta-space. It's been Published, which makes it extra shiny and special. That storyline is the Canon for that particular work - Lord of the Rings has a Canon (two, if you count the movies), MIB has a Canon, and so on.

Immediately surrounding Canon is a tight weave of well-written fanfic storylines. It's like a rope - all nicely aligned, woven together, and although parallel threads don't always agree, the whole thing holds together nicely. This is good fanfic. Each fanfic takes a little bit of strength from the main Canon, but because it weaves right back in, the net effect is to make the whole thing stronger.

Surrounding that is the whole tangled mess of badfic, which makes our nice, neatly woven rope of fandom look like a messy yarn-ball. It's ugly, it's messy, and as each fic still takes strength from the Canon, it weakens the entire assemblage. The job of the PPC is to trim out those tangles and keep the rope of canon something resembling coherent and linear.

That's how I see it, anyways. Your perceptions may vary.

Now, World One is yet another Canon in that meta-space. It isn't our Earth, it's a fictional translation thereof. This is where it starts to get a bit mind-bending, as World One, along with all other fiction set in the "real world" (to a given limit of "real") is also fanfiction, looping around the concept of the Real World (the actual, nonfictional space we inhabit).

Agents are usually Dangerously Genre Savvy, to borrow the term. Many of them break the fourth wall to some degree or another - the PPC is metafiction, so a little bit of recursive fun is always possible.

Because I asked similar questions early on... And no, you won't be kicked off for rambling. I'd know, if it could happen it would have already happened to me several times.

As for your questions, I don't see a problem with agents being aware that they're just words, or that someone's writing each word of their fate. Despite sounding pretty dark, I don't mean that everyone's hopelessly controlled or something similarly grim. I like to imagine it as more of a less parasitic relationship between the author and their characters/agents, with the words merely being a set of instructions for them as free-willed beings to follow, rather than complete and total control (which is what badfic does for the most part, in my opinion). The two can overlap sometimes, but that doesn't happen very often.

Second one. I think of the bad fanfiction being more like an infection or parasite of sorts, appearing at first in the general area it began, then spreading further and further until the original continuum is entirely replaced or damaged beyond repair. Fortunately, this is quite slow, and the continuum has natural defenses to deal with some of the badfic, so agents only need to destroy the major source of disruption, then the natural order restores itself for the most part. This means some just mediocre 'fic isn't going to cause any real damage.

These match up with one particular perception/theory of the PPCverse that's in my head. It's pretty detailed, so I won't post the entire thing here and now.

...Great, now you've got me rambling...

The PPC is itself a continuum. Some agents are aware that they have writers. For example:

July's agent of the same name discovers the Internet and (briefly) her Author:
Recursive Behavior

Also, part of the job of the DIO is to assassinate Mary Sues that have infiltrated the PPC. Sure, some of those are just Sued PPC agents who've been exposed to a little too much glitter and been "assimilated"; but some of them are PPC agents written by PPC badfic writers. Jaycacia Thornbyrd is one famous example; you might also check the DIO web page; there are a couple of missions there. (Both things are linked on the wiki.) Note that the DIO neuralyzes regular PPC agents who come in contact with its agents; the PPC in general doesn't know of their existence.

So, basically, the PPC is a continuum like any other, a Word World connected by plot holes to all the other continua (except quarantined continua, ones where the author has forbidden fanfic). I've seen multiple instances of agents able to see their own Words, such as when an agent gets annoyed and speaks in allcaps and someone else tells them to stop speaking in allcaps. No-Drool vidoes got the nickname of "ellipsis debriefings" in one fic, in which an agent was summoned for "a ...debriefing." Similar things happen all the time.

So it's safe to say that particularly observant PPC agents do know they are fictional characters, and a few have even speculated about their Authors; but in the world of the PPC, fictional characters are real (that is, sentient, if they're written well enough). World One is special because it has such a high plot hole density. We don't know what, but plot holes tend to be instrumental in the creation of worlds (the Cascade, which created HQ, was a plot-hole-driven event). World One residents, if they have the ability, can become Authors, and mentally connect to different continua, either an established one or an undiscovered one. Whether they create new continua or just discover them is unknown (I tend to think they discover continua that exist already, in a multiverse where literally everything that could ever happen, does happen.)

To think about how visiting fics works, you have to think in more than three dimensions. Every canon is a continuum worlds, with not just the actual canon that does happen, but AUs that could have happened. A Mary Sue creates natural, uncontrolled plot holes, dragging canon out of shape and into dangerously improbable configurations; PPC agents create controlled plot holes that let them insert themselves into the fic in order to repair it. The main canon is the most probable arrangement; good AUs are the most probable of the alternate possibilities. A story is made of what does happen, and also of what could have happened. When uncontrolled plot holes damage a continuum, they connect extremely improbable possibilities to the main canon; and information can leak through them to damage the main canon. Eventually, left unchecked, the information becomes nonsense and meaningless, and loses its organization. In the end-stage, no usable information is left at all. Wild plot holes endanger the continuum because they damage the organization of the information that makes up the Word World.

If you need a 3d representation, think of a continuum as an infinite number of time-strings, stretching out into the distance. Each string is a world and all its events (at least four dimensions, possibly more in sci-fi continua). In the middle is the Main Canon, connected by goodfic and good AUs to the strings nearby, which are alternate possibilities, pulling (by way of information transfer, not physical force) on the Main Canon. These connections can't pull it far out of shape because they are so close to Canon; in fact, they strengthen the canon the way a rope of ten strands is stronger than a rope of one strand. The problem comes when a Suethor connects an extremely far-flung world to Main Canon. A string very far away from the main canon will pull it out of shape much further than one that is close; and because they are so far away, cannot strengthen the main canon; in fact, it pulls the main canon away from the goodfic and good AUs that give it some of its strength. This connection is the Mary Sue, the Author-wraith, or some rarer manifestation of natural plot-hole formation. Sever it, and the main canon springs back into the middle, where it should be. Let it be, and the nonsense from the least probable reaches of the continuum begins to destroy the order of the world.

When PPC agents visit a fic, they aren't, technically, visiting Main Canon. They're visiting a stretched version in which the Mary Sue exists. Even when they remove the Sue and canon returns to near-normal, they aren't, technically, visiting Main Canon, because Main Canon doesn't have PPC agents in it. Only when they leave to return to HQ does the Canon completely return to normal--though, because PPC agents represent goodfic, their presence wouldn't damage Main Canon any more than normal goodfic does even if they chose to stay.

Because every badfic stretches the Main Continuum in a slightly different direction, PPC agents don't tend to meet each other, as they are in different subcontinua. The one exception is a Ficverse Fusion event (has a wiki article; has only been observed once or possibly twice if the Les Miserables Songfic Crisis event was an example), in which very similar words cause two alternate sub-continua to merge.

Yes. PPC agents--especially those who drop through plot holes from World One--can write, read, and review fanfiction. There are actually some PPC agents who used to write badfic and have had to kill their own work.

Most PPC agents join the PPC after falling through a plot hole to the PPC; but quite a few are brought through plot holes by agents in the field. The PPC itself is a continuum made of an infinite number of sub-continua.

Brain hurting yet? Good. :)

Has anyone tried to write a guide to writing for a specific canon? Like an encyclopedia or wiki, where there would be stuff on characters.

I.e., on an article about Legolas, it might say:

Legolas Thranduillion IS an elf. Greenleaf is NOT his last name. Thranduil is NOT an abusive father. Legolas' preferred weapons are knives and bow and arrows, he can be found in books X and Y and blah blah blah.

Because if no one has... it could be interesting

Two things:

1. Keep working on this weird English language. Mostly you're doing pretty well, but there are a few issues of tense and number agreement--for example:

-- You wanted "Writing Sample," not "Write Sample."

-- "He was somehow spawn" should be "He was somehow spawned."

-- The sentence "It was supposed that everybody here were dead" should be "It was supposed that everybody here was dead," because "everybody" is a collective, which means you treat it as a singular noun. Also, although "were" is sometimes used instead of "was" in hypothetical situations, this isn't hypothetical; it's a statement of what was truly believed by someone.

... I hope that's not too much information to be helpful. ^_^;

Anyway:

2. Please please please use quotation marks for dialogue. I don't know if hyphens are standard in Italian, but they are not standard in English. If someone did that in a fic I was PPCing, it would be a charge. Unless you're James Joyce, you use quotation marks.

Also, do bear in mind that Corolla will be in disguise unless the agents are on a mission to her home continuum. I can't think of any others that would allow a fairy doll thing to go unremarked. Also, is the flesh-eating usual for her kind?

Finally, I'd be interested in what other people have to say before actually granting Permission; maybe someone who knows the Nanoha continuum?

~Neshomeh

I think that you either figure out which words you over-use and use "Find", or paste the text into a word cloud creator, which will automatically show you some of the words used most frequently.
Wordle is a good website.
So is TagCrowd (it also allows you to upload text from another source, like a Word document, as long as it isn't larger than the allotted MB amount).
ABCya! is worth giving a try.
Maybe this will help. (I have the same problem.) I'm not sure if this will help with phrases, but I think it will help with words.

I can totally relate to your troubles. That would be a handy thing to have. The nearest thing I can think of is the "Find" option under microsoft word- it lets you find every instance where you used a specific word, but then again you have to know what word you want to look for with that tool so I guess it doesn't really match what you're looking for.

Maybe some day.

Until then, rereading and beta readers will have to suffice.

But generally I notice and try to change it.

On the other hand, then I find myself using the same set pattern of synonyms over and over again, or just using too many variants on the same word, so it sounds more like I'm violently shaking a thesaurus to see what falls out than actually writing. It's hard to find a balance.

I notice it happens a lot when I try to write formally; probably because I tend to use longer words in formal-style writing.

I think he was definitely overreacting and (pardon my French) being an asshole, although I'd have to see the exact conversation. Not that I think you're lying, but paraphrasing does have a tendency to

I'd say ignore him. Some people are like that, and you're going to run into people who counter-flame for no good reason, but it's best not to take it too personally. There are plenty of nice, reasonable people on the Internet, too (Just look at this board!), and people like this guy are a minority. Sometimes you can reason with them, but I don't think it'll work with this one.

That being said, I would point out that if he only wants to be told the nice things, he's never going to improve. Self-criticism is a notoriously shoddy method of editing, and while flaming is also bad, a healthy dose of con-crit is wonderful for a writer's style.

I think the best thing to do is just stop communicating with this individual. S/he obviously doesn't want any help with their writing, so leave them to it. And as you said, they might even be going through a bad time, or something, so there's nothing to be gained from pressing the issue, and things could get worse easily. So I say, just drop it.

On the subject of social phobias, it took me an AMAZINGLY long time in grade school to understand that there are people out there who will be rude to me for no apparent reason. The best way to cope with it is just roll with the hits when you have to, and surround yourself with friendly people when you can...but maybe don't become quite so much of a homebody as I have. That shit ain't healthy.

http://www.critters.org/whathow.ht

That is a really good resource for tips on how to say things in reviews so that there is a good chance that the writer will actually listen.

Boy, am I ever glad I responded to him. He was being extremely oversensitive, but he admitted it, apologized, and explained where he was coming from. I understand, and we both feel much better now.

Of course, this was someone who was acting relatively rationally, which is not so common online. I'm really sorry I posted all this, but I had to get it out, and your responses do help me to know what to do next time something like this comes up. I'm sure it will come up again with someone less rational, and I'll remember your comments and advice about reviews.

(Isn't that a neat phrase? I picked it up recently from... Trojie, I think. Never heard it before. Better than "drama queen", certainly. Now on to my opinion...)

I say just drop the matter. Like Neshomeh says, some of the things you wrote could come off as challenging or superior, though this author would have to be either pretty short-tempered or young not to be able to handle that. There's no way to know - maybe he's a drama llama and maybe he was just having a bad day. In either case, it's just not important enough to trouble yourself with.

If you really want to send something, a simple response saying "I see. I will stop reviewing now." is probably the only vaguely safe thing. If he can't take criticism, that's not your problem - leaving reviews is a favour you were doing. So just stop. Remember, you'll never please everyone. I've been in exactly the same situation several times, and the only thing to do is walk away.

Also, take care not to be a dramam llama yourself. It's just a review. I wouldn't worry. :)

I'd say if he's going off about you not being a good person than he's probably just butthurt. I'd say ignore him.

I don't doubt you, but seeing what you wrote might help me understand how another person might interpret it.

That said, if this is on ff.net, it sounds like this guy didn't read the posting guidelines. I'm pretty sure it explicitly says "not all reviews have to be purely good." 'Cause they don't. If he's not okay with that, he shouldn't be posting. There's certainly no call for anyone going around saying that people who give concrit are bad people; and I'm sorry, but if a reader is honestly confused about something even after trying to figure it out (which I assume you, as an astute reader, did), then it's the author's job to figure out what the problem is and fix it, not judge their reading comprehension. That's just insulting.

In closing, "just for fun" is not an excuse for carelessness. If your sloppy writing makes it hard for the reader to stay engaged, it's no longer fun for them. If you don't care about the readers, then write for the drawer.

~Neshomeh, who can't stand people whining about the concrit they should consider themselves lucky to get--it's not easy to find people who will do it!

Because the more I think about it, the more I think he remembers a lot of things wrong and might feel better if he realized the truth. But I still don't want to extend an argument... ugh...

This place where the fanfic is, does it have private messages? If so, I suggest that you take him to the side and get things sorted out. Do not do it in the comment boxes, because that tends to make things rather sticky.

However, as I am not known for being a social person myself, wait for other people to respond before acting on this.

I approve of the tidying-up, even though I was the one doing a lot of the un-tidying. Urge to trope everything is overpowering, I swear ...

Anyway, opening a Quotes page for us on TVTropes could be fun.

For the concept, if not for every single OFU. In the meantime, though, let's not add OFU examples to the PPC page, okay? Even if they do involve PPC agents, it's technically a sort of crossover. (Forgive me if I'm overstepping my authority here.)

(Are we still allowed to mention character-specific examples on individual trope pages?)

Since now is a page that everyone can read easily (and it's funny) I think that we can say "Mission Accomplished!"
However, someone cut a trope into half

And it's still a long list. Heh. Nonetheless, cheers to all of you; it's good to see that page gets some brisk attention.

It's even gotten so bad I'd wondered if some of the PPC agents are- but you don't want that kind of depressing-

Well, all I can say is forge ahead. If you post something, let us take a look.

Oh well. I'm actually writing a 'Sue right now- a Bourne 'Sue- but I know it's a Sue and I'll never publish it, so no harm done.

Okay, that's not really helpful either. Sorry.

As a writer, I want to improve my writing skills... but at the same time I'm very paranoid that I might end up writing a bad character. In fact, I'm currently on a bit of a hiatus from writing because of a crisis of faith of sorts with my own writing skills...

I've got a Kingdom Hearts fic on the Pit that I haven't looked at in ages. It got a (very small handful of) positive but general reviews. As college became more time-intensive, I slowed down working on it, and then stopped altogether. Then I discovered the PPC, and began to get worried about whether my OC was a Mary-Sue or not. I've actually become more confident of it lately, and plan to go back and revise the fic before eventually continuing it.

Anyway, I guess we sometimes have to face the fact that, no matter how much we enjoy writing fanfiction, it's always going to be fanfiction. While we should always put in an appropriate effort to make sure it's good, we shouldn't become disheartened when our writing isn't great. No one will ever write about Harry Potter as well as J.K. Rowling did, and that's okay; we can still enjoy the attempt at rising to meet her work even when we don't quite touch it.

Someone who you know can really write, and who knows the canon forwards, backwards, sideways, and quite possibly chewed by a dog, and who is willing to say "Uhm...no. Redo that." Because that way, if they don't say that, you can relax.

It's a pretty worldwide problem, though, so if you can't find a beta reader, I offer up the Mithril Rule of Writing:

Don't think. Write.

Even in original fiction; I always worry about my characters being Sues and my plotlines being fail. Also, those difficult scenes that work in your head but are hard to get right on paper are just pure evil.

What I've written tends to get good reviews, but unhelpful reviews. I much prefer it when people point out what I could have done differently and/or better--somehow, it makes me feel better than pure compliments.

...can be tricky. It's always nice to know that somebody likes your story, but I've seen Legendary Badfics get similar positive feedback. I've made a habit of looking at other fics my reviewers have also given positive reviews, to see if they generally have good taste in writing. But, I know all too well that that is one of the most time-consuming ways to check if your fic is good.

A less...creepy way to check is to let us look at it. We generally only review missions, but I for one wouldn't mind reviewing other Boarder's work.

(And I'm fairly sure that you're distraught, not disraught.)

I know exactly how you feel. I'm wrangling with the same thing myself, actually. Add to that that I've stopped trusting the good reviews I get on the pit, since I've gotten glowing reviews for stories that I think now are PPC worthy. -wince- There's a reason -- apart from my general lazy nature and persistent writer's block -- that I haven't posted anything there in months.

Mainly, I just keep writing. I know it's not a too terribly helpful answer, but it's the only way I've found to get through it. Currently (well, for way over a year now) I'm working on a Harry Potter next generation 'fic, and I too think that my characters are perhaps not quite as canonical as they could be. (It's been a long time since I was eleven, and never have I been the youngest son of a celebrity, so I'm having a hard time imagining how the boys think.) I have a list a couple miles long of things to change once I finish the first draft. But I have to finish it first. I subscribe very firmly to the theory that you can't edit what isn't there, and so I have a first draft first rule. Only when that's finished can I go back in and see if, one, it's worth keeping at all, and two, how to make it better.

I guess this is a kind of a long winded way of saying that we're in the same boat, and I would recommend just writing it as well as you can the first time around, and then going back later. Rereading your own stuff, at least for me, is always fun, and while there are always many cringe-worthy moments, there are often some, "I wrote that? Wow..." moments as well.

Hope this helps. Even if it doesn't, know that you are in no way alone.

--anamia

...that you are even trying to write an OC for FFVII when there's already such a large cast of characters? Could you accomplish the same goals by using established ones?

Besides that it sounds like you're just having the same insecurity all writers do.

1. MSS. - can't help you- dunno
   
   2. On Elves of the LOTR variety. - I heard in the Silmarillion they're supposed to have 'leaf-shaped' ones, but that could just be- okay here's the link. It's complicated, language-wise... But you can take whichever side of the argument you wish.
   http://tolkien.slimy.com/essays/Ears.html
   
   
   3. Minis. - I dunno, {again} but I guess you could, for the Rule of Funny. I mean, isn't that what the PPC is really all about?
   
   Can't help with these- okay
   Sorry

MSS was mentioned in an issue of the Multiverse Monitor. If you've not read that issue, you should:

Multiverse Monitor, Issue 2

The Monitor is a bit tabloid-like, so it's up to you whether you want your agent to have MSS or not--for all we know, it's about as reliable as the Sunflower official's "love vase". We know that MSS doesn't affect all ex-Sue agents; it may not affect any, or only a very few.

Relevant quotes:
"It happens to anyone who used to be a Sue/Stu. It’s something mainly found in females, though. In short…it’s like turning into a werewolf every full moon…except you turn into a beautiful, long-legged, perky breasted, urple haired freak once a month for four to seven days."

The Multiverse Monitor was published from 2006 to 2007, so this might've happened before it became common for minor ex-Sues to join the PPC. It's quite reasonable that in the four years since then it's become possible to maintain an ex-Sue without her ever reverting. A lot of the current reformed Sues take medication to prevent them becoming Sues again (notably anti-lustin and logicillin). Maybe this is part of what the meds prevent.

MSS was mentioned in an issue of the Multiverse Monitor. If you've not read that issue, you should:


Relevant quotes:
"It happens to anyone who used to be a Sue/Stu. It’s something mainly found in females, though. In short…it’s like turning into a werewolf every full moon…except you turn into a beautiful, long-legged, perky breasted, urple haired freak once a month for four to seven days."

The Multiverse Monitor was published from 2006 to 2007, so this might've happened before it became common for minor ex-Sues to join the PPC. It's quite reasonable that in the four years since then it's become possible to maintain an ex-Sue without her ever reverting. A lot of the current reformed Sues take medication to prevent them becoming Sues again (notably anti-lustin and logicillin). Maybe this is part of what the meds prevent.

1. MSS = "Mary Sue Syndrome"? If so, I'd say it can affect natives of other canons as well.
   If you're referring to something else, then not sure.
   
   2. Tolkien said something along the lines of them having "leaf shaped ears" (He didn't specify which leaf; I'm assuming not a maple leaf or anything like that). My personal view is that they're a bit more rounded than as portrayed in the movies, but still more elongated than most human ears.
   
   4. Ardalambion is good; Real Elvish also has some name lists (arranged by meaning) http://www.realelvish.net/namelists.php
   Most of them seem to be legit, as far as I can tell.
   
   6. I'd say post all four. There's nothing that says you can only have two Agents. That said, it's a good idea to only have as many Agents as you can write properly (hypocritical, I know, from the guy with six Agents; three of which have hardly gotten any screen time).
   
   Elcalion

1. What do you mean by "MSS"? I'm not familiar with the term and neither the PPC wiki or proper Wikipedia are giving me an explanation.
   
   2. Generally, we assume that they do, but I wouldn't make it a big Charge if you can avoid it unless it's absolutely, definitely movieverse.
   
   3. It's closer to an actual 'law' than not, simply because we do try to be consistent throughout as many stories as possible. There may be a reason why other minis don't conform - such as, maybe, that there was description in the fic they were found in that directly influenced their appearance. I'd really rather that you didn't make a mini-Hedwig; perhaps your agents could adopt a forced-into-OOC-ness replacement for Pigwidgeon instead?
   
   4. Ardalambion is the best site I know for Tolkien's languages; I haven't explored the whole thing, but there's a course showing you exactly how the grammar of Quenya works, so that should help you somewhat.
   
   5. No idea, sorry. I don't know the fandom.
   
   6. Unless you plan on having all four of them work together in your missions (and for sheer confusion factor, I strongly suggest you don't, at least not for the first few missions), then stick to the two you will be writing about. Remember, mission writing is really a lot more work than it looks, so you won't be churning them out every few days. Start slow. There's always time later.
   
   Hope that helped.

Hey, a question I can actually help with!

To my knowledge, though I could be wrong on this, the Piper's Children stop aging for two reasons:

1) Time flows differently in the House, meaning that what would be days for them could be anything from seconds to years in the world they came from.

2) After spending enough time in the House, their humanity slowly starts to fade, and they become part Denizen. Also, due to being part Denizen, I don't think they age outside of the House either, or if they do, it'd be much slower.

So, to that effect, you couldn't exactly have an ex-Piper's Child, because the Piper's Children are what they are. You could have a Piper's Child who no longer lived in the House, but I think it's far more likely that a Piper's Child who was an Agent would have simply descovered a hallway in the House that connected to a hallway in the HQ, and just assumed that this was all part of the House and how it worked.

I'm somewhat good at finding bad spelling, quite a bit better at grammar, can usually spot awkwardly-phrased sentences, like the Holmes universe, and know just over nothing about British terms. Hopefully I'll be some help, but you might want to get another beta as well.

...chocolate is kinda pitiful. How 'bout a Beretta? They're pretty nice. I likes it, preciousss

Hmm, Enyd Blyton, *reaches for Wikipedia*

Have a lovely piece of dark chocolate. Caffeine's good stuff if you only have 4 hours between missions.

Um... have an assortment of chocolate bars... since that's all I seem to have.

With enough greens to last it for two years, and a pre-built stable.

Have some Convenient Cake, a piece of blue-tac, and a Mars Bar. And a Bag, because real birthdays deserve decent presents ;)

Have a panda shaped ice cream bar!

*Miah acts as a bad influence* Have a Bleepbeer!

Here's a vial of water from the spring in Tuck Everlasting. This way, you'll have many more birthdays where that one came from!

And us, too. :3

Happy birthday, Anamia! Have a coupon. It can be for whatever you want it to BD

Huzzah and hurrah! Let there be much consumption of cake!

Wow. I'm nostalgiaing so hard it's almost painful.

Have a great day!
:)

The Faraway Tree? I used to read those when I was little. Awesome books.
Anyway, birthday presents! Have a Random Artefact of Rassilon and a large cheesecake.

Wow, the Faraway Tree? I haven't read those books in about a decade. I approve.

As a birthday gift, I present you with a sack of pebbles, a sling customised especially for you, and a basket of Bleeprin-berries - delicious and good for you. :D

The situation is really unrealistic. Bin Laden has proved a ridiculously hard enemy to catch; and the many, many Marines that have tried so far haven't managed it. Having the Stu catch Bin Laden is just not something that could actually happen; Bin Laden knows how much he is wanted and he is not the type to just go randomly walking out of buildings, without bodyguards, without protection, without disguise, without having checked for snipers.

I suggest you should have your agents go up to the dead bin Laden and find little more than a cardboard cutout, such as the sort people practice shooting at, and be disappointed that--shot by a Stu or not--he isn't real.

I appreciate you asking before doing anything with it.

I can think of one option, and that is to just gloss over that part. Don't mention it at all in the course of the mission. I assume there's enough else going on that your charge list wouldn't hinge on that.

I'm with you in theory, and it wouldn't be the first instance of continuity-traveling characters having to save (or just not kill) Hitler/whoever, but it may be Too Soon for that regarding bin Laden.

~Neshomeh

I have a few issues with this.

First of all, your bios are not very detailed. There is no mention of age, physical appearance, or gender, though I was able to guess that from the names. The bullet-point list isn't giving me very much information about their personalities - lust objects, weapons of choice and so on are barely mentioned. I feel like you haven't really fleshed them out.

There are several typos and grammatical or punctuation errors both in your bios and the writing sample. A few of the more glaring onces:
* (I have no dount they'll take on more fandoms as I watch and read more.)
* Of course [the] Rule of Flowers are Bastards will mean these'll show up too.
* You're also missing a lot of commas and, in a few cases, semi-colons.
This gives me the impression that you didn't take the time to re-read your submission before presenting it. Tell me, do you have a beta-reader?
(Also, this is the first I've heard of a "Rule of Flowers are Bastards". There is no such rule. Now, such things are find when in the dialogue of a grumpy agent - we're a sarcastic lot - but it doesn't really belong in bios.)

Your writing sample doesn't make me laugh. I know that's a terribly subjective thing to complain about, but a hundred-word paragraph describing the contents of someone's bag isn't particularly appealing. We ask for writing samples because, as the Permission article says, "We want to see whether you can write well, basically." This isn't a fatal 'error', but it's not helping, either.

Content issues:
* HQ does not have an outside. It exists in a plothole, and only an entrance exists in World One. Your writing implies that PPC HQ is inside a real-world mountain, and whether or not that was your intention, it's wrong. You'll have to change it.
* We do have rather tight security. Talk to the Dandelions if you don't believe me. Simply leaning on a door will not gain entry.
* (2). I may have misunderstood the idea behind HQ slightly. Yes, I'm afraid you have. The interior of PPC HQ does not resemble (let alone exist as part of) various fandom locations; it's all generic grey corridor and rooms, even though the plotholes themselves may be 'in' various fandoms.

As I didn't read your writing sample last time, I cannot make comparisons there there, but my biggest discomfort comes from the fact that you don't seem to have a grasp on some of the PPC fundamentals, and that there are very few changes to your agent bios compared to the last time you requested Permission.

For the moment, I'm sorry: Permission denied. I'll ask other PGs for a second opinion, but for now, I'd like to ask you to re-read the Original Series just to get a better grip on how they decided HQ works, and then re-write your writing sample.

But I just created an agent with a terror of regressing to Suedom. I'm probably being really silly about this, but it made me twitch enough to want to make sure that it's only a case of accidental telepathy and you thought of that independently. Right?

I confess myself extremely dubious and would like to hear what this theory actually is and how it addresses the loss of the symbolism of Nine Walkers to oppose the Nine Riders.

Either way, like Calista says, I don't think OFUM would kick anybody out whether it works or not. Either it doesn't work and the writer would be subjected to Remedial Numerology with a very annoyed Elrond, or it works and they get their fanfiction license at the end of the year.

How does a Star Wars character, even a Sue, come up with half-elven lineage? Some kind of bizarre, sperm- and/or egg-sized plothole? O.o

Also, everyone can understand the Speech, that's kind of the point, but I doubt if the bits and pieces in the books constitute even a small working knowledge of it... unless you're going for "she picked it up in the course of missions to YW."

~Neshomeh

You're on your own with Improbable AU. There's not much at all and I've never seen a mission published in that department (though they may exist and be lost). If you want to write in that department, you'll be doing a lot of defining on your own.

Personally, I'd be in favor of moving the Department of Improbable AUs and turning it into a Division of the Department of Improbabilities (which does have missions in it), still headed by the Antigravity Apple as usual, and handling AUs as a specialty. (I'd consolidate the DoWTF into the same department as a division thereof, if I had my way about it; but of course I haven't got any good reason to do it, so there it stays; and who said the PPC had to be logical?)

You are of course aware that your reformed Sue won't be able to use her lightsaber on most missions, unless she's in the Star Wars continuum or at least in a continuum where lightsaber-like swords exist.

I'm a little worried about Elena's having come up with a Tenth Walker idea that actually made sense; more specifically, for having been expelled for it. I'm not entirely sure that OFUM would do something like that; there are, in fact, Tenth Walker stories that do make sense, with the most probable tenth walkers being Arwen, Faramir, and possibly Bilbo (though the author who did that to the poor hobbit would probably have to be some kind of sadist).

At the most, I think OFUM would say, "Okay. Write that story, and if it's crap, there are a lot of interesting ways to punish you..." And if it got uncomfortable because the story was indeed decent and Elrond ended up using the Death Glare more often because people started thinking that this meant Tenth Walker stories were just fine (instead of "treading on dangerous territory and requiring a lot of skill to ever pull off"), your agent might have put in for a transfer to a different OFUM just because she had learned enough to love LotR canon and didn't like the idea of the proliferating Suefics that might result.

Not a PG, sorry, but good luck.

I've sort of lost hope in HP sibling-fics (ESPECIALLY twin-fics) after reading http://www.fanfiction.net/s/6094334/1/The_Life_of_Rosanna_Hathaway_Potter . When a fic starts of with "The sun was shinning," you know you're in for a rough ride.

I think...

(Also, do most people consider plotbunnies to be fanfic-only or do original fiction naggling ideas count as plotbunnies?)

I get them quite often. Sometimes it's as simple as "Hmm, this is an interesting pose I'm standing in right now. I want to draw it."

I don't see why not.

I think that'd be funny. :)

Hmm... An artistic plot bunny?

I have a solo mission with Kelok going to this fic When gods wish to punish us Sherlock Holmes nothing graphic involved.

Headaches

And then there is an interlude with primarily Unger, but guest appearances by Miah and Cali.

Unger Takes a Walk

As per normal for me, I'm looking for help with spelling, grammar, style, and for the mission the technical facts of Sherlock Holmes and any British terminology that I have accidentally Americanized.

Both of the stories have HTML codes in line in some places, this is intentional as a help for when I post them to LJ.

I know I'm crazy, but I'm on a mission writing spree.

... I'm starting to really like Unger. He's cute. ^^ Poor Kelok, though! I'm glad he got a break between #2 and #3.

Mini-Hound of the Baskervilles = win. Who knew a slobbery green monster could be so adorable? I like the buttons, too. ^^

Keep it up!

~Neshomeh

Already said so on the chat, but these are very funny. I pity your agents for having to go through that. And poor Holmes and Watson!

Seriously, how are you finding all these badfics? I thought I had searched the Sherlock Holmes section of the Pit more thoroughly...

That NSFW fic is another where, even though we aren't supposed to badmouth the authors, I must say "Whoa, did that author's note just say he takes drugs and has hallucinations?" I almost want to think he was a troll, but the story doesn't seem like trollfic...

I'm so glad you made the Hound of the Baskervilles the Mini for Sherlock Holmes! I hope my agents will get to find one eventually, too!

And I for one know your name (although this is because you were the first or second person to greet me). I think you're ready, at least. Oh, and it's a writing sample. 'Everything' vs. 'A bit' - which sounds more sample-y?

Are there any premade forms for permission requests? I can't seem to find any... Or are we just 'sposed to wing it?

I kind of expect there is something in the post for PGs (and others) to look at and decide about whether or not to grant permission.

Been around long enough is quite simple: if it's at least a month, it's long enough.
A little harder is whether you've interacted enough. You should interact enough for PGs to remember your name, preferably in a good way.

Customary is to put up everything in one post: description of agents and writing sample. (or links to both of these). PGs give permission based on the whole thing.

Personally, I try to consider as many 'verses as possible to be part of the same canon - that is, if it's canonical somewhere, to treat it as such everywhere where there isn't a contradiction. So I'd go with a normal mini.

*runs after her Agents hidden somewhere since the fireworks started*

HAPPY CANADA DAY (belated)

Those fireworks were cool, although I thought it sad that the highest rated comment on the movie was:

"the us military should get firework/bomb/rockets and shoot them at terrorists to show them not to mess with americans (or anybody else as a matter of fact) "

Gosh, it's almost like listening to a Mary-Sue! Sigh. If only life were as simple as that.

Fireworks wouldn't do any damage anyway! Mah!

(But mostly to Americans.)

*covers up the guinea pig's cage so it doesn't freak out from the explosions*

it's also Rube Goldberg's birthday?

*sets off a few fireworks with a ridiculously complicated contraption while standing at a safe distance*

I bet this is one of the more popular holidays for DOGA. Oh, and the Mythbusters team.

Rather fitting for July to be posting this. XD

(Anyways, I'm surprised the Brits haven't posted Happy Treason Day or something like that. Heh.)

As much as I'd love to launch some, real fireworks are not allowed where I am. So I shall launch internet fireworks instead. Come join me!

*lights a fuse and runs* Fweeeeeeeeeeee BOOM!

This holiday doesn't make us ridiculously busy! No sappy, OOC and/or badslash fluff to deal with like Christmas and Valentine's Day (and, to a lesser extent, Hallowe'en and St. Pattie's Day).

Wooo! Bring on the fireworks!

Vixenmage, you are made of win just for posting that video.

And on topic... BOOM!

Eurgh. It's ninety degrees, humid, and I can't go swimming for a few days... >.> Take the converse of the end of the Lumberjack Song, and you have my sentiments right about now.

(For those poor souls not indoctrinated into the Cult of Python, the phrase I refer to is "I wish I'd been a girly, just like my dear mamar!")

Yay for things going kaboom.

Well, maybe of sentences. Also objects!

Anyway, cue the fireworks! Happy Independence Day!

And, in the spirit:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZfRaWAtBVg

As the others have said, Pads is inactive because - in her own-ish words, her 'writing brain is fried'. She'll probably be back whenever she gets inspiration again. But given that she's marked as inactive and has written a LOT more missions in the past year than I have, there's really no measure of it.

Generally speaking, if someone hasn't been seen on any of our community sites nor has posted in a mission in the past year, I'd consider them in active, but there's nothing to say that any or all of them won't pop back in tomorrow.

Pads is inactive because she said so. If she ever gets around to writing again, I'm sure she'll say she's active, until then, no.

It's hard to say if anyone is active or inactive because people come back after long periods of time or have missions ready when they pop back up.

Only way you can really decide is by someone saying so or coming to your own conclusions.

But I do know that Pads was the one who put the note that she is no longer active, so in this case it was her call.

:D

You'll never hear me complain about that. The Harry Potter one might be interesting. Hmm, fandoms...

Well, depending on if you know them, I'm quite fond of Star Trek TNG, DS9 and Voyager, Shrek, Monty Python, most of the classic Disney films, Practical Magic, the League of Extraordinary Gentlemen... and a lot more, but that's enough for now. None of those are fandoms I often (if ever) go and read fanfic for (often for fear of what they've done to my characters), so if you know anything good for them, do let me know!

We need to have a bit of a chat about TVTropes - I'm usually online at techno.dann on Gmail/Gchat, or I can dust off my AIM, if that's more convenient for you.

So long as all of the awful characters down the various plot strands have been charged and killed, I don't suppose it matters where you go exactly, and what you leave out. After all, doesn't the continuum fix itself (sort of) once you've got rid of the thing that is warping it?

One idea is that the agents have to pick which path the fic goes down, but then have a disagreement about where to go next, so they get separated in the story, have to collect charges separately, then unite again for the usual charging and assassinating. It would be something different, anyway.

Beats me how, though. O.o Um... maybe just pick a few of the worst scenarios and follow those until you have enough charges?

~Neshomeh

If we're talking about Sues (which would be either "you" or a sidekick), I can see an agent pair manipulating things so that the Sue gets the most painful ending. Or maybe they go through all of the threads, with repetitions and too-similar branches being glossed over except for the exasperation of the agents.

It would be whatever option is the funniest, really.

That sounds like insanity. Maybe they could use a variation of the thing that lets you kill sequel-Sues all at once.

Now that this has been completely overshadowed by more recent threads...

Looks to me like everyone who responded either a) abstained or b) is okay with the idea that Flowers' genders are fairly arbitrary, except maybe in a few notable circumstances where it would be weird to suddenly switch the pronouns. (That said, I'd love to see an agent try it sometime and see what happens. *g*)

Anyway, this is good news for me, since I don't have to go back and edit everything I've done with the Kudzu. Yay! But what I will do is make a note of the gender used in TOS on the wiki article and write it off as perception, or something that pretty much allows people to draw their own conclusions.

The Board wills it!

~Neshomeh, who thanks everyone who gave their opinion on the matter.

I have to agree with Techno-Dann's scientific assessment. The kudzu is a plant, so at any given time, different parts of its body are male or female, so either pronoun assigned to it is equally correct. (Or equally incorrect?)

As for Wikis, the three I'm active on (ours, Bulbapedia and TV Tropes) seem to log me out every couple of months or so, but logging back in only takes a handful of seconds, and then I'm set for another sixth of a year. So it really shouldn't be a problem for anyone to remain logged in. (Make sure you're checking "remember me on this computer" if you're not on a public terminal.)

I like the idea that gender in Flowers is just assumed. Maybe it is for the psychological response the particular gender garners from the agents (which would also explain the idea that different agents have different impressions of some Flowers gender). No matter how much we may bemoan it, in our modern society, males are still typically seen as more authoritative than females, so the Sunflower Official and Marquis de Sod take on strongly male personas, because that is the effect they are trying to project. The kudzu may have decided to take on a female persona to come across as more warm and caring to aide its work in FicPsych.

Thinking out loud here: Maybe it would seem male to a canon character or agent recruit traumatized by a Sue, because for that character the female persona wouldn't be trusted as much. Whereas a Grrl power character might perceive even the Sunflower Official as female. I agree with the others. I could see these kinds of perception differences making for interesting conversations.

Overall, I support leaving the wiki page with all female gender references, because that is how she is referred to most of the time. However that gender assignment came about.

Like most Flowers, physically, the Kudzu is both male and female.

Actually, there's a human parallel: The difference between physical and mental gender. While most people have a set physical and a set mental gender that match each other, there are quite a few whose mental and physical genders don't match, or whose mental and/or physical gender is ambiguous. For example, you might be physically female, mentally androgynous; or physically androgynous, mentally male; or any combination; or even change somewhat as your personality changes.

Those configurations are the minority for humans; but what about Flowers? Most plants (including kudzu) are both genders at once. Maybe the Flowers' gender is simply more fluid than human gender. Maybe, instead of a small minority having no particular gender, both at once, or changing gender, that's actually the norm for Flowers. Maybe gender doesn't really matter to them very much--would mental gender matter very much to you, if you came from a species where anyone could reproduce with anyone else?

It's entirely possible that the only reasons the Flowers have genders at all is that they deal with two-gendered species so often--species who insist on assigning them gendered pronouns. (It doesn't help that English doesn't have a very good pronoun for an ambiguously gendered person. "It" sounds like an object; "they" is bad grammar. And English is probably the predominant language at HQ because it is the predominant language on World One.) It could be that for the Flowers, a gender is about as important to them as our hair colors or our names are to us--something that you associate with yourself, and other people see you as; but something that really isn't all that fundamental to who you are.

BTW, I didn't edit the Kudzu's page, but I may be part of the problem, since I was the one who added the link to "The Dark Elf" on Jay's and Acacia's wiki pages...

As July and Dann have said, there are ways to explain it, And personally, I've always thought of the Flowers' genders are more or less arbitrary choices on their parts (therefore there being no 'wrong' pronoun), and also, it's always possible that an agent simply gets it wrong. Sacriligious though this may sound, Jay could've just made a 'mistake' (speaking within the fourth wall, of course).

I think it makes a lot of sense to keep it a mystery-- Agents refer to it as a he or she based on, as has been said, personal projection. It's more fun that way! It could be a soure of inter-departmental gossip, and curiosity, with the Flower itself carefully never giving unwarranted clues-- or contradictory clues. I like the idea of the Flowers being mostly amused by our need to assign gender to them.

On the Wiki: agreed.

Would just like to say that at times it is hard to log in. For instance, I've made several visits to the wiki in the past week or so where the log in button simply disappears after the page has loaded.

--

I've noticed people get quite upset when someone has made changes to a page they consider their own. Isn't the point of the wiki that others can change those pages too?

If you don't want anonymous users to change the wiki then have the whole thing looked for registered users only, like the front page is.

Kudzu is a member of the Fabaceae family, which tend to be hermaphroditic - thus, the Kudzu could be either or both. It could change personas to deal with different agents, it could simply not care about pronouns, or it could have gotten bored with being make at some point in the past.

On the side of the Agents and Boarders.

While person Y might think "Oh, this Flower is definitely a male" person Z might privately think that that Flower seems to be more a female to them. Since as far as I can tell, we pretty much assign the gender pronouns we use for each Flower somewhat randomly, going by whatever whoever wrote it first concluded when they first started that character.

It could always depend on the personalities of the Flowers themselves, as well, if they notice or mind our silly use of gender pronouns for all of them. I'd suspect, for one, that while the poor Daisy would really care either way, the Marquis or the S.O. might flutter their petals in annoyance at being called female or a 'she', and I suspect the Queen Anne's Lace wouldn't exactly be amused either at being called a 'he' as well.

In short, I don't see anything wrong with you referring to the Kudzu in your work as a 'she', while the use of 'he' is notable in TOS.

We're anthropomorphizing flowers after all, and the key thing to that is perception and opinion- which could always lead to a hilarious moment in a spin off, if two groups who have different opinions on what gender certain flowers are met and argued about it-, and it's not there aren't other spinoffs that ignore things set as 'canon' by Jay and Acacia.



______________


On the subject of the Wiki, I agree that people seriously, seriously, need to log in or at least state who they are when editing to prevent people from thinking it's trolling or otherwise. It's not very hard to put a wrong fact in somewhere and have people be fooled by it. That should also go for people who use different usernames on the wiki as compared to the board, so they can be recognized as not a random person editing the whole thing into their private view.

After a while I sorta started taking for granted that I was, but it still logs me out at random. Anyway, I'll not vote because I've caused enough trouble with this already; was just stating why I wasn't logged in.

Forgot to put "Ollivanders" up there.

...Spend hours and hours trawling the Pit looking for a fic that matches these exact criterion, then be dissapointed when it's actually a mediocre piece of fiction, OR you can write it yourself, save some time, and post it for people who decide to try the first option. Your choice.

Here I quote:

"No. We're not doing either. We're writing these missions to be funny and interesting, because we are the goddamn PPC. That is the goddamn point of the entire organization, and we are missing it completely. In HQ, Rule of Funny is Word of God. Sometimes we need to be serious, but when we do we should beware of blowing this seriousness out of proportion. Angst should be kept to a minumum, and the same goes for plotline. The point of this is to have fun with the plots of badfic, not to create monolithic storylines and backstories for each individual agent. And the Grey Lady knows that we don't need a full-blown Emergency to write a decent fight scene."

A-men!

...To the oldbies, (especially Sedri) for bringing this topic up again, and to the newbies, for making them bicker like...something that bickers a great deal. I would also like to issue a personal apology to MAXinsanity, whom I appear to have accidently made the object of a positively itinerant hate-fest. Again. (I would also like to apologize to any and all grammarians who are shuddering at my horrible use of the word 'itinerant'. But, y'know, if they didn't want anybody to misuse it, they shouldn't have made the word sound so damn nice. Who 'they' are, I have no idea.)

Where was I...? Ah, yes. The whole cycle theory thing touched a nerve with me. I was so ticked off that I didn't bother to wonder if the article was a sarcastic one or not, or check when it was last updated to make sure that I wasn't beating a dead horse.

Overthinking things as usual, EBW

What you're describing is essentially the same issue as came up late last year, when there was a rather tense conflict on the Board and the oldbies collectively put their foot down on the entire Emergencies problem - it's also why I wrote the Guide To The PPC, which has an entire section on exactly this issue.

I really hope this debate doesn't start up again, because frankly, we've heard it before. In short, everyone's keeping an eye out for missions and other writings that are losing the PPC 'spirit' and becoming too powerful, particularly the PGs when they give Permission. We're being vigilant. Within the word world, most agents do not have access to these powerful tools anyway, and those who do and abuse the use of them tend to be singled out by the Flowers for brain-breaking assignments. It's now they keep order in HQ.

Also, I might point out that the Cycle Theory article hasn't been updated for almost a year, which is before all this began, so strictly speaking, it's out of 'date' with regards to this particular discussion. Let me also quote the editing note made when the page was first created:

"Because if there's one thing the PPC needs, it's another insane theory."

To me, that seems to imply that only the insane agents (in fact, only ONE agent - Sambar of Finance) who believe in said theory. I doubt it's therefore something that should be taken very seriously, let alone be the cause of a Board-wide dispute.

- Sedri, wearing her Boarder Hat


Also, I would ask you to kindly tone down your 'rant' next time something upsetting comes up. Calm down before you post and please present it as an argument for discussion rather than throwing around final statements like "it is _!" and "it wouldn't work", which leave no room for opinion and can hurt people's feelings.

- Sedri, wearing her Relative-Oldbie and Hopefully-Respect-Worthy-PG Hat

Have you been reading recent missions? It's evident that most people agree with you.

Recent agents don't have TARDISes; nor do they use Mass Neuralyzers; and it doesn't make sense that they should. Nobody else liked being overpowered, either.

Why? Simple: Glitter levels. An overly powerful PPC agent ends up Sued, and then their own partner (or the DIO, which doesn't exist) has to take them out. It's not fun, and while it's "never happened", we don't want it to ever happen. It's not necessarily even the way that most agents would want it; very few agents are actually sociopathic enough to want to go killing at random without checking first to see that their target is a personality-free, canon-destroying Sue. And that means they'd prefer that other agents not go on killing sprees, either.

The agents need to keep their distance from the canons, sure; but the SEP fields and the constant presence of a partner are usually enough to ensure that. Equally dangerous would be keeping too much distance from the canons--too much distance to care about the characters, understand the continuum, or notice the small details that can be crucial on a mission.

On the writer's side, we don't want our agents to be overly powerful, either, because it's no longer fun to write for them. It's like having Superman as your main character; only he lives in a world where the worst crimes are purse-snatchings and shoplifting and nobody ever thought of becoming a supervillain. In a word: Boring.

Bringing in the big guns isn't necessary unless it's absolutely warranted. That's one of the reasons why I think the PPC should continue to maintain, and train pilots for, Sun Crushers. There will always be sci-fi continua in which the fangirls will write extracanonical solar systems; and there has to be a way to deal with them. But Sun Crushers are no good for any other purpose. With a few hundred agents (give or take a few thousand) who are all dedicated to protecting their favorite continua, there's absolutely no way the PPC will go back to just blowing up any planet with a Sue on it. Would you like it if they blew up Middle-earth because it was such a Sue magnet? Do I hear the phrase "over my dead body"? Thought so.

The Mass Neuralyzer, however, seems to be something that probably isn't a good idea. Yes, it's efficient; but it's impersonal, and you're likely enough to accidentally neuralyze someone hiding outside the radius of your vision. Consider the scenario: You're in Rivendell and you've just neuralyzed the entire Fellowship with a Mass Neuralyzer. Your neuralyzer flash was seen through the window by five Random Elves and Bilbo Baggins. They now all think they are part of the Fellowship. Is this good for canon? Nope.

What I do disagree with, though, is the idea that we shouldn't be writing stories that flesh out our agents' personalities, or writing stories that have a plot beyond just "See badfic, see Sue, kill Sue". Plot and characterization are both good. The PPC is not MSTing; if you want to just spork badfic, plot-free, you should be writing an MST. Your characters should be realistic people, and the reader should care what happens to them. That doesn't mean you have to pile on the melodrama. When I say "plot", I'm talking about things like someone getting hurt, or the Sufficiently Advanced Technology frizting out, or the Warrior!Sue turning out to be a little too Warrior-y for the agents' taste. Things should happen other than just sporking the plot of the badfic. Large-scale emergencies? No. But bringing in another agent pair for backup, or having a food fight in the Cafeteria, or RPing a romance with another agent? Not Emergency material.

I can see your points, and they're quite valid...

... And I kind of agree with you on them. Some of the things we're putting into our PPC stories aren't funny and/or interesting, they're downright stupid, lazy and cheap. It's almost like we've started defiling our own writing, our own canon, our own characters just to protect the things we love. It's disgusting in my opinion, and this is coming from the guy who can't write humor for his life!

I haven't been here in this community for long, and I already see that we're losing what our whole point was originally. We've became kind of divided, with some people still in it mostly for fun and laughs, just trying to have a good time more than anything else, but with others taking this more seriously and trying to explain and expand the fictional universe of the PPC because it means something personal to them somehow. (I'm one of the latter, mostly because I've ended up becoming attached to my agents despite not even getting permission yet, but also because I don't really write humor to begin with). There isn't anything wrong with either in moderation, but it seems that there's a lot more of the second group now than the first one than there used to be.

What we need to find is balance. Not too serious, but not too funny either. What we are is lost, incapable of realizing that we're tearing our whole beloved fictional world apart because we're trying to resist change a bit too much to be healthy. We're attempting to enforce both canon and quality, but we've leaked into enforcing what we think is bad a little as well. This is kind of visible on the wiki, as well. A (possibly somewhat bad) example is on the Pokemon page. Look under the "Sue types" section and you'll see that pokemorphs are for some reason grouped up in there despite there actually being some good 'morph characters out there if you look hard enough. Yes, 90 percent of them are canon defiling, biology defying wrecks that deserve to die by (insert hilarious method of execution here), but just because someone writes an idea that's been done horribly over and over and over doesn't mean that the character is immediately a sue. There's using an overused idea poorly, and there's using it right despite everyone else expecting something horrible just because everyone else is using it badly. Kind of getting a little off topic here, though, so I'm gonna stop ranting.

...Or maybe I'm just rambling on again because I see another wall of text, and my brain wants to make another wall. I dunno, it's kind of hard to tell. Hopefully I wrote all this to get a valid point across, because I can't tell any more.

I believe drawing attention to all of that was the point of the article, actually. In my opinion, it's satire at its finest. {= )

But rest easy--we're not moving in that direction as much as you may think. If you look at the bulk of recently-released missions, I think you'll find they're all nicely low-tech and amusing to some degree, and no emergencies. {= )

~Neshomeh

Have a Dalek statue.

Have a gun. With those nasty Sues around, soon you'll want to kill one.

A fellow Who fan, I presume?
Anyway, have a pet cat. You may name him whatever you wish.

I do hope you enjoy your stay in our esteemed community. To help keep you company, here's a venomous arthropod! (I'll let you pick what kind.)

It's actually a perfectly normal, tasty truffle. This is possibly the strangest thing about my gift.

Anyway, welcome! I see you've already been given The Links, so I'll just nudge you a but closer towards them because they really are Important, and resist the temptation to snitch your gift-truffle back and eat it myself ;p

Nice to meet you :)

Feel free to sic her on Sues, intruders, and siblings!

Have an eyas! (That's a baby hawk. Don't worry, it has parental permission.) Feed it Generic Meat, Sues, and CAFs.

Welcome to the Board. I hereby give you a Frying Pan of DOOM^tm and a freshly baked batch of brownies, courtesy of Agents Keaton and Nahinu of RC 6237.

Feed it only Generic Meat.

I am Barid, but you may call me Barid. It is a pleasure to meet you.

I give you an original NES, complete with Duck Hunt and the Zapper Lightgun. Enjoy.

Welcome, newbie! Here, have some chocolate, and enjoy your stay!

Fair winds!

*pokes*

Welcome! I see you've found the most important thing, which is the Original Series, but allow me to draw your attention to some other pages of secondary-but-still-important importance:

1. Da Rules, a.k.a. the Board Constitution, which we all must follow if we hope to get along and not succumb to the nastiness which consumes other message boards. (The fact that we're still here probably says something about its efficacy.)

2. The PPC Board FAQ, which will help you work with this unusual message board.

3. The Permission article on the wiki, in case you're interested in writing your own PPC spin-off.

4. There is no number four.

5. The Guide to the PPC, the FAQ: For Newbies, and the Mission Writing Guide, for many of the same reasons as listed above.

And that should about do for a start. However, if you're interested in reading more spin-offs, the Complete List of PPC Fiction and the Killed Badfic pages are good places to start.

Enjoy!

~Neshomeh

Here, have a lead-filled baseball. It can be used as a paperweight or a weapon.
Now, since you're new here...hang on a sec *pops into a hole, pops back up with an enourmous bag* Here they are! *mumbles* Keep forgetting where I put these--LINKS!
You've already found the PPC wiki, so no need for that one. Then: The Orignal Series (which you've already read, but eh..). These are the stories of the original PPC agents, who were here from the beginning. Here are the missions of Trojie and Pads--they have one of the longest mission lists in the PPC, besides IndeMaat who recently hit 50. And finally, my favorite: The OFUM, and others . They're some wonderful stories by people who are pissed off at other writers who've been dicking around without all the cards in different fandoms. Some of them are funny, some of them are memorable, and some... well... Eh.
Anyways, enough links (although I do suggest you read the PPC Constitution and the Rules [found at the top of the page when you enter this site] every so often. I had a little problem a while back, 'cause I took someone else's posts a little to seriously...hehe.)
Anywho, enjoy your stay here, and abandon your sanity. Have a bucket or three for whatever sanity you wish to deposit for your stay with us (I guarentee you won't need it; I never had any to begin with!)

-Honu_Wahine

Here, take this bomb that's just about to go off-

JUST KIDDING! Here, have this unspecific person/place/thing instead! I don't give these out often because of what people use them for, but here!

Hello! Have a seventeen foot long, multicolored, wool, knit scarf (curly wig not included), and a bag of jelly babies.

Please use them IRresponsibly.

This is a rather old style Board, there are no categories, and once thing drop off the first page they are rarely heard from again. Posting new replies does not bring them back to the top.

People will be along shortly with bumper stickers, links, strange gifts, and a bucket in which to place your sanity. Fun, fun, fun!

So, what are your fandoms?

I know the feeling, my humour has two settings: "Snark" and "Dead Babies". Neither of which are that good for lighthearted fun-poking.
Most of what I read being serious Sci-fi or Fantasty doesn't help too much either.

This is the reason there were four years between the time I joined and the time I wrote my first actual PPC story. {= p

I know what you mean about Discworld, too--I tend to mimic the style of things I've just read. Hence, there are times I can spot definite Pratchettian moments in my writing, and other spots are more Tolkien-esque. It's a little weird.

However, there are a few things I've noticed over the years, and maybe they'll help. The main thing is to get as specific as you can when describing things. Don't say "it was totally bizarre" when you can say "it was like a duck trying to tap-dance while bouncing on a trampoline." ... I have no idea what that description might apply to, but I'm pretty sure somebody somewhere will giggle when they read it, because it's ridiculous, and ridiculous is funny.

Another thing is timing, and that's hard to control in writing. You have to direct your readers' eye to see what you want when you want for maximum impact, like a comedian building up for the punchline. If you slip and reveal the punch during the setup, it's not funny anymore.

There is also exaggeration/hyperbole, either in the over-the-top sense or in vast understatement. Using these two things (with specific description) to create contrast can also work. We're pretty well wired to respond to contrast, so that's really a separate tip unto itself. That's why having "odd couple" agents works so well.

And that's all I can think of at the moment. For a study in the art of awesomely amusing PPCs, I recommend the works of Tungsten_Monk, now available here on the PPC Lost Tales archive.

~Neshomeh

I'm pretty humor impaired too, perhaps even more than you. It's something I've never really understood well...

Yeah.

You don't have to use giggle-humour to make others laugh - a well-placed dry or sarcastic comment could do the same. Also, if you (or your characters) take everything Utterly Seriously, it could work out to be amusing, too. Of course, it won't always, so I suppose that in itself is not much help.

...I think your remark about about Discworld is pretty humorous in itself.
As a formerly humour-impaired one myself, the best thing to do in my opinion is resort to sarcasm... It's not the best approach to make new friends, but it's exceptional for entertaining existing friends or, in cases like this one, to make readers laugh (or at least I laugh at sarcastic remarks).

I didn't even do anything - it just fixed itself. Strange. Thanks, guys.

But I'd have to check the Wayback thingy to know for sure, and I'm far too busy avoiding other responsibilities at the moment.

Or at least, I have a clue. The Star Trek wiki has suddenly been changed to the same blue-theme, too, and it used to be black - part of it still is, which makes me think the wiki server has made some sort of change to all its users.

That, or maybe it's just me, somehow. Tech wizards, tell me - could this be a setting on my computer that I somehow tripped by accident? No other webpages I've visited have been affected, and I know enough about computer software to know I didn't change a setting manually.

Hello! Have a seventeen foot long, multicolored, wool, knit scarf (curly wig not included), and a bag of jelly babies.

Please use the IRresponsibly!

I liked your mission.

What an awful Sue.

Feed it only Generic Meat. Or Honey.

Your characters have a dynamic about them that is wonderful to read. The scene near the lake is particularly enjoyable.

Fair winds!

on the mission. And heh, have a cookie for getting writing again. and may all your sues fall easily.

Though I too would like to know the fandom. If it's Cardcaptor, I'm good, but I won't be good for fandom-related things for most other manga/animes. On the other hand, that's not really what you need, so it's all good. -grins-

How are you going to send it? You may already have my email, but I can give it to you again if you like.

--anamia

Okay, I'll give it a go. What fandom is it, please?

I didn't mean your English is weird. I meant the English language itself is weird, and difficult to learn. I'm sorry if that was confusing. ^_^;

~Neshomeh

Gah... just... GAH! That's NOT a mental I ever wanted to have! Thanks for slaying it, in more ways than one.

This was a really funny mission to read, especially considering the fic they were targeting.

I like the Bleep experiments.

Two. WHAT.


*deep, calming breath* Thank you for killing this one. Dear god, two...

I've got a compact Canon, it's good for close range stuff, but if you want good photos at any range of any subject, splash out and get a big Nikon DSLR

Canon is always best. :-P

This has no bearing on actual consumer electronics, I just couldn't resist...

But what are the circumstances, and why exactly do you need to know?

You can use Winston. Chliever isn't allowed in any of HQ's eating establishments except the Cafeteria, and that's only because he couldn't possibly make the food any worse.

... since it's post-Crashing Down, Ontic's back on the scene. She doesn't really have a job to do, and she's got a lot of guilt weighing on her head, so she drinks rather a lot. She's pretty quiet and keeps to herself, though, but is likely to be found in the corner of a pub nursing a glass of something. She'd also be wearing her black sweatshirt with a grey bar running across the chest; subtle, she ain't.

hS

(PS: I'm sort of back online, sort of not. We'll see where I get to)

…in her slain double's body and with all subconscious commands removed. Oh, and Melpomene is there with her rookie partner Fearn, a strategist New Paradigm Dalek (with the Human Factor, like all Dalek Agents) whom she is currently owning at Xiangqi.

You can use Kestrel and Mordecai. Kestrel is a female ferret (about the equivalent of seventeen years old) from Redwall, with a very heavy vermin accent. Mordecai, or Cai, is a Potterverse wizard of Chinese descent, about twenty-ish.

It wouldn't be realistic to have my Agents there (Leila doesn't drink and Julius mixes his own) but if you could make the bartender Haitian or Jamaican I would be very much obliged. I'm looking to do something similar, I already have a character drawn out, and it's rather unlikely that there'd be two pubs in HQ, yes?

... at your own risk.

Let's see... you can definitely borrow this new pair of mine who showed up as guest stars for a plot point and now won't leave me alone.

There's Abeni (who is seventeen, female, and the laid-back, happy-go-lucky sort, and who probably just got some kind of normal World One cocktail, something with rum in it, most likely), and her partner Nikator, whom she'd say she dragged along to come have fun for once in his life, though he'd say he's keeping an eye on her.

If physical appearance is important, Abeni has short, slightly curly dark hair and very dark skin, and Nikator looks more or less like your average Romulan, although he hasn't kept his hair quite as neat as his fellows back in the Trekverse. He might be drinking Romulan Ale, or he might have got something entirely different out of curiosity.

You can use some of my agents, if you want. Danny would be sipping a gin and tonic and reading something (Wodehouse, perhaps, or maybe Hunter Thompson) in a quiet corner. Laura would not be there, however, as she doesn't drink. She might show up to tell Danny they've got a mission, but otherwise no.

Xericka and Gremlin would probably be drinking the strongest things they could get, what with the two squicky missions (one not yet published) they did back to back. After a few mixed drinks, Gremlin would slip into 'friendly inebriated bisexual lech' mode while Xericka would become easily amused and start using contractions in her speech.

Miah and Cali could be there. They like beer. Miah might complain if only normal big American brands are available. She would drink Sam Adams Boston Lager or any other Sam Adams, really, or Bleepbeer. She always manages to have a "slept in my clothes" look about her (jeans, sneakers, and no logo t-shirt, hair in ponytail), and she is going on thirty.

Cali is in his late teens, but looks younger. He has extremely wild, bright blue hair, and never takes off his bright green rimmed, mirrored sunglasses. He wears very baggy styled pants, a long sleeved close fitting shirt, and gloves with no fingers. He's a "super" hero from Mystery Men continuum.

As long as this is going to be set sometime pretty soon, they probably smell like smoke. They might have soot smudges or even small burns-especially Cali, and they are probably making a bit of a fuss (without noticing that they are being too loud) about how they are not talking about Cali scaring the living daylights out of Miah playing super hero to pull a damned fool boy in a kilt who burned up all the furniture in the lounge out of the fire said boy (Unger) started. She may be refusing to let Cali have alcohol, as her mothering instinct is riled up; although it will be phrased sarcastically or even possibly with a bit of arm smacking level violence.

Logan is probably the most frequent at the pub (read: borderline-alcoholic) but most of ESAS would be around. The only exception is Entropy, who is no longer with us (after dying during the 2008 Macrovirus emergency).

Logan tends towards drunkeness-via-Long Island Iced Teas, which should leave plenty of scope for amusing escapades.

Elcalion

... but not S&S. I don't know how Snowspine would take to that.

When is this fic set? If it's after the Macroviruses, Foxglove will have a cybernetic eyeball, which you may need to know for descriptions. (I decided she went for something steampunky, a la Treasure Planet, but my storyline hasn't caught up with the viruses bit yet.)

... you can take Sergio Turbo and Corolla. Expecially Corolla, an ax-crazy six-inches tall fairy like girl, with a taste for Water (yes, that Water) can be useful for fun and weirdness.

However, only if you aren't going to write it in those days. My first mission is in beta status and I didn't make the Agents pages already.

...well, maybe just one. Brightbeard, a World of Warcraft Dwarf (what good is a pub without a Dwarf, right?), will gladly join in a PPC pub crawl. He drinks tankards of the strongest stuff they have.

Feel free to have both Lee and Ian for whatever you need; their info can be found here or on the Wiki.

Brian Jacques has good stuff goin' on, even if it is rather repetitive.

I liked using the sparrow girl for the snitch. Poor Stormsong.

http://chelonianmobile.deviantart.com/art/DARE-170668067

Whiskey. Tango. Foxtrot?! I think my brain just melted. And I only read the summary. W. T. F. Just...What. The hell.
I can't currently write any missions as I have a boatload of summer homework to complete, but I completely sympathize. It's not often that I find a summary that can Wait. Scratch that. I can find a lot of summaries like that. Am I the only one here who wants to bury the author in the Marianas Trench for that?
Oh Hades, someone get me a shotgun and some bleepka.

Honu_Wahine

Excellent! No, I did not go to Connecticon; couldn't get time off from work, was busy, and am busy saving for Seattle Gathering, because I have been threatened advised not to sleep under bridges.

But how was it? New Haven this year, right? Any cool people about?